nggalai Posted October 4, 2011 Author Share #61 Posted October 4, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) exactly, let Leica imitate the worst aspects of the iphone How often do people change their SD card anyway ? A 16gbcard is good for over 600 shots, a 32gb for over 1200 (DNG uncompressed only) In my case, i.e. the reason for this thread, it wasn’t the SD card at all. It was the battery unloading frightingly quickly, probably due to having the on/off switch stuck in the middle or something. At any rate, either it didn’t shut down after the 1min I had selected in the menu, or the battery is wonky. So, yes, I was quite surprised to have the camera die on me after three dozen shots rather than 400. Hence the plate debacle. Stuff happens. The question is how easy manufacturers make it for you when the happening stuff happens to be brown, hitting a rotating thingy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted October 4, 2011 Posted October 4, 2011 Hi nggalai, Take a look here Removable bottom plates, and how to deal with them.. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
AlanG Posted October 4, 2011 Share #62 Posted October 4, 2011 Stuff happens. The question is how easy manufacturers make it for you when the happening stuff happens to be brown, hitting a rotating thingy. I think it is hard to make a case that having a removable plate is a better or more convenient method... consider that no other camera or MF back manufacturer does this. But Leica obviously has other considerations when designing a camera today because they are still locked into an early 1950s model of what they thought was relatively ergonomic for a film camera back then. (And the M3 was slow to load, rewind, and unload yet many people put up with that for years too.) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted October 4, 2011 Share #63 Posted October 4, 2011 Nice fix! I thought I would dislike it, but now I feel it's just fine. If I didn't like it, I'd try Luigi's alternative, the M-Mate when it becomes available for the M9. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest srheker Posted October 5, 2011 Share #64 Posted October 5, 2011 But Leica obviously has other considerations when designing a camera today because they are still locked into an early 1950s model of what they thought was relatively ergonomic for a film camera back then. (And the M3 was slow to load, rewind, and unload yet many people put up with that for years too.) And of course anybody knows that it was impossible to take even a single good photo in a lifetime with a camera that was that slow to load and had only 36 frames per roll! Just as anybody knows that it was completely impossible to photograph soccer, american football or basketball before the introduction of the NIkon D3 and Canon EOS 1D Mk.IV. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanG Posted October 5, 2011 Share #65 Posted October 5, 2011 So? People shot sports with 5x7 Big Bertha's too. My point was that people put up with what they have available. Leica eventually made the M4 which was quicker to load. Should they not have done that? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbie1 Posted October 5, 2011 Share #66 Posted October 5, 2011 I don't know what the problem is. Does anyone remember having to take off a similar plate to remove a thing called 35mm film? You had to do this every 36 shots, or so. What a pain, and some of you still do this, and like doing it. You used to be able to do it pretty quickly too, took less than a minute, unless things went wrong. I can't see a better way whilst keeping the integrity of the classic M body intact. I've seen the Luigi gismo, no thanks. Anyway - how often do you guys change a card or battery for heavens sake? You do know that you can shoot colour and B&W on the same card, and at different ASA settings. My battery has lasted a good 7 days shooting, and was only 75% down when I recharged it. I don't keep the screen to come on when a pic is taken, I hardly look review them and turn the camera off when it's in a bag. I creep about looking for a good shot and use the camera when I see it, it's not on all the time. The 8GB card is like having a load of film to me, even shooting RAW. It's a bit like complaining about burning music to CDs, rather than an iPod (or similar) from your MP3 library. You have to take a CD out of a case, get the drawer to open, find the authoring software etc. I can still remember making tapes from vinyl, or burning minidiscs. Writing the info for the later was incredibly tedious, thanks to someone at Sony who thought it was cool to put a non qwerty keyboard on a remote the size of an iPad. We've got it good, because it's so simple. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest srheker Posted October 5, 2011 Share #67 Posted October 5, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) I don't know what the problem is. Does anyone remember having to take off a similar plate to remove a thing called 35mm film? You had to do this every 36 shots, or so. What a pain, and some of you still do this, and like doing it. You used to be able to do it pretty quickly too, took less than a minute, unless things went wrong. I can't see a better way whilst keeping the integrity of the classic M body intact. I've seen the Luigi gismo, no thanks. At this point I nearly fell of my chair. Laughing! Why? Because, in that moment I realized that Luigi is the same person who is selling leather cases so that you have to take of and put away a leather case before being able to remove the base plate. And I'm quite sure he is selling much more "make it more complcated"-leather cases than base plates with holes... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
