New lenses for the M?

[lars_bergquist]

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There has been quite some speculation about what new optics Leica are going to give us next. I am going to add some fuel to that fire:

 

First, what I do NOT think we will see. For instance a new Noctilux. This unbeatable conversation piece is really a leftover from the age of ISO 125–200 ‘high speed films’. Today people use it (apart from conversationally) because they like its optical fingerprint, not because they need the speed. With present films, and even more with the M8, the Summilux covers all practical needs – and it is a fabulous lens. Also, the 50 mm length is a bit awkward on the digital format where 35 mm is taking its place. – The same argument holds for the 75 mm Summilux, which is obviously also on its way out; and I do not think it will have a successor. As regards a 28 mm/f:1.4 or a 24 mm/f:2, I guess they would simply be too damn big and unwieldy. Even if possible, they would be low-sale items and not very profitable. And Leica have to show a profit; the company is not in the wet dreams business.

 

Second, what I DO think we will see. This list is shorter. First, a 75 mm Elmarit. After all, the focal length is equivalent to a 100 mm lens, and while f:2 is nice to have, it is seldom very necessary. A smaller and lighter and less expensive lens would sell. Especially as we all know it would be fully useable wide open. – There is room for some new thinking around the 90 mm length. The present Elmarit is due for a successor, and this may well have macro capability, perhaps with the present adapter, reducing the lineup to two lenses. And I do think f:3.4 would be quite acceptable.

 

Third, what we would want to see … And this is of course where he discussion gets hot. But I think it will be more profitable if we try to avoid wishful thinking and keep in mind what I said above.

 

The old man from the Age of Anastigmats

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[stunsworth]

Personally I think they'll introduce a new prime wide angle - 16mm f2.8 perhaps. With the M8 the field of view has moved up, so they need something to 'replace' the existing 21mm. I know there's the wide angle tri-elmar, but not everyone needs a zoom lens, and many would prefer to be able to use the existing 21mm viewfinder rather than the Frankenstein creation that is used with the WATE.

[andit]

Here's an other thought for a new Leica lens.

 

How about a 9mm f/4.0 Elmar wide angle with viewfinder attachment?. This would give an equivalent FOV of 12mm. CV is doing very well with their 12mm (albeit the same as 16mm on M8). I seem to recall someone posting examples taken with a 9mm lens in one of the threads. Would be great to have an affordable Leica lens in this focal length.

 

Just my 2 cents.

 

Andreas

[John Maio]

I'd love to see Leica introduce new lenses with IR filtering built-in. Lenses that would perform equally well with film OR the M8, 9 or whatever follows...

 

I know, just a dream ...

[stephengilbert]

To return to the land of the waking, I'd like to see a wide angle prime: 15mm, 2.8 or 3.5. It would be wide enough to be different, but not too wide to have a market.

 

While I'd love to use a 9mm lens, I can't imagine buying one; I don't know if I'd even pay leica prices for a 12.

 

Steve

[lars_bergquist]

Personally I think they'll introduce a new prime wide angle - 16mm f2.8 perhaps. With the M8 the field of view has moved up, so they need something to 'replace' the existing 21mm. I know there's the wide angle tri-elmar, but not everyone needs a zoom lens, and many would prefer to be able to use the existing 21mm viewfinder rather than the Frankenstein creation that is used with the WATE.

 

Steve, this is high on my ‘wanted’ list. The present WATE and Frankenfinder combo is a monstrosity. Let’s face it (or rather, let Leica face it): any superwide lens is an occasional lens, not a central piece of equipment. So, it should be handy and simple to use. In this case, Leica seem to have contracted the dreaded Zeiss Syndrome: Zo vee haff a problem? Our Herr Doktors in white coats know how to fix it once and for all and vee vill haff a Final Solution. Or for those of you who read German: Warum einfach wenn es kann so schön kompliziert sein?

 

A prime rangefinder coupled16 with a suitable bright line finder would be a true, practical Leica-like solution. And people would actually buy it and carry it, and use it.

 

The old man from the Age of Prime Lenses

[lars_bergquist]

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I'd love to see Leica introduce new lenses with IR filtering built-in. Lenses that would perform equally well with film OR the M8, 9 or whatever follows...

 

I know, just a dream ...

 

Well, why? If it is possible to put common multicoating on a front lens, to block reflexes by interference, and to put multicoating on a filter to block IR, why is it not possible to put that coating on the front lens? Putting it inside the lens is of course another matter, as much of the reflected would bounce around in the optic.

 

Oh, varying angles of incidence – but that holds for multicoated spherical surfaces too.

 

The old man from the Age of Meniscus Lenses

[luigi bertolotti]

Ehhhh, do not exaggerate.... 9 mm ? Keep in mind that I think that in the next 1-2 maybe 3 years Leica, I think, will announce M8 AND FILM Leica Lenses : a good , let's say, 15 f4 would be a nice addition, but under this... I think also that M8 customers feel 90=top length as a limit... I would not be surprised with some kind of "goggled" tele or so...

[lars_bergquist]

I would add this to Steve’ message: It is easy to dream of wondrously speedy lenses, but … If you would like a 16 mm 2.8, look at the current Zeiss lens! Even if designed by Leica, it would be a Noctilux-size, Noctilux-weight and Noctilux-priced aberration. I want something I can stash in a corner of my camera bag, and f:4 would be all right with me. In fact all I want beyond the current CV lens is a codeable M mount, rangefinder coupling and a filter thread. Period.

