TshawM8 Posted May 22, 2011 Share #21 Posted May 22, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) I am not sure if this has been mentioned briefly, but I did not see it when gazing through the posts. Leica RF cameras look significantly less intimidating then any other digital camera, even a NEX, in my opinion. People are less likely, today, to see a camera that appears to be a film camera and become suspicious or intimidated. People see someone taking their picture with a point and shoot, or a camera such as a NEX, and feel weirded out. People see a DSLR and feel like they are being taken advantage of and that their picture is probably being used or sold. People see a rangefinder and, specifically today, tend to think of that person as a hobbyist. This is obviously not a fool proof argument and is by no means an "end all be all" case. This is based off of personal discussion and experience based off of shooting in D.C. and I am sure many will disagree with what I have said. I do tend to believe there is a trend that supports what I am saying. This is by no means a sole reason why Leica RF's are better, but simply another reason why they may obtain pictures with more ease than a DSLR or P&S esque camera. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted May 22, 2011 Posted May 22, 2011 Hi TshawM8, Take a look here Why is a rangefinder best for street photography?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
prunelle Posted May 22, 2011 Share #22 Posted May 22, 2011 ... If you're in the barrel with the fish.. most likely they know you're there... not exactly discreet. It's the difficulty: being there yet unnoticed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Holy Moly Posted May 22, 2011 Share #23 Posted May 22, 2011 Shooting with Nikons, a Leica M and 6x6, my Pen E-P2 is the best 'street machine' for me, second best the Ricoh GRD But beside the hardware the attitude and experience of a photographer is more important. In the past I made most of my pics in a certain Leica-look with my NikonF......... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. Valdemar Posted May 22, 2011 Share #24 Posted May 22, 2011 Pardon me, but I think most of this is nonsense. A) 99.99% of the public at large wouldn't know a film camera from a Star Trek transporter. If they do look at your camera, nothing registers at all except maybe "camera". Ditto for rangefinders. They have no idea what a rangefinder is. To stretch this further and say "rangefinder = hobbyist" is wishful thinking. C) Compared to most TINY modern point and shoot digital cameras, Leica rangefinder cameras are enormous. If you want to create an intimidation scale, Leicas are way up there. The skill of the operator is mostly the governing factor here. No matter how large or imposing the camera, I find I can get best results in public by pretending I am shooting something else, or keeping the camera hidden under my coat or in my bag, and whipping it out for the shot and replacing it. You may or may not be able to be effective this way. Other people just take photos in public, stick the camera in people's faces and don't care what anyone thinks....this takes some callousness. I am not sure if this has been mentioned briefly, but I did not see it when gazing through the posts. Leica RF cameras look significantly less intimidating then any other digital camera, even a NEX, in my opinion. People are less likely, today, to see a camera that appears to be a film camera and become suspicious or intimidated. People see someone taking their picture with a point and shoot, or a camera such as a NEX, and feel weirded out. People see a DSLR and feel like they are being taken advantage of and that their picture is probably being used or sold. People see a rangefinder and, specifically today, tend to think of that person as a hobbyist. This is obviously not a fool proof argument and is by no means an "end all be all" case. This is based off of personal discussion and experience based off of shooting in D.C. and I am sure many will disagree with what I have said. I do tend to believe there is a trend that supports what I am saying. This is by no means a sole reason why Leica RF's are better, but simply another reason why they may obtain pictures with more ease than a DSLR or P&S esque camera. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NZDavid Posted May 22, 2011 Share #25 Posted May 22, 2011 Pardon me, but I think most of this is nonsense. A) 99.99% of the public at large wouldn't know a film camera from a Star Trek transporter. If they do look at your camera, nothing registers at all except maybe "camera". Ditto for rangefinders. They have no idea what a rangefinder is. To stretch this further and say "rangefinder = hobbyist" is wishful thinking. C) Compared to most TINY modern point and shoot digital cameras, Leica rangefinder cameras are enormous. If you want to create an intimidation scale, Leicas are way up there. The skill of the operator is mostly the governing factor here. No matter how large or imposing the camera, I find I can get best results in public by pretending I am shooting something else, or keeping the camera hidden under my coat or in my bag, and whipping it out for the shot and replacing it. You may or may not be able to be effective this way. Other people just take photos in public, stick the camera in people's faces and don't care what anyone thinks....this takes some callousness. Surely when the Star Trek transporter operator starts beaming up and disappearing that would be a dead giveaway? Concealed cameras -- isn't that sneaky? As opposed to the "callousness" of sticking a camera in people's faces, how about simply smiling at them first, or even asking if they mind? