Communication with Leica Solms?

[wattsy]

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I think the August holiday season is a red herring - the factory is clearly still functioning at some level (as anyone who has had dealings with or through them in the last few weeks can testify) - so I don't think it is unreasonable for Jeff to have expected a reply by now to his email. The idea that it is okay for a company with a €250m turnover to not answer emails because it is August holiday season is ludicrous. Like others, I suspect that the generic customer services email address is a spam filtered black hole and it is thus advisable to get hold of a named contact at Solms or phone them up (I don't think it costs much nowadays to call Germany).

[farnz]

To my mind it is not acceptable business practice for the whole factory to be on holiday. Presumably someone will be there to take in my camera from UPS.

Jeff,

 

If Leica wasn't able to close the factory in August when would they be able to service all of the plant that's running 24 hours a day to try to meet the recent step demand?

 

Pete.

[delander †]

I agree Ian, and it sucks, but at least in my case I did not wait for CS (att) Leica.

 

I'm surprised that nobody has commented on the actual fault I showed. The vertical line used to be reported here on the M8 quite often, I thought with the M9 the problem had gone, but evidently not. The warranty on this camera runs out in the next few months, would I have been charged if it was out of warranty?

 

I'm expecting somebody to chime in and say that it happens with all cameras. I only have experience with Canon gear and I have had 4 canon DSLRs (still have 2) and never saw a sight of this.

 

Jeff

[jaapv]

It does happen on all cameras indeed ( have a look at other brand's forums) but CCD seems to be more prone than CMos. If have yet to hear of anybody being charged for this kind of defect. Remapping a sensor is no big deal anyway. Just send it in.

[delander †]

Jeff,

 

If Leica wasn't able to close the factory in August when would they be able to service all of the plant that's running 24 hours a day to try to meet the recent step demand?

 

Pete.

 

Pete, do you seriously think they are running 24 hours a day? If something broke in May they wait until August to fix it, I dont think so. Service of equipment has to be a year round ongoing activity.

 

Jeff

[bill]

Sorry I'm not going to absorb the expense of phoning Germany. Leica offers email addresses for communication, why do that if they dont reply? They have no excuse, it is just bad treatment of a good customer.

 

Cost of camera = X

Cost of phone call to Germany = Y

 

...just sayin'

 

Regards,

 

Bill

[delander †]

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It does happen on all cameras indeed ( have a look at other brand's forums) but CCD seems to be more prone than CMos. If have yet to hear of anybody being charged for this kind of defect. Remapping a sensor is no big deal anyway. Just send it in.

 

You mean they are not going to replace it?

 

Jeff

[delander †]

Cost of camera = X

Cost of phone call to Germany = Y

 

...just sayin'

 

Regards,

 

Bill

 

 

I know, but the point is they offer email, I used it.

 

Jeff

[jaapv]

You mean they are not going to replace it?

 

Jeff

Only if the remapping would lift the number of pixels mapped out above the permissable percentage. All sensors are mapped at delivery, some less some more. When a camera needs a remap and the number remains within the tolerance limit it is simply remapped, otherwise the sensor needs to be replaced.

 

Btw, saying your four other cameras not having had the problem is as invalid as me saying my fleet of digital Leicas never had the problem (which is the case)

[bill]

The point is, email is "fire and forget" technology and hence not ultimately reliable. It can be lost, filtered out of existence or simply pushed to the bottom of the pile. As has already been mentioned, email spam filters are not always accurate in separating the wheat from the chaff. If you want to be sure of a response, speak to a human being.

 

Regards,

 

Bill

[delander †]

Only if the remapping would lift the number of pixels mapped out above the permissable percentage. All sensors are mapped at delivery, some less some more. When a camera needs a remap and the number remains within the tolerance limit it is simply remapped, otherwise the sensor needs to be replaced.

 

Btw, saying your four other cameras not having had the problem is as invalid as me saying my fleet of digital Leicas never had the problem (which is the case)

 

You are luckier than I Jaap. Can you point me to an occurence of this problem on a Canon or Nikon DSLR, I did not come up with anything on a search.

 

Jeff

[farnz]

Pete, do you seriously think they are running 24 hours a day? If something broke in May they wait until August to fix it, I dont think so. Service of equipment has to be a year round ongoing activity.