 

As things stand now, this is rerally a prime (!) business opportunity for Mr Kobayashi.

 

The old man from the Age of Uncoated Optics

[lars_bergquist]

Ehhhh, do not exaggerate.... 9 mm ? Keep in mind that I think that in the next 1-2 maybe 3 years Leica, I think, will announce M8 AND FILM Leica Lenses : a good , let's say, 15 f4 would be a nice addition, but under this... I think also that M8 customers feel 90=top length as a limit... I would not be surprised with some kind of "goggled" tele or so...

 

The bespectacled 135 mm Elmarit works nicely on the M8 as it uses the 90 mm frame – but it is of course very heavy and not quite modern optically. So, goggles on the Apo-Telyt, please!

 

The old man from the Age of the 135

[wparsonsgisnet]

I agree that there are formulations of the 75 and the 90 that are "old."

 

There are also other formulations of these two lengths in modern cloth, even asph and apo lenses.

 

To me, the big (did I say big?) hole is at the wide end. All you have to do to see how many lenses of each length exist is to count Guy's list of lenses.

 

Some people would even like a fast lens at the wide end.

[thpeters]

I really love to see a 15 or 16mm 2.8 lens.

Better I wait with buying the Tri-Emar and see what Leica is coming up with.

 

Theo

[Guest guy_mancuso]

I agree that there are formulations of the 75 and the 90 that are "old."

 

There are also other formulations of these two lengths in modern cloth, even asph and apo lenses.

 

To me, the big (did I say big?) hole is at the wide end. All you have to do to see how many lenses of each length exist is to count Guy's list of lenses.

 

Some people would even like a fast lens at the wide end.

 

Hey I'm down to 6 that's pretty good. LOL

 

WATE,28 cron,35,50,75 luxes and 90 apo . heck that is nothing. Want 135 apo , 90 macro,12mm and maybe a 24

 

 

What i think we will see is some lenses at affordable pricing like the new 28 2.8. The 75mm 2.8 is a good idea a nice new 90 2.8 would be good 15 or 16 f4 is needed now. These and the 28 2.8 can all be nice entry level lenses into getting people to buy into the M8 . Too me this makes some marketing sense. 15 f4 , 28 2.8 ,75 2.8 and a 90mm 2.8 than add a 50 f2 cron and you have a nice range of less expensive high quality glass

 

Than build us a fast wide angle prime, my vote is a 24 F2

[lars_bergquist]

Guy Mancuso is a very nice and knowledgeable person, but he has a quirk: he collects lenses like Imelda Marcos collected shoes ;–). Now, to reiterate: A 16 mm/2.8 would be just as monstruous as the present Zeiss 15 mm/2.8, and a 24 mm Summicron or a 28 mm Summilux are also unlikely for solid physical and financial reasons. As an old revolver artist I prefer something that is quick on the draw: gimme a prime 16 mm/4.0 with RF coupling and a filter thread or any reasonable facsimile thereof. Gimme! Gimme! Chimp want lens!

 

The old man from the Age of Bananography

[lars_bergquist]

I agree that there are formulations of the 75 and the 90 that are "old."

 

There are also other formulations of these two lengths in modern cloth, even asph and apo lenses.

 

Yes Bill, but these are big and heavy and often unnecessarily fast lenses. A 75 mm or a 90 mm Apo-Elmarit or maybe even a 90 mm Apo-Elmar would sell. Leica are in the business mainly to sell lenses. And we are in the business of photography, not that of gear-lifting.

 

Look at the success of the 28 Elmar ASPH.

 

The old man from the Age of Fixed Lenses

[Guest guy_mancuso]

Lars I did say a 15 or 16mm F4 . LOL

 

I do walk around with a wheel barrel mentality. i want them ALL.

 

 

Yes I admit I have a serious problem with Leica glass. i sit here and watch the trucks go by looking for a white truck with men all in white carrying a white jumpsuit just for me with shackles to place in a all white padded cell and just to tease me stick a red dot on the wall.

[Guest Olof]

I am sure the next lenses will be replacements for all the lenses which still arent members of the ASPH class.

 

1.4 75mm ASPH

2.0 90mm ASPH

 

2.0 50mm ASPH

 

I dont think that a 15 or 16mm lens will come to soon, because the WATE ist to new.

I could imagine that a Noctilux ASPH would come, not because anybody really need it, but its so nice for Leica to show it in their lense range.

 

I wont expect someting like a 1.4 28mm, these lense would be to big, to heavy an to expensive, and its not really neccessary.

 

AND HELLO TO LEICA, I WANT A 75mm LENSE IN CHROME !

[lars_bergquist]

Yes Guy, it was not you but Steve (and some other individuals) who said ‘16 mm/2.8’. You are not quite over the edge yet – there’s method to the madness, or perhaps a sense of the practical.

 

The old man from the Age of Kodachrome

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[James Mitchell]

I'd like to see a very compact and collapsable 75/2.8, in black and chrome, of course, with a 39mm filter thread and detachable hood.

[lars_bergquist]

Olof, the 90 mm f:2 ASPH does already exist. And Leica have done several design studies on the 50 mm Summicron and they have concluded that the improvement would not be in proportion to the investment, or to the selling price.

 

As for chrome lenses on the M8 there is a risk which is the same as with the original 1964 Leicaflex: chrome reflecting light into the external metering sensor. The chrome lenses were discontinued very quickly, so that they are now quite collectible.

 

The old man from the Age of Chromed Cameras