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peyton Hoge Posted May 22, 2011 Share #26 Posted May 22, 2011 Surely when the Star Trek transporter operator starts beaming up and disappearing that would be a dead giveaway? Concealed cameras -- isn't that sneaky? As opposed to the "callousness" of sticking a camera in people's faces, how about simply smiling at them first, or even asking if they mind? When you ask people if they mind, then you're setting up pictures. It's no longer a slice of "real" life. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gib_robinson Posted May 23, 2011 Share #27 Posted May 23, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) In the past few years I've found myself more often asking strangers if I can photograph them. In some cases I can offer a genuine reason -- "I have a German Shepherd and love to photograph dogs and their owners. May I take your picture." Or, "I love that jacket (hat, outfit, tie, color, whatever). Can I photograph you in it?" Frequently, the answer is yes. Having a Leica helps. Subjects assume I'm using something close to a point-and-shoot. No big lens. No loud noise. No machine-gun sequence of images. The relationship, of course, affects the kind of image I get. --Gib Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
menos I M6 Posted May 23, 2011 Share #28 Posted May 23, 2011 I just added a Panasonic GH2 to my gear in hope of getting a nice camera for extended reach, to use my Leica M lenses on. Let me tell you this: The GH2's image quality within similar ISO range as my M8.2 is surprisingly good. Operating this GH2 even after a little time of "getting warm with it" is @#$%^&* … I mean pure @#$%^&* Shooting a Leica M is immediate, responsive, direct, no fuss, non distracting. A M is the most simple and quickest tool, to use for shooting moments, if you are close enough, which happens, to have become my favorite range (35mm and at most 50mm ). The reason is just this simple. You see the world - not a cropped tunnel or worse - a EVF, which changes electronic gain with constantly changing brightness levels, trying to figure out, to shine a f1 @ 1/30 ISO3200 scene directly into your brain with the equivalent of a f11 A1/1000 ISO160 scene. I am not talking menus, buttons and controls specifically, but indeed after trying the different systems for a while after shooting a M at least so long, that you can run it blind folded will leave eery other camera look like @#$%^&* - some like the µ4/3 bodies are more like really true deep @#$%^&*, some like a nice, fast action DSLR with fast AF lenses more or less feel a bit like @#$%^&*. They all though don't scratch the M for quick operation. Sometimes in life, it is indeed not at all about specs, numbers or just raw image quality in camera terms, but about the feel. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
earleygallery Posted May 23, 2011 Share #29 Posted May 23, 2011 Whenever I read a thread on the subject of street photography I always see the same comment/opinions. My point of view; "What is street photography anyway" - HCB is an easy answer, or look at in-public.com for some more recent examples. For me, street photography is NOT just a hip shot of any stranger that happens to be walking past you doing nothing in particular, nor is it photos of the backs of peoples heads, nor is it buskers/beggars (with some exceptions). The photo still has to stand up on its own, as a photograph. Just because you feel pleased with yourself that you had the courage to take a photo of a stranger on the tube (hip shot, rear of head, no composition) doesn't make it a great photo. Also, street photography isn't all about people shots. You can take photos of signs, advertising, rubbish! "You need to use a small quiet camera" - Wrong, you need to use a camera that you feel comfortable with. That could be a Hasselblad or a DSLR. It's the way you use it which matters. That said, I did find shooting with a TLR recently that more people seemed to ignore me. It doesn't matter if you have taped over your red dot on your Leica or not, it's the way you act that will draw attention or not. "It's rude to take photos of strangers, best to ask permission first/get a model release" - certainly where I live it's perfectly legal to take photos in public, not only that there is a great tradition of street photography - it's nothing new. Images become social history in time. I agree that in most cases, if you ask permission first you'll end up with a posed photograph. Sometimes I have asked first, it just depends on the situation/subject, but generally the idea is to capture random moments. It's not compulsory to like street photography, if you aren't comfortable with it then so what? Stick to the subject matter which you are comfortable with, you do photography for fun don't you? If you're not comfortable with it but want to try, then choose an outdoor public event of some sort to practice at. People will be less conscious of photographers as most people will probably be taking photos themselves, and assuming its a fun event (rather than a political demo) they'll be quite happy about having their photo taken. Buskers (see above) are also good for practice - I like to take the chance to capture photos of the crowd, expressions/reactions etc. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
