Jeff S Posted May 14, 2012 Share #301 Â Posted May 14, 2012 Advertisement (gone after registration) I can only hope we are not on the verge of seeing Leica Express or Leica JR... Â Some already think of the Summarit M line this way....inappropriately so. Â Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted May 14, 2012 Posted May 14, 2012 Hi Jeff S, Take a look here New Summicron. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
k-hawinkler Posted May 14, 2012 Share #302 Â Posted May 14, 2012 It's essential to cool the billets of glass slowly and evenly so as to avoid stress in the glass that would distort the elements as they were ground. How long that takes depends among other things on the size of the billets and (I suspect) the size and shape of the elements that will be cut from them. This story suggests that the billet for the 200 inch mirror at Mount Palomar was cooled over more than a year - and that glass was chosen for its low coefficient of expansion, not for its optical properties - so I can easily imagine a more modest lump of fancy optical glass having to be cooled gradually over many weeks. Â Â In fact, the first piece of glass for the 200 inch mirror at Mount Palomar cracked after several months of cooling down. The story is that rather than moving that hunk of glass Corning built a museum around it. I have been in the glass museum in Corning a number of times. It's the most amazing collection of glass objects anywhere, from art to utilitarian, having on display examples from thousands of years of glass making. I highly recommend a visit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted May 14, 2012 Share #303 Â Posted May 14, 2012 It is also possible that to consistently exploit the apo summicron would need a perfectly adjusted RF system, or high magnification live view for focusing (again the tripod). Â .... H Or wait a few monts for the M10... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
k-hawinkler Posted May 14, 2012 Share #304 Â Posted May 14, 2012 Or wait a few monts for the M10... Â Â Or use one of the mirror less cameras with short register distance like Sony NEX, Ricoh, or Fuji with an adapter now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TshawM8 Posted May 14, 2012 Share #305 Â Posted May 14, 2012 That's just not accurate. The cost is higher for several of the larger 0.95 Noctilux elements, due in no small part to the long cycle time to cool the glass, but to say the quality is entirely different (and by different I take it you mean "better") than the lux is wrong. Â You sir, are wrong. A Leica employee had stated to me, in person, that the lengths Leica goes through in order to ensure as near to perfect glass as possible in a Noctilux 50mm are entirely different than a Summilux 50mm. In addition, if a flaw is found in an element they remake that element. Â I can only suspect that they do the same for this new Summicron. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil U Posted May 14, 2012 Share #306 Â Posted May 14, 2012 if a flaw is found in an element they remake that element. Â So what do they do if they find a flaw in a summilux element? Say "sod it, near enough" and then send it on out? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TshawM8 Posted May 14, 2012 Share #307 Â Posted May 14, 2012 Advertisement (gone after registration) So what do they do if they find a flaw in a summilux element? Say "sod it, near enough" and then send it on out? Â I did not ask but, as I already mentioned, the effort is, apparently greater to find the most minute flaws in the Noctilux than it is in a Summilux. I.E. they would find, more than likely, many more flaws in a Noctilux and, as a result, replace many more elements. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted May 14, 2012 Share #308 Â Posted May 14, 2012 See the section titled "Annex-1 Glass Types" in this Puts' article for interesting facts regarding the construction of the 50 Summilux asph. Hardly inferior by any standard. Â And Puts' review of the .95 Noctilux...Part One and Part Two are informative as well. There are more compromises in design, not construction, in this lens due to its extreme speed. Â Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TshawM8 Posted May 14, 2012 Share #309  Posted May 14, 2012 See the section titled "Annex-1 Glass Types" in this Puts' article for interesting facts regarding the construction of the 50 Summilux asph. Hardly inferior by any standard. And Puts' review of the .95 Noctilux...Part One and Part Two are informative as well. There are more compromises in design, not construction, in this lens due to its extreme speed.  Jeff  Yes, I don't think anybody would ever call the 50 lux asph. inferior...or even imply it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter H Posted May 14, 2012 Share #310 Â Posted May 14, 2012 My wife has offered an opinion which I at first thought absurd but now I'm not so sure. She pointed out that many fashion designers have a premium label and a secondary, less expensive line. Donna Karin and DKNY for instance. I can only hope we are not on the verge of seeing Leica Express or Leica JR... Â We already have a two-tier system Stephen. Â On Leica's own website in their product list for the M-system they have an item called "Lenses". Â And they have a separate item called "Summarit-M-Lenses." Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
