GarethC Posted September 21, 2011 Share #1 Posted September 21, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) I have CS4 and a newly acquired M9 and have read in a few threads that CS5 is superior in terms of processing noise in M9 images. I'm almost certainly going to upgrade to CS5 but before I do I'd like to get some thoughts on why CS5 is superior and what you do to get the mot out of it. I also rely heavily on the Nik suite of products. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted September 21, 2011 Posted September 21, 2011 Hi GarethC, Take a look here Processing noise in CS5. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
01af Posted September 21, 2011 Share #2 Posted September 21, 2011 I have CS4 and a newly acquired M9 and have read in a few threads that CS5 is superior in terms of processing noise in M9 images. I'm almost certainly going to upgrade to CS5 ... Don't! It's not Photoshop CS5 that has superior noise-reduction functions but ACR 6 that comes along with it. And whatever ACR 6 can do—Lightroom 3 (which you already have, as you are an M9 owner) can do the same. So you're missing nothing. But the most important reason NOT to upgrade to CS5 is—CS6. Since the release of CS5, almost 1.5 years have passed ... so most likely, CS6 will be announced later this month or in the next. So better wait a few weeks, then upgrade directly to CS6, skipping CS5. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoppyman Posted September 21, 2011 Share #3 Posted September 21, 2011 Gareth, better noise processing in raw as you mentioned makes a noticeable difference but there are also some great new tools (for selections and content aware fill for example). You can get the same raw processing improvements with Lightroom 3 as Camera Raw 6. Their point updates synchronise too. However, if you are using Photoshop alongside LR then it is convenient to have the versions both at same version status. Earlier versions may not recognise every developing option from the latest ones. I don't know if your Nik software is all stand-alone or plug-ins? You may find that you would need to pay for upgrades there too. For sure there are always new versions on the way. The last update to the Creative Suite was to 5.5 but I think that did not make any changes to Photoshop, just added some other functions to the suite. I would expect that Lightroom will also get a version update when the next Photoshop version comes along. I guess that you know that point updates are free from Adobe and version upgrades are paid and some new functions require the newest versions. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted September 22, 2011 Share #4 Posted September 22, 2011 OD PERHAPS The worst experience I ever had with CS5 is saving in Adobe RAW. It was brutal, creating a conspicuous patch of noise in the picture I cannot forgive. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
01af Posted September 22, 2011 Share #5 Posted September 22, 2011 However, if you are using Photoshop alongside LR then it is convenient to have the versions both at same version status. Convenient, yes, but not utterly required. Earlier versions may not recognise every developing option from the latest ones. That's true in general ... but in particular, Photoshop CS4 with ACR 5.7 does recognise all developing options of ACR 6 or Lightroom 3, including the latest like improved noise reduction or film grain effects. Older ACR versions don't but ACR 5.7 is forward-compatible with ACR 6. So for a CS4 user there is no good reason to spend the upgrade price for CS5 now and then once again for CS6 in just a few weeks. Just make sure your ACR version is 5.7—if it is not then download it free of charge from Adobe's website. On the other hand, the existence of Creative Suite 5.5 could be an indication that the time until the introduction of CS6 might be longer than the usual 18 months. So if CS6 doens't get announced by end of October then I'd guess we will have to wait another six months. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250swb Posted September 22, 2011 Share #6 Posted September 22, 2011 OD PERHAPS The worst experience I ever had with CS5 is saving in Adobe RAW. It was brutal, creating a conspicuous patch of noise in the picture I cannot forgive. That is perhaps an extreme case of using a very specialised format to save an image in, not something normally undertaken by photographers. For those that don't know about Photoshop RAW file format (not to be confused with Adobe Camera Raw aka ACR) a simple explanation is here Photoshop RAW File Format | Shutha Steve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoppyman Posted September 22, 2011 Share #7 Posted September 22, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) Camera Raw 6 (as part of Photoshop CS5) and Lightroom 3 introduced the new Process Version 2010 which does change and improve rendering of M9 files significntly and that may affect capture sharpening and noise reduction requirements too. That is why so many M9 users were keen to get LR3 rather than LR2 as their entitlement on purchase. I find some of the new tools in CS5 extremely useful too as mentioned Just trying to answer what Gareth actually asked though! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
01af Posted September 22, 2011 Share #8 Posted September 22, 2011 Camera Raw 6 [...] and Lightroom 3 introduced the new Process Version 2010 ... This is not quite true. Instead, the new process "Version 2010" actually was introduced with Lightroom 3 Public Beta and ACR 5.7 ... there's a reason why the internal version number of process "Version 2010" is 5.7. Of course, the support of process "Version 2010" in ACR 5.7 is limited, as there is no user interface to the new functionality. Still, it can load "Version 2010" DNG files without any restrictions, demosaice them, and pass them on to Photoshop CS4. So if you have Lightroom 3 then you can use that as your front end, and use ACR 5.7 to get your stuff into Photoshop. No CS5 required. Sure—Photoshop CS5 does offer some nice additional functions over CS4 besides ACR's improved noise reduction ... but do these really warrant the expense of upgrading to CS5 only weeks before the (expected) release of CS6? I think not. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GarethC Posted September 22, 2011 Author Share #9 Posted September 22, 2011 I don't use LR an dhave checked in DPReview and best guess there is that CS6 will be out summer 2012 at the earliest. Would you still wait? It sounds like I need CS5 but thoughts appreciated? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
