innerimager Posted March 14, 2007 Share #1 Posted March 14, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) On my M6 TTL, and presumably all other M's that meter, can one select intermediate setting of the shutter speeds between the set ones and get accurate exposures? The manual says not to, but a buddy who was showing me his M5 and got me going on this film path, said it was OK. Is that an M5 feature, is it, (I hope) a myth Leica promoted that one can't select intermediate speeds? I see the LED arrows move appropriately in between, it would be nice to have finer control, or am I showing my digital nature? ;>) thanks....Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted March 14, 2007 Posted March 14, 2007 Hi innerimager, Take a look here metering question. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
erl Posted March 14, 2007 Share #2 Posted March 14, 2007 I too have heard that rumour, but never needed to test it. Gain your finer control by setting your aperture in between the marked setings. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbretteville Posted March 14, 2007 Share #3 Posted March 14, 2007 Dosen't work on M7 and M8 as they have electronic shutters. Works on the other models with mechanical shutters. I've used it on the old M4-P and current M6. - C Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
innerimager Posted March 14, 2007 Author Share #4 Posted March 14, 2007 good to hear. I'm going to assume it works and see what I get, but I'm sure you folks have experience already. One wonders why the manual says that accurate exposure is only possible with shutter speeds selected as indicated/indented? The ability to get between is so valuable. Curious. best....Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gylee Posted March 14, 2007 Share #5 Posted March 14, 2007 Dosen't work on M7 and M8 as they have electronic shutters. Works on the other models with mechanical shutters. I've used it on the old M4-P and current M6. - C In aperture priority both the M7 and M8 would allow any correct shutter speed wouldn't they? It's not limited to the speeds marked on the shutter speed dial. Is there any risk of harm to the shutter using this method -- I have an MP and would like to try it to get more contol over depth of field (rather than changing the aperture I could change the shutter speed to an "in between") Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lambroving Posted March 14, 2007 Share #6 Posted March 14, 2007 The M5 is the last M which allows "accurate" in-between shutter speeds with the dial, according to Leitz/Leica. Of course, with the M7 on "Auto" using exposure lock, you can select any in-between speed you like, speed locked visible in the viewfinder. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
innerimager Posted March 14, 2007 Author Share #7 Posted March 14, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) The M5 is the last M which allows "accurate" in-between shutter speeds with the dial, according to Leitz/Leica. Of course, with the M7 on "Auto" using exposure lock, you can select any in-between speed you like, speed locked visible in the viewfinder. man, if I had known that, I probably would have gotten an M5.....Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dfbldwn Posted March 14, 2007 Share #8 Posted March 14, 2007 The M5 is the last M which allows "accurate" in-between shutter speeds with the dial, according to Leitz/Leica. Of course, with the M7 on "Auto" using exposure lock, you can select any in-between speed you like, speed locked visible in the viewfinder. My experience with an M6 Classic conforms to lambroving's description. For more information, have a look here: Leica and Rangefinders Forum: continuous speeds on M6: true or false? Scroll down to "Ben Z"'s comment, which, in my opinion, is the best informed: ...you will get intermediate speeds but there is no way to get an exact speed. You can get one or the other of the marked speeds as much as 3/4 the way between the clicks, then suddenly get an intermediate speed just before the next click. The exception is the M5... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stunsworth Posted March 14, 2007 Share #9 Posted March 14, 2007 Peter, I believe the SL works the same way. But to be honest with half stop clicks on the lenses the most your exposure should ever be out is a quarter of a stop, and will that every be an issue in practise? I'd expect the shutter tolerances to be approaching that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
innerimager Posted March 14, 2007 Author Share #10 Posted March 14, 2007 thanks all. Steve, given that the aperture adjustments are continuous it's even better in terms of exposure accuracy, I just like "total control" of all the variables, , that's why I'm going manual in the first place. I'll live, happily, with the M6 limitation here, but wish it was like it's bigger brother the M5. Hell, I'll probably end up with a beat up M5 just for this, who am I kidding. ;>) best....Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimF Posted March 15, 2007 Share #11 Posted March 15, 2007 I can't see why you're placing so much importance on this. Any M camera has an infinitely adjustable aperture, so an infinitely adjustable shutter is of less imortance than it might be if that were not the case. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
