chrism Posted July 21, 2012 Share #141 Posted July 21, 2012 Advertisement (gone after registration) Jeez - I had no idea my original post would spawn such a storm of hatred and discontent! Sorry, everyone! Yes, there we all were, experiencing the usual peace and harmony for which all Leica forums are renowned, our hearts full of love for our fellow photographers (especially the ones who disagree with us about some arcane and minor piece of gear or technique) and you had to mess it all up. Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted July 21, 2012 Posted July 21, 2012 Hi chrism, Take a look here Quote of the decade about film vs. digital. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Stealth3kpl Posted July 21, 2012 Share #142 Posted July 21, 2012 Jeez - I had no idea my original post would spawn such a storm of hatred and discontent! Sorry, everyone! It's because some won't accept that digital is horrible. (......sound of door slamming and running footsteps) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
azzo Posted July 21, 2012 Share #143 Posted July 21, 2012 Yeah. ... All I said was, ''chimping!'' throughout this whole thread and all .... EDIT - Maybe, the timing wasn't right or was it? ... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealth3kpl Posted July 21, 2012 Share #144 Posted July 21, 2012 I know we are just joking really about all this digital vs film stuff as each has their place just like rangefinder vs slr. For some reason (actually I know the reason: it was an incredible ebay bargain) I bought a Ricoh GXR with M mount. Even as it was winging its way to me I was wondering why I'd bought it and where it would fit in with my photography. I feel like I've cheated on my wife! I suppose I was curious about its use, whether I'd like it, whether it would be a credible alternative to my film Ms, perhaps a useful adjunct to them for indoor, lowlight photography on trips etc. Well, I know it's early days but, whereas I like knowing that the focus is accurate, it really brought home to me how much I love the simplicity of the M cameras with film. Being able to walk down the street with a sense of what aperture/shutter combination will be adequate, and having confidence in that. Also, the simplicity of having just 2 dials to think about to set the camera prior to focusing - lightning fast. Thinking about an image rather than wondering about the camera's settings; how to get rid of such a display; what iso is in use etc. It's the first time since getting rid of an M8.2 that I've found myself thinking if I were to get another digital to replace my film Ms it really is likely to be a Leica digital. I would hate to see an M10 with all these bells and whistles of modern digital cameras. Their strength is their simplicity. How I love film! Pete Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
traveler_101 Posted July 21, 2012 Share #145 Posted July 21, 2012 I have limited experience with b&w film--just got started a couple of years ago and it took me a long time to finally start developing rolls myself. Just got done scanning Fomapan 100 in Rodinal. Wow! Been working with TriX and TMax in D-76. Man, I'm thrilled: everything from the cameras (Bessa T & IIIf) to the processing. It's nothing like digital which I still use for certain purposes. The most ridiculous thing is for digital to try to ape film looks--and they will never get the flexibility of film. Just the views of a novice . . . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
azzo Posted July 22, 2012 Share #146 Posted July 22, 2012 Serious question. .. Would anyone who shoots digital have peace of mind if there was no screen at the back of the camera? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildlightphoto Posted July 22, 2012 Share #147 Posted July 22, 2012 Advertisement (gone after registration) Serious question. .. Would anyone who shoots digital have peace of mind if there was no screen at the back of the camera? I find the ability to review exposures to be very valuable, even if only to avoid clipping highlights. Many of my subjects have white plumage or pelts and the optimum exposure is often the one that puts the most light on the recording medium while retaining detail in the whites. Reviewing the histogram from a few test exposures allows me to fine-tune the exposure. It doesn't have to be on the back of the camera; it could be in the viewfinder for all I care. For all practical purposes I'm using the histogram applied to a small portion of the test image as a very narrow-angle spot meter. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
azzo Posted July 22, 2012 Share #148 Posted July 22, 2012 That does not answer my question. ... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildlightphoto Posted July 22, 2012 Share #149 Posted July 22, 2012 That does not answer my question. ... Peace of mind yea or nay doesn't enter my thought process. I find it a useful tool. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
azzo Posted July 22, 2012 Share #150 Posted July 22, 2012 Peace of mind yea or nay doesn't enter my thought process. I find it a useful tool. But, would you still shoot digital without the screen and not being a 100% sure/safe of what you're getting? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildlightphoto Posted July 22, 2012 Share #151 Posted July 22, 2012 But, would you still shoot digital without the screen and not being a 100% sure/safe of what you're getting? "Digital" is too broad a category, just as "film" is. I would use the DMR even without the screen instead of an E6 film in a Leicaflex SL. Make the digital camera a CaNikon and it might be a different answer. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