haroldp Posted May 14, 2012 Share #311 Â Posted May 14, 2012 Or wait a few monts for the M10... Â This lens makes perfect sense in the context of an M10 with more pixels and perhaps electronic focus confirmation. Â I cannot see using this lens on which so much has been spent to correct the edges, on a crop format sensor. Â This lens represents a trickle down of design principles used for some time in military and industrial optics. Perhaps the design principles in this lens will now trickle down to more moderately priced photo optics. Â Has any use addressed the question of whether this resolution will excite more artifacts on the M9 sensor ? Â regards ... H Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted May 14, 2012 Share #312 Â Posted May 14, 2012 Yes, I don't think anybody would ever call the 50 lux asph. inferior...or even imply it. Â I wasn't talking about the lens; rather I was addressing the glass quality and construction techniques that you regarded as inferior to the Noctilux. Did you read the section I noted? Â Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
haroldp Posted May 14, 2012 Share #313 Â Posted May 14, 2012 Or wait a few monts for the M10... Â This lens makes perfect sense in the context of an M10 with more pixels and perhaps electronic focus confirmation. Â I cannot see using this lens on which so much has been spent to correct the edges, on a crop format sensor. Â This lens represents a trickle down of design principles used for some time in military and industrial optics. Perhaps the design principles in this lens will now trickle down to more moderately priced photo optics. Â Has any use addressed the question of whether this resolution will excite more artifacts on the M9 sensor ? Â regards ... H Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TshawM8 Posted May 14, 2012 Share #314  Posted May 14, 2012 I wasn't talking about the lens; rather I was addressing the glass quality and construction techniques that you regarded as inferior to the Noctilux. Did you read the section I noted? Jeff  Yes, I did. At no point does he compare and contrast the differences between the methods used to test elements of each lens for any flaw. Additionally, I feel as though I should remind you that I am simply relaying information stated by a Leica employee. I was privy to this information due to the fact that I work at a camera shop who has a strong relationship with Leica (i.e. they just sent S2's and all four S lenses to our shop for a demo class allowing students to use the camera at a nearby location). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted May 14, 2012 Share #315 Â Posted May 14, 2012 That reminds me...how has Ace's Leica business been impacted by the DC Leica store? Â Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TshawM8 Posted May 14, 2012 Share #316 Â Posted May 14, 2012 From what I've heard, it really hasn't. Time will tell though. It will be more interesting to see what happens when these new products are released. I stopped by yesterday and was told that there were some pre-orders in for the Cron and M9M. Â I am concerned about stock issues long term. Â I haven't yet been to the DC store because of school but am stopping by next week. If it is anything like the store in Mayfair than that is great (the store in Mayfair is great and the employees provide exceptional service) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Double Negative Posted May 14, 2012 Share #317 Â Posted May 14, 2012 If you want damn near MF quality in a true 35mm format, get the MM+Cron. Â Otherwise, move along. Really. Lots of other fine options out there... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted May 14, 2012 Share #318 Â Posted May 14, 2012 I didn't realize the new Summicron didn't work with color. Â Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bybrett Posted May 14, 2012 Share #319  Posted May 14, 2012 I didn't realize the new Summicron didn't work with color. Jeff  Quite. It works beyond compare on the M9 sensor and you can tell that it's like no other lens (closest being 75mm APO) in the current system. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyedward Posted May 14, 2012 Share #320 Â Posted May 14, 2012 Or use one of the mirror less cameras with short register distance like Sony NEX, Ricoh, or Fuji with an adapter now. Â What are the chances of sony producing a FF Nex soon? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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