Develop bw film in room temperature

[Adji.AP]

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Anybody has formula to define how long develop time in room temperature? Room temperature is about 30 degree celcius here.

 

Couldn't find it at massive dev chart.

 

In particular, I will develop 35mm kodak tx-400 at boxspeed ISO in D76 1+1 dilution

 

Ready to use recipe will be much appreciated

 

Thank you.

[andybarton]

Is there no way that you could use an ice bath to get the chemicals down to 20C?

[Adji.AP]

Is there no way that you could use an ice bath to get the chemicals down to 20C?

 

I'm preparing for worst condition. A sort of mobile film developing, while I'm on the trip

[Fgcm]

30 celsius is Too much. Try a very diluted developer like ilfosol3 1+14 and make some tests.

Sorry, but my bet is it won't work properly.

Fgcm

[spydrxx]

Increasing the temperature too much substantially increases the speed of the chemical reaction, making for very short development times, where you essentiall lose control of consistent agitation. Furthermore, you increase the possibility of reticulation of the film itself. Find some ice to reduce the temperature, an air-conditioned location, or save the film for later development.

[andybarton]

I'm preparing for worst condition. A sort of mobile film developing, while I'm on the trip

 

In that case you need to make up your chemicals using beer, not water (only kidding...)

[fotohuis]

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If the whole processing is on 30C it's not a problem but:

 

The processing times will be very short.

You need additional hardeners for this tropical development because above 24C the emulsion is getting very soft.

 

So in a practical way around 24C is preferable. 4-5 minutes for the developer time is more or less the minimum.

[Adji.AP]

30 celsius is Too much. Try a very diluted developer like ilfosol3 1+14 and make some tests.

Sorry, but my bet is it won't work properly.

Fgcm

 

add more solvent .. seems reasonable to avoid very short processing time

[pico]

D-23 is recommended for tropical temperature development. It was a favorite in tropical military situations for field development of aerial film and regular film. Zone system people like it, too. Use the development time/temp given for D-76. I have the formula for D-23 if you want to make it yourself. It is metol and sodium sulfite and water - a very simple chemical to make. I probably have the development time-chart estimator somewhere.

 

You are rather lucky to be doing hot weather development today. Earlier films were softer.

 

What film are you going to process?

 

Ready made from here: Photographers' Formulary Inc.

 

* Cite: 1) personal experience, 2) SPSE Handbook to verify

 

Andy: In that case you need to make up your chemicals using beer, not water (only kidding...)

 

There is a Beer's formula for developer. It is a two-part, near completion method developer. It might work!

[giordano]

Here's what the old Ilford Manual of Photography (1949 edition, pp185-6) has to say:

PROCESSING UNDER TROPICAL CONDITIONS

 

Rate of development increases rapidly with increasing temperature but the rate of change is vastly different with different developing agents. Temperatures above 70°F. (21°C.) should be avoided wherever possible because:

 

1. fog becomes troublesome unless it is held back by the addition of extra bromide;
   
2. at high temperatures the gelatin of the emulsion may soften and tend to leave the base unless special precautions have been taken in manufacture or by the user.
   

It is realized, however, that in tropical countries it is often necessary to process plates and films at elevated temperatures and for such circumstances the following techniques are recommended. All solutions and washing water should be as nearly as possible at the same temperature, as variations of temperature between these are more liable to cause frilling, blisters, or reticulation than a uniform higher temperature. For instance, it is usually unwise to use a developer approaching 80°F. (27°C.) and a fixing bath which has been freshly made up with cold water.

 

 

Almost any recognized developer will give satisfactory results with Ilford materials if the time of development be suitably adjusted for the temperature. At high temperatures the time of development may be inconveniently short, when it is better to increase the amount of the potassium bromide in the developer rather than to dilute with water. The bromide content may be increased to double the quantity recommended for 65°F. (18°C.) or with a developer containing metol to several times if the temperature is very high.

 

 

For development at high temperatures, from 75°F. (24°C.) to 90°F. (32°C.), add to the developer sodium sulphate (Glauber’s salt) in the proportion of 3 ounces to each 20 ounces of developer mixed ready for use. This has no adverse effect on development. It does not harden the gelatin, but it prevents it swelling in the developer. The material is then rinsed quickly and fixed in the fixing and hardening bath, or it may be hardened in a solution of formalin (40 per cent. solution) 1 part, water 100 parts, and then fixed in an ordinary fixing bath.

 

 

For development at temperatures over 90°F. (32°C.) the method described above may be employed, but it is safer to use the Ilford Tropical Hardener according to the issued instructions. Alternatively, the material may be hardened before development by immersion for 3 minutes in the following solution, after which processing may be carried on as in temperate conditions with the usual developer and fixing bath.

Sodium sulphate (Glauber’s salt) : 4 oz. / 100 g.

Formalin (40 per cent. solution): ½ oz. / 12.5 c.c.