earleygallery Posted October 5, 2011 Share #68 Posted October 5, 2011 I'm amazed. People are complaining about the base plate and say doors are better. How tedious and time consuming are those damn doors! You should be more forward thinking, guys. Don't settle for old fashioned doors. Why can't camera designers come up with a clip/slide in battery with speedy release? Same with memory cards. Imagine a memory card that simply clips on, or could slide into a 'hotshoe'. No doors thankyou! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanG Posted October 5, 2011 Share #69 Posted October 5, 2011 I don't know what the problem is. Does anyone remember having to take off a similar plate to remove a thing called 35mm film? You had to do this every 36 shots, or so. What a pain, and some of you still do this, and like doing it. You used to be able to do it pretty quickly too, took less than a minute, unless things went wrong. And how many great shots were missed while doing this? David Burnett lost out to Nick Ut on what became one of the most famous images of the 20th century... because he was re-loading his Leica. I think the larger cards and battery capacity make this less important today, but if Leica did not have the legacy of the M do you think they really would have designed the M9 like this? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill Posted October 5, 2011 Share #70 Posted October 5, 2011 How many shots have you lost this way, Alan? In round numbers. Ish? Regards, Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
zlatkob Posted October 5, 2011 Share #71 Posted October 5, 2011 I don't know what the problem is. Does anyone remember having to take off a similar plate to remove a thing called 35mm film? You had to do this every 36 shots, or so. What a pain, ... "What a pain," ... indeed ... but do we usually argue in favor or pain? I don't find the film camera arguments convincing. This is not a film camera. What do we prove by making film camera-based arguments? We can imagine that it's "so much like a film camera" because it has this removable part "just like a film camera" — or we can see clearly that it isn't a film camera and never will be, so the designers don't have to be guided by film camera constraints. If one really takes all of the film camera arguments to their logical conclusion, then one ends up with ... a very nice film camera. Your 7 days of shooting on one battery illustrates how people have different photographic needs. That is not typical battery usage for everyone. Some photographers need to make thousands of exposures in a day, so battery life can be just a few hours. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest srheker Posted October 5, 2011 Share #72 Posted October 5, 2011 And how many great shots were missed while doing this? David Burnett lost out to Nick Ut on what became one of the most famous images of the 20th century... because he was re-loading his Leica. Obviously Dave is not that traumatized using a M9. And anyway: Who say's that his picture would have been better or as good as Ut's (maybe being the one with the nearly as good picture would have damaged his career) and who knows if both pictures would have become such Icons. Maybe no one would remember this incident if there had been two slightly different pictures. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest srheker Posted October 5, 2011 Share #73 Posted October 5, 2011 Some photographers need to make thousands of exposures in a day, Taking "thousands of exposures", that's plural, so we need at least 2000 frames. I don't think that anyone will use a M8 or M9 for this or that they will do this in such a short time or under such pressure that changing batteries and cards becomes a problem. You don't shoot sports at 10 fps with a M9, as it can't go faster than 2 fps. To make 2000 exposures (thousands of exposures means at least 2000) in a day it takes a shutter actuation every 4 seconds for 8 hours. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Fluff Posted October 5, 2011 Share #74 Posted October 5, 2011 Removable base plate is a illogical design, (M9 is my first Leica). I think those two statements are closely linked. For those of us with a sense of history, the baseplate evokes a wry smile, as it's a lovely nod to the film M's If you want brutal logic and efficiency, go buy a Canon 1DmkIV - it's a superb camera and serves me well. The M9's strong suit was never going to be logic, so much as charm Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Fluff Posted October 5, 2011 Share #75 Posted October 5, 2011 To make 2000 exposures (thousands of exposures means at least 2000) in a day it takes a shutter actuation every 4 seconds for 8 hours. That would be 7200 frames surely? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
zlatkob Posted October 5, 2011 Share #76 Posted October 5, 2011 To make 2000 exposures (thousands of exposures means at least 2000) in a day it takes a shutter actuation every 4 seconds for 8 hours. Your math is off in that example (click every 4 seconds); it would result in 7,200 exposures in 8 hours. It takes 3.33 exposures per minute (a click every 18 seconds) to reach 2,000 exposures in a 10 hour assignment. I realize that's a lot, but it's not motorized shooting, and some events take more than 10 hours. I know of a wedding photographer who would average 120 exposures per hour over 10 hours (1,200 exposure in a day) ten years ago when he was shooting film, doing a mix of medium format and 35mm. With digital, he may shoot twice as much, though not with a rangefinder. Just saying ... photographers have different needs. But that doesn't mean that the heavy shooters necessarily want to carry a 5-pound DSLR for 10 hours. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest srheker Posted October 6, 2011 Share #77 Posted October 6, 2011 That would be 7200 frames surely? Yes you're right. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest srheker Posted October 6, 2011 Share #78 Posted October 6, 2011 Just saying ... photographers have different needs. And cameras are different too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted October 6, 2011 Share #79 Posted October 6, 2011 What TF is the problem. If a 16GB card, set to DNG, and a full battery will not suffice, then just what kind of hack photographer are you? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
zlatkob Posted October 6, 2011 Share #80 Posted October 6, 2011 What TF is the problem. If a 16GB card, set to DNG, and a full battery will not suffice, then just what kind of hack photographer are you? I responded to the "just use a bigger card" theory up in post #60. Sorry you missed it and got mad and had to resort to the "hack photographer" comment. Using a bigger card is a workaround as to the card anyway, but it's not always wise. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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