azzo Posted July 22, 2012 Share #152 Posted July 22, 2012 ... .. Make the digital camera a CaNikon and it might be a different answer. That's what I wanted to hear, thank you. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealth3kpl Posted July 22, 2012 Share #153 Posted July 22, 2012 Highlights was the thing that brought me back to film. Not worrying about them and just "exposing correctly" for whatever I want "exposed correctly" is the wonderful thing about film. Pete Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CalArts 99 Posted July 22, 2012 Share #154 Posted July 22, 2012 Serious question. .. Would anyone who shoots digital have peace of mind if there was no screen at the back of the camera? I never look at the screen. I'd actually prefer if there was no screen on the back of the M9. I admit I have looked at the histogram on occasion but only when I remembered it was there. I have auto review mode turned off on the M9. The same goes when I need to use a DSLR. I also use the Nikon D3s as if it were a film camera without a screen. It has a bright 100% viewfinder that I like using. I find that concentrating on the subject matter at hand and thinking ahead about the next potential frame takes up all my attention. I never can quite remember that I could actually look at the screen and see the image I just made. But I'm not so sure how it would help me. Everything in front of the camera is taking place and the point of using the M is that I can see what's happening through the RF window and with my other (open) eye. I also still use 4x5 sheet film but I rarely ever used Polaroid for proofing. But I think digital (Hasselblad or Phase One, etc.) would be quite beneficial for still life type studio work. That's where I probably would take advantage of having a review screen and live view. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanG Posted July 22, 2012 Share #155 Posted July 22, 2012 Not meaning to drift into quibbling, but Lewis' technique was not new, and he did not patent it. See Paul Roos' U.S. Patent 2,698,356. I didn't say he invented the idea of using video along with film. But Lewis was the first to employ the method on a major film. Eventually this became a pretty standard practice. As for using an LCD... there are numerous ways that using this can be advantageous. But there is nothing forcing you to look at it all of the time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealth3kpl Posted July 22, 2012 Share #156 Posted July 22, 2012 I never look at the screen. How do you manage? I used to shoot raw and would expose as close to the right as possible without blowing highlights. Some can be clawed back with a raw converter but there are limits. It also introduces changes to the image that need to be addressed with some other aspect of the raw converter. What's the trick to being able to use a digital camera like a film camera? Pete Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted July 22, 2012 Share #157 Posted July 22, 2012 Serious question. .. Would anyone who shoots digital have peace of mind if there was no screen at the back of the camera? I would be happy to do without it, however I don't know how one would manage menu options. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealth3kpl Posted July 22, 2012 Share #158 Posted July 22, 2012 I would be happy to do without it, however I don't know how one would manage menu options. What's the trick to being able to use a digital camera like a film camera? Pete Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
adan Posted July 22, 2012 Share #159 Posted July 22, 2012 What's the trick to being able to use a digital camera like a film camera?Pete 1. Lower-contrast "Mandler" lenses. Not really a joke - even in my film days, I noticed a huge jump in the scanability of my slides and B&W negs when I compared 1980's M lenses to the contrasty Zeiss/Contax lenses I was using. Thus began the journey... 2. NOT exposing "to the right". Exposing for the highlights, as I did with slide film. Except that with digital, I can "develop for the shadows" accordingly, something hard to do with chromes except after the fact in scanning. Bracketing exposures, if the subject allows and the light is tricky. 3. The usual amount of localized "developing" and tone control (dodging and burning) - something I've done with film more or less since I first picked up a Diana in a high school art class. "I try to control the print so the eye zeroes in on the things I deem most important. You have to do that. Film doesn't understand what the picture is all about. Its total range is so truncated compared to human vision that compensates all the time..." - Paul Fusco (LOOK Magazine and Magnum), Masters of Contemporary Photography - The Photo Essay, 1974. Samples, part of an upcoming essay on the ruins of a WWII internment camp for Japanese Americans in Colorado. M9, 21 Elmarit pre-ASPH and 35 Summicron pre-ASPH. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/183405-quote-of-the-decade-about-film-vs-digital/?do=findComment&comment=2068784'>More sharing options...
wildlightphoto Posted July 22, 2012 Share #160 Posted July 22, 2012 Highlights was the thing that brought me back to film. Not worrying about them and just "exposing correctly" for whatever I want "exposed correctly" is the wonderful thing about film.Pete It was a certain way to blow out highlights for me. This persistent "film vs. digital" question / debate is completely off-base. It makes a catchy sound bite but it's an irrelevant question. The relevant questions include but are not limited to: color or monochrome ISO gradation tonal range artifacts wanted artifacts tolerated image detail processing facilities all dependent on individual needs, wants and resources. Put-downs of someone who prefers the "other side" are pointless and suggest insecurity with one's own choice. I do not use digital to emulate film. I do not use film to emulate digital. I use whatever tools and techniques at my disposal that will result in the images I envisioned. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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