Water, up to: 20 oz. / 500 c.c.

This or the Ilford Tropical Hardener may also be used at any temperature, but should be rather more dilute at lower temperatures.

 

 

After fixation the plates or films should be well washed, but must not be left an unnecessarily long time in the wash water, taking into consideration that the fixing salts are removed more quickly when the temperature of the water is high than when it is low. Drying should be conducted as rapidly as possible, preferably in a current of air.

The 1978 (Focal Press) edition says (p 374):

 

When processing at high temperatures either a low pH developer based on amidol or a mildly alkaline borax buffered develope are recommended. Alternatively a pre-hardening bath may be used or a specially formulated tropical developer. Tropical developers are characterised by a mild alkalinity, the inclusion of sodium sulphate to minimise swelling of the gelatin and the addition of extra anti-foggant. Whatever the procedure adopted it is best to consult the film manufacturer to obtain recommendations for processing under these conditions.

[Messsucherkamera]

Is there no way that you could use an ice bath to get the chemicals down to 20C?

 

You could use a cold water bath to lower the temp. of your chemistry to a level that will be compatible with normal developing times.

 

This is how I control the temps of my chemistry when developing E6 film, although with E6 I use a warm water bath to raise the temps of the chemistry to the correct level. There's no reason the reverse would not work with Tri-X.

 

This method of temperature control may sound iffy but it actually is quite effective in practice.

[tobey bilek]

68 is best, 75 passible with little deterioration and most will never see it without a side by side.

 

30 C is too high.

 

Buy some ice.

[Hausen17]

I put mine in the fridge to cool down if I over estimate water temp when I mix mine. Couldn't you do the same?

[giordano]

I put mine in the fridge to cool down if I over estimate water temp when I mix mine. Couldn't you do the same?

 

In some places even the Coca-Cola has to be served at room temperature.

[ismon]

Chilling the chemicals is only the answer to half of the problem. Your water rinses must be the same temperature. My tap water typically runs at 85-90F, and warmer as it runs. Black and white films are too (high) temperature-sensitive. I switched to C-41 emulsions (made to be processed at 100F).

[Doug A]

Chilling the chemicals is only the answer to half of the problem. Your water rinses must be the same temperature.

Agreed. But with Ilford's film washing procedure that only uses three changes of water it's quite manageable. I chill a 2 liter jug of water in the refrigerator and mix it with tap water for the developer, the stop bath, the fixer - and the wash. Even with 90F tap water the two liters of chilled water is enough to completely process and wash two rolls of 35mm B&W.

[Adji.AP]

Gentlemen, appreciate all your responses.

Yes, I could chill the chemicals ... as well as beer, water and etc

 

The idea is to experimenting, whether possible or not, to develop bw film with minimum sets of requirements, in this case, temperature.

Some of your recommendation perhaps suited for that. Thank you very much.

[DOUG66]

Hi Adji.AP

 

I may be able to help with a means of calculating the times of deveopers at different

temperatures if a recommended time and temp. is known.

In the late 1980's Photo Technology Ltd. published time v Temp graphs for both E6 and

C41 kits which they were selling. I digitalised these curves and found that when they were

normalised that they were identical. They seened to follow a mathematical relationship:

 

Ln(t/t known) = -33.106111*((T+273)/(T known +273)) + 33.101246

 

t is the required time

t known is recommended time

 

T is the required temp. 30deg C in your case

T known is the recommended temp for example 24 deg C

 

The formula fits Photo Technology Ltd. published data with a reg. coeff. of -0.99987

 

The addition of 273 to the temps is to convert deg C to Kelvin temp.

 

If for example the recommended time and temp. are 10min @ 24 C

 

Then Ln(t/10)=-33.106111*(30+273)/(24+273)+33.101246

 

= -0.673675

 

t = 10*exp(-0.673675)

 

= 5.098 mins

 

= 5 mins 5 secs

 

I have used this data for developing both E6 and C41 aver the limited range of 40 C to 37C

with no problems. I have no experience of B+W films at elevated temps, but if you add

hardner as advised it is worth a try.

 

Doug

[!Nomad64]

On my old "Photo cookbook" by Oscar Ghedina there's this formula:

 

Gevaert G222 A "tropical":

 

Metol g 50

Anhydrous sodium sulfite g 80

Hydroquinone g 5

Sodium Sulfate crystal g 100

Potassium Carbonate g 30

Potassium Bromide g 1.5

Water g 1,000

 

Instructions:

G 222 A. For tropical climates. Develop 1-2 min at 30°C. At the end use a hardening fixer.

 

I'm not exactly sure about the terminology as the original is italian written and I'm definitely not into chemistry so I had to rely entirely on google translate. Also it says nothing about agitation.

 

Hope this helps

Bruno

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[tobey bilek]

Buy a bag of ice.

 

How you going to dry it so it stays clean?

 

Whatever, try it at home first and compare to proper processing. All solutions offered are emergency measures only.