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Leica Summilux alt oder Nokton 1,2/35 neu?

Guest BlickDichtung

By Guest BlickDichtung
in Leica M Objektive

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Guest BlickDichtung

Guest BlickDichtung

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Moin,

ich habe ja, manche werden es wissen, bei der Rückkehr zur M9 ein ziemlich neues Nokton 1,2/35 zusammen mit der Kamera erworben.

Das ist ein schönes Objektiv, mit dessen Leistung und Abbildungsqualität ich außerordenltich zufrieden bin. Nur ist es eben doch auch etwas groß und schwer. Nun frage ich mich, ob ich mich verschlechtern würde, wenn ich es durch ein altes,1988 gebautes prä-asphärisches Summilux 1,4/35 ersetzte?

Kann mir jemand bei der Beantwortung dieser Frage mit einem Rat behilflich sein?
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Guest luitschi

Guest luitschi

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Auch wenn es 1988 gebaut wurde, die Rechnung ist von 1960. Und das sieht man! Die Offenblende ist praktisch nicht nutzbar, hinzu kommen unkontrollierbare Reflektionen. Ok, ist bei Live-view in der neuen M in Zukunft zumindest besser beherrschbar.

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teak

teak

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Das Nokton 35/1,2 liebe ich sehr, auch wenn es etwas groß und schwer ist, um es immer mitzunehmen. Ich habe mir deshalb zusätzlich ein schnuckeliges gebrauchtes Color-Skopar 35/2,5 gekauft, das zumindestens tagsüber immer dabei ist. Die hohe Lichtstärke brauche ich ja nicht immer.

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Guest BlickDichtung

Guest BlickDichtung

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Danke, habe mich auch schon entschieden, das Nokton zu behalten und das Summilux auf dem Gebrauchtmarkt zu ignorieren. :)

Ich denke, ich werde mir zusätzlich ein älteres Summicron IV gönnen. Bei Gelegenheit.
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Marignac

Marignac

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Ich käme nie auf die Idee, das Nokton wegzugeben. Ich habe parallel dazu ein Chron 35 asph, wobei ich erwäge, dieses wegen der klareren Abbildung bei Gegenlicht gegen ein Summarit oder C-Biogon zu tauschen, um gewissermaßen ein komplementäres Objektiv zu haben (Landschaft, Reise).

 

Das hat nichts mit Preisen zu tun, wohl aber mit verschiedenen Bildeingenschaften.

 

Das Nokton zeichnet wunderschön und hat mich noch nie im Stich gelassen. Wenn die zahllosen Objetkive, die ich bislang hatte, an mir vorüberziehen, dann bleiben das Nokton, das 50er Cron IV/V, ggf. das Pentax FA43 und das Tamron 28-75 wegen ihrer wunderbaren Zeichnung im Gedächtnis, wobei das Nokton mit f1.2 eben auch noch wahnsinnig lichtstark ist.

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Marignac

Marignac

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Ich pflichte dem bei. Ich hatte mein Cron 50 IV schon im DSLR Forum zum Verkauf angeboten, weil mich diese Luxerei ganz konfus gemacht hat. Um dann Klarheit zu gewinnen, bin ich in Solms vorbei gefahren, um Lux und Summarit mal genauer anzuschauen. Da gibt es diesen Hydranten gegenüber vom Eingang, der und paar andere belanglose Gegenstände da waren mein Gradmesser. Was soll ich sagen? Mein olles, wackliges Cron 50 IV hat die beiden anderen, Lux und Summarit, schicht an die Wand gespielt. Es hat einen Plastizitätscharakter, den die anderen beiden nicht erreichen. Daraufhin bin ich von der Barnack-Str. ins Gewerbegebiet in Solms gefahren, wo der CS sitzt, habe das Cron dort zum Richten abgeliefert und freue mich, es bald topfit wieder zu haben.

 

So, wie ich Dich kenne, auch Deine Begeisterung für das Nokton 35/1.2 solltest Du mit dem Cron 50 IV sehr glücklich werden!

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Marignac

Marignac

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Kann mir jemand sagen, in welchen Seriennummernbereich das Summicron 50 IV fällt?

 

Infos gibt es hier (click):

 

Current lens sold by leica today. Contrast and resolution similiar to the third version, except performance is better to the edges and flare has been reduced. Close up performance is also improved. Six elements in 4 groups. Vignetting 1.9 stops. Since 1979, the optical deisgn has remained the same, but the barrel has seen a few variations such as a focusing tab. Other variations include black finish, chrome finish, titanium finish and even a limited platinum finish. The latest variation of this model features a built-in lenshood ( from 1994-on ). Close focus to .7 meter. Serial #'s 2,909101-3,xxx,xxx. E39 Filter.

Oder hier (click):

<b>50/2 Summicron Many variations, so it can get confusing. Many consider the 50 Summicron best of all 50 mm lenses, by any manufacturer. It's the standard that other 50's are judged by.