innerimager Posted March 16, 2007 Author Share #12 Posted March 16, 2007 Tim- Yeah, as I said, the continuously adjustable aperture does meet the need, I just like having both shutter and aperture under maximum control as with the M5. best....Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean-Michel Komarnicki Posted March 16, 2007 Share #13 Posted March 16, 2007 Interesting replies. You may also ponder the relationship betwen the shutter speed indicated on the dial and the actual speed. They are usually pretty close to each other, and that is certainly good enough, but I doubt that anyone using a hand camera such as a Leica needs to worry about getting the exposure down to one-tenth of an f-stop. The internal meter on the M6 and later M's gives a very nice approximation of the required exposure (you gauge the triangles' intensity with you eye, not with a fine needle over a precise scale). Get it close, press the shuter, move on to the next image. Enjoy making the images. Jean-Michel Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted March 16, 2007 Share #14 Posted March 16, 2007 I have M2 and M4 and on both of them I tried to set intermediate times in the high speed range (> 1/50) : shutter fires, time is inpredictible... instructions do not mention this capability... at the end... better to "intermediate-setting" on the lens aperture. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
innerimager Posted March 16, 2007 Author Share #15 Posted March 16, 2007 I am sure that it won't show in any images, but I did find a dinged up by tested to be accurate in all functions M5 for under $600 and grabbed it, just to have the ability to set shutter anywhere I want, as well as see the speed in the finder. The cool analogue metering scale doesn't hurt either. best.....Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gberger Posted March 17, 2007 Share #16 Posted March 17, 2007 If you're shooting slides, use an incident meter. With an M6, set the shutter speed and use an incident meter (such as a Sekonic 308) to determine aperature setting. You'll be almost "right on" most of the time, as the M4 -M6 shutters are reasonably accurate. With the M7, you get a doggone accurate shutter speed. So, set the shutter speed, use an incident meterto set aperature, and you'll get slides that are almost always accurately exposed. IMO, if you're using the built-in reflective meter on an M6, just set the shutter speed and use the aperature setting to set exposure. For the M7, just set the aperature you want, and the continuously variable shutter speed (using AE) will provide excellent slides. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
innerimager Posted March 17, 2007 Author Share #17 Posted March 17, 2007 Interesting and timely post George. I have this new M6 TTL, but the AE of the M7 with that very accurate continuous shutter (in AE) is very tempting. I talked to the store from which I got the M6 and they will take it back in exchange for an M7 or MP. I'm leaning toward making the banged up M5 my "all manual exposure" camera, and getting an M7 for my regular use film camera. thanks....Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob_x2004 Posted March 17, 2007 Share #18 Posted March 17, 2007 just set the aperature you want, and the continuously variable shutter speed (using AE) will provide excellent slides. Except...sometimes you dont because perfect exposure might compromise an appropriate shutter speed for the situation. You would be surprised how often. I lost more shots to R9 exposure than I ever did to manual R6.2 The R9 was the reason I went MP rather than M7. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
innerimager Posted March 17, 2007 Author Share #19 Posted March 17, 2007 Rob- Since the shutter speed is read out, isn't it simple and fast enough to see that it's not what you want and adjust aperture till you get the speed you want? This would not seem to me to be a reason to go with the MP or stick to manual exposure. More would be to never let the camera make a poor decision based on lighting characteristics. best....Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gberger Posted March 17, 2007 Share #20 Posted March 17, 2007 Rob - Regardless of whether it's an MP, an M7, or an R series - - - if you're using the built-in reflective meter rather than an external incident meter, you can end up with different exposure results. You really have to learn the quirks and limitations of the reflective meter, and the exposure determined by a reflective meter can change with the length and acceptance angle of the lens mounted on the camera. With print film, the variations caused by metering techniques can be corrected with Photoshop (or by the Fuji Frontier teccie). For original positive slides for projection, it's better to strive for accuracy before pressing the shutter release. There's one situation where the incident meter zonks out and you need the reflective meter in the camera - - - shooting stained glass windows while you're IN the church or cathedral. < grin > Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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