01af Posted September 22, 2011 Share #10 Posted September 22, 2011 I don't use LR an dhave checked in DPReview and best guess there is that CS6 will be out Summer 2012 at the earliest. Would you still wait? Umm ... if that's true (and it's not too unlikely, given that intermediate Creative Suite 5.5 was released only a few months ago) then I guess upgrading to CS5 now does make sense. If CS6 doesn't get announced within the next, say, six weeks then we can be pretty sure that it won't come before Spring 2012, maybe even later. You don't utterly need CS5, as you can use Lightroom 3 as your DNG-processing front-end—if you don't use Lightroom yet then maybe this is good time to start using it? If you definitely don't want to start using it now or in the foreseeable future then I guess acquiring CS5 will make sense for you. How bad will the expense hurt your wallet? If hardly or not at all then go ahead—sooner rather than later. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeinzX Posted September 22, 2011 Share #11 Posted September 22, 2011 If it is only noise reduction which is of importance for you and you are satisfied with the other possibilities of your present Photoshop version, I can really recommend the NIK PlugIn Dfine 2.0 for noise reduction. This is an excellent tool for this purpose.This product was recommended by LFI too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted September 22, 2011 Share #12 Posted September 22, 2011 It is not just the noise processing. The content-aware tools alone are worth buying it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
delander † Posted September 22, 2011 Share #13 Posted September 22, 2011 Personally I would go for the upgrade. I too use Bridge/ACR/PSCS5 and not Lightroom. Even after some years of trying I'm just not comfortable with the importing and file handling of Lightroom. As I normally work on images individually the PSCS5 route is what I'm happy with. Printing a single image from Photoshop is so straightforward and controllable compared to Lightroom.. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GarethC Posted September 22, 2011 Author Share #14 Posted September 22, 2011 I have Nik Dfine, I think I'll try and take the dirtiest noisiest picture I can and see how that turns out. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoppyman Posted September 22, 2011 Share #15 Posted September 22, 2011 O1af, I think that you just enjoy debating other posters, especially me I'm not arguing whether Gareth should or shouldn't buy Photoshop CS5 or wait for the next version whenever it is released. I'm sure that he is a big boy and will decide for himself! We don't actually know if Gareth has Lightroom right now or if he bought his M9 new and has an entitlement to a licence or whether he wants to use it. I tried to answer what Gareth actually asked: "I have CS4 and a newly acquired M9 and have read in a few threads that CS5 is superior in terms of processing noise in M9 images. I'm almost certainly going to upgrade to CS5 but before I do I'd like to get some thoughts on why CS5 is superior and what you do to get the most out of it. I also rely heavily on the Nik suite of products" Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted September 22, 2011 Share #16 Posted September 22, 2011 Geoff and I put a little piece in the M9 FAQ on CS5 and LR3 noise management, which could provide a starting point. http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/leica-m9-forum/130720-m9-faqs-frequently-asked-questions-answers.html#post1561512 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoppyman Posted September 23, 2011 Share #17 Posted September 23, 2011 Did we Jaap? All your work I'm sure! I gave up on the parallel Leica FAQ as it didn't attract any other contributors, only mixed reviews on what I had started it with Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GarethC Posted September 23, 2011 Author Share #18 Posted September 23, 2011 I'm refusing point blank to use LR so that is probably going to be a hindrance to me. Good work on the FAQ Geoff. Jaap must be very proud of your efforts. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoppyman Posted September 23, 2011 Share #19 Posted September 23, 2011 No it really WAS Jaap and he has done the lion's share of putting that M9 FAQ together for everyone! Lots of stuff in there I agree with so it must be good No matter, I think that the FAQs are an excellent resource for members. O1af might like to gather what he has explained over a couple of threads on the exiftool use and put that in there? Now since you have mentioned an aversion to Lightroom...... It is different and you have to adapt a little from a Photoshop mindset but it really is an excellent tool for photographers (which O1af mentioned too) and it has Digital Asset Management superpowers that make life much easier as your image stocks go into tens of thousands I probably do 80% of my photo stuff in there and the rest in PSCS5 (mainly for complex edits with layers but also if I want to use the content aware magic, selections for any purpose, and photomerging for stitched panoramas, soft proofing with profiles for the high end papers etc) Hint, its really really smart and you can try it for free for 30 days, then come back and tell us that you've seen the light.... room Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted September 23, 2011 Share #20 Posted September 23, 2011 Geof is my resident LR oracle Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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