Jeff,

 

Certainly the factory would repair day to day failures but with manufacturing plant it's crucial to have a window where each machine can be stripped right down and given a full service - it's what keeps the day to day failures to a minimum and extends the plant's lifetime. It's rare that this can be done overnight.

 

I recall reading somewhere that Dr Kaufman had stated that they were running three shifts to meet demand so I think it's likely that they were operating 24 hours a day for some time. Even if they weren't some plant is better kept running because constant start up and shut-down cycles and accompanying thermal fluctuations can cause more wear than running full time with periods of quiescent running.

 

Pete.

[delander †]

The point is, email is "fire and forget" technology and hence not ultimately reliable. It can be lost, filtered out of existence or simply pushed to the bottom of the pile. As has already been mentioned, email spam filters are not always accurate in separating the wheat from the chaff. If you want to be sure of a response, speak to a human being.

 

Regards,

 

Bill

 

OK maybe they never got the email. As you know I did speak to a human being in the UK and the situation was sorted out the same day.

 

Jeff

[jaapv]

Jeff, it has been discussed here so often. There plenty of links, more importantly to serious publications on the subject, in this forum.

 

I've dug up Jamie's first post on the subject here - http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/leica-m8-forum/51889-bathtubrule.html#post544494

[bill]

I used to work for a mid-sized manufacturing company. They shut down for a fortnight each year at Whitsun. Only a skeleton staff remained in the warehouse and offices. During that period major changes were made to things like factory layout, machines that were otherwise working full time were serviced, factory facilities were repaired and redecorated, etc. All this work is best done when the production lines are at a standstill both for efficiency and safety purposes. Asset maintenance cycles were synchronised with this shut-down - it makes sense.

 

Regards,

 

Bill

[delander †]

Jeff,

 

Certainly the factory would repair day to day failures but with manufacturing plant it's crucial to have a window where each machine can be stripped right down and given a full service - it's what keeps the day to day failures to a minimum and extends the plant's lifetime. It's rare that this can be done overnight.

 

I recall reading somewhere that Dr Kaufman had stated that they were running three shifts to meet demand so I think it's likely that they were operating 24 hours a day for some time. Even if they weren't some plant is better kept running because constant start up and shut-down cycles and accompanying thermal fluctuations can cause more wear than running full time with periods of quiescent running.

 

Pete.

 

I understand what you are saying but I dont believe that the whole plant is shut down for a month to do it. And they have the weekends, they could take page out of British Rail's book:eek:

 

Jeff

[bill]

And they have the weekends, they could take page out of British Rail's book:eek:

 

No need to be nasty

 

Let me try the logic once more.

 

If a key machine in a production line needs maintenance on a regular basis it makes sense to synchronise other maintenance cycles with that one in order to minimise overall down-time for the production line as a whole. So if, for example, the red-dot making machine needs a week of maintenance once a year it makes more sense to close down production and service everything else at the same time, synchronising the entire supply chain - raw material receipt, warehousing and distribution - so that you don't have cash, supply, production and distribution flow issues.

 

Does that make sense?

 

Regards,

 

Bill

[wattsy]

with manufacturing plant it's crucial to have a window where each machine can be stripped right down and given a full service

 

I wouldn't suggest that Leica do not benefit from a quiet period to stock take and so on but isn't this business of "shutting down plant at Solms" another red herring? My understanding is that, other than the grinding and polishing of the glass, most of the stuff that goes into Leica cameras and lenses (CNC machined lens barrels, body parts, etc.) are manufactured by third party suppliers and put together in Portugal.

[delander †]

Bill,

Are you sure the scenario that you outline is not from the 1980s and before? If they are going to operate this way why not tell customers that in August they wont be doing customer service. Then at least we know where we are.

 

But I cant imagine that whatever is going on in the factory they are not doing customer service. What about S2 owners, especially those that have forked out for the S2P?

 

Jeff

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Hallo,

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[delander †]

As Ian says what is going on at the plant is a red herring. They have to be in business 12 months a year as well as managing plant maintenance. If they are only in business 11 months a year they need to let customers know that.

 

Jeff