 

  • First version 1954-1957 Collapsible chrome. A good lens, but not as good as the later lenses. EXTREMELY likely to be found with lens scratches. It has a VERY soft front coating. Likely to be encountered fogged from original owner, see Fogging. Not collapsible on M5 or CL due to meter constrictions. 7 elements, focused to 40"
  • Second version 1956-68 Rigid chrome, although a few were made in black by special order. Aesthetically a very handsome lens, sought after by shooters and collectors. This lens was tested to have the highest resolution (at the expense of some contrast) of any 50 Summicron several years ago by a Japanese photography magazine. Again, very prone to front lens scratches. For many years thought to be the same optical formula as the collapsible, recently it has been confirmed to be slightly different. Likely to be encountered fogged from original owner, see Fogging. 7 elements, focused to 40"

 

  • Third version 1956-1968 Dual Range Summicron, chrome. This is a special close focusing version of # 2 above. The 50/2 Duel Range Summicron had the highest tested resolution of any lens ever tested by the great and sadly departed American photography magazine, Modern Photography. It has the closest RF coupled focusing of any M lens. 7 elements. Most "experts" say the optical formula is the same as the rigid, but many experienced DR users claim they get different results and so believe they must be different formulas. With a flat platform for the "eyes" on the top of it's focusing barrel, the DR is not as pleasing aesthetically as the rigid. Nevertheless, the DR is very sought after by shooters. Again, very prone to front lens scratches and also fogging if bought from the original owner, see Fogging. for Pics

The 50/2 DR will probably work fine on the M6, but you must remember to mount and dismount the lens focused at infinity.
When focused near it's closest regular focusing distance, the lens will be difficult to mount OR unmount. I have reports of the DR not functioning in close up range on a M6. I am frankly unsure if these reports are due to variations with the bodies and the DR, or are the result of user error. More research will till. It seems prudent to try a DR on your M6 before you buy it.

Howard Cummer in Hong Kong reports difficulty using a 2nd series DR in close-up range on a M6 .85 # 2296539.
While he could mount the lens, if it was not focused at it's closest regular focusing distance, the close up range was inoperative due to some sort of internal body restrictions. Whether this is true of all late M6's in general, or of just the .85 model is not clear at this time. In any case, it's a good idea to try it out to be sure on your own body/lens combination.

The 50/2 DR will NOT work on a Minolta CLE
in my experience. Although the lens will mount, it will bind with the body just slightly from the infinity marking.

The DR lens has two focusing ranges, thus the brilliant name "Dual Range."
The DR can ONLY be mounted on the camera without it's "eyes." The "eyes" are a detachable viewfinder which clips onto the top of the lens and in front of the camera's rangefinder/viewfinder. They look pretty much like the viewer built into the 135/2.8 or the M3 versions of the 35/2 and 2.8. Once mounted, the closer focusing range is attained by turning the lens to it's closest normal focusing point.
Then attach the "eyes" which clip onto the lens. ONLY at this focus point can the eyes be attached and the closest focusing range attained.
THEN pull the focusing barrel out slightly, and the lens barrel can be swung over farther to the left, to get into the close focusing range. It sounds more complicated than it really is in practice.

It is worth noting that
many experienced used find the DR Summicron not only their favorite 50, but their favorite lens, period.
It has a combination of higher resolution and lower contrast and superb out of focus images.

The Earlier version
of the DR focuses to 19" and is marked in either feet or meters, but not both. It is also marked in reproduction rations from 1:15 to 1:.75. The "eyes" for these have the "condenser" trademark, inside of which is "E.

Leitz Wetzlar."

The Later version of the DR focuses to 20" and is marked in BOTH feet and meters, without the repro ratios.
The "eyes" for this version are marked "Leitz Wetzlar" without the condenser trademark. The second version also has wider and deeper knurling on the focusing ring than the previous version. I have noticed a "warmer" color of lens coating on these later DR's, but am not sure if it extends to ALL of this variety. The lens head and glass appears to be identical to the earlier version and to the rigid version, at least from the outside. The second version also has a smaller ball bearing mount for the eyes, which means the later eyes will not fit the earlier lenses, though the older eyes will fit the later lenses.

  • Fourth version 1969-1979 Black lens with no "50" on barrel, No focusing lock or lever. Generally reputed to be a notch below either of the Summicron versions before or after it. 6 elements. This and later versions focused to 28, the closest focusing RF coupled 50 after the DR."
  • Fifth version 1980-95 Black lens with "50" on barrel, reintroduced focusing lever, without built in hood. In my opinion this is a better choice in terms of handling than the built in hood version which followed it. I am a fan of both the focusing lever and the larger attachable hood. Nice lightweight lens at only 195 grams 6 elements, recomputed. Earlier lenses are Made in Canada, later Made in Germany.
  • Sixth version 1995-date Black or chrome lens with "50" on barrel and built in hood. No focusing lever. Same optical design as previous version. Weighs more at 240 grams in black. The chrome version weighs much more at 333 grams, so I would avoid it. Same optical formula as previous version.
  • In December 2001, Leica announced 500 50/2 Titanium lenses would be made to match their newly introduced limited edition .72 M6 TTL Titanium body.

</b>

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wizard

wizard

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Wobei es mich jetzt etwas wundert, dass Du zunächst das 1,2/35 Nokton durch ein kompakteres 1,4/35 Summilux ersetzen wolltest und jetzt ein Summicron IV 50 dazukommen soll. Ich hätte gedacht, Du meinst mit dem Summicron IV das 2/35, das es ja auch gibt (und es schien Dir ja um die Brennweite 35mm zu gehen).

 

Grüße,

 

Andreas

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