menos I M6 Posted May 23, 2011 Share #30 Posted May 23, 2011 James, I tried to, but couldn't place a second or third "Thank You" under your post above ;-) The thing, many people call "street photography" Today seems fashionable and especially so for people, just bought a nice, new camera. A often heard pre conception about "street photography", that is mentioned to nausea is the idea, that it is best, to stop lenses down and shoot from the hip. It is sad, that many people just take this recipe and miss all the other ways, to do it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Randle P. McMurphy Posted May 23, 2011 Share #31 Posted May 23, 2011 Beats me. I still don’t know what ‘’street photography’’ is. Just easy to explain dude - just blow the dust off an old goony camera - put a roll of black-white film in it - screw a wide-angle-lens and start to pester some innocent people who just want to go shopping in a mall. That´s Street-Photography - after that I explain you what Street-Fighting means... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill Posted May 23, 2011 Share #32 Posted May 23, 2011 I fear that there is also a bit of a tick box mentality at work with some photographers. Sports photography - tick Portraits - tick Landscape - tick HDR - tick Macro - tick Street - tick This "polyphot" approach, a bit like wandering around with the I-Spy book of photography, is favoured by people who feel the need to be competent in many techniques and genres. When they start with a genre, they start with the cliches, because they know no better. When they end up with ok, average results, they rarely persevere, or look to themselves. They close the lid with a slam and "don't get" the genre. Street photography is hard. It is exceptionally hard because a) good practitioners make it look easy it requires skill, timing and good fortune in equal measure and c) it needs the photographer to become part of the action to achieve the most trenchant results. There are days when I am happy to get in among the action, and others when I'm not. It depends what sort of mood I'm in. If I'm not "up for it" I don't even try. Regards, Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
earleygallery Posted May 23, 2011 Share #33 Posted May 23, 2011 There are days when I am happy to get in among the action, and others when I'm not. It depends what sort of mood I'm in. If I'm not "up for it" I don't even try. Regards, Bill Absolutely - that's the luxury of being an amateur. It's different if one is a press or paparazzi photographer and your living/reputation relies 'getting the shot'. What is it, 3 photographers who have killed on assignment in Libya now? Absolute opposite end of the scale from what we're discussing here of course, but it does lend some perspective. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xmas Posted May 23, 2011 Share #34 Posted May 23, 2011 Hi Shutter lag is probably a factor a SLR or DSLR or autofocus is 'slower' unless you can anticipate and capture a long video sequence, with a high end DSLR. Reliability is also desirable. Noel Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Holy Moly Posted May 23, 2011 Share #35 Posted May 23, 2011 Streetphotography for me is respect and sympathy for the people I put on my card or film. It's not like chasing 'the moment', it's more like dancing with strangers. In more than 40 years only one gentleman became angry...... . | Flickr - Photo Sharing! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Holy Moly Posted May 23, 2011 Share #36 Posted May 23, 2011 Hi Shutter lag is probably a factor a SLR or DSLR or autofocus is 'slower' unless you can anticipate and capture a long video sequence, with a high end DSLR. Reliability is also desirable. Noel nope. 'street' isn't sportphotography, it's more like creating a novel. It doesn't matter whether you use Windows Word or a Remington ballhead typewriter, believe me. The best training is to try to change money with people in the streets. Get close and ask polite, interact with their behavior and get comfortable. Try to communicate just with your eyes, forget the cam at first. Forget even that you want to photograph. When you are talented you then feel something with your antennas - or not. Then do macro....... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xmas Posted May 23, 2011 Share #37 Posted May 23, 2011 Hmmm People move, statues don't move as much. You can reshoot a statue or a movie star (given a script) or model apart form lighting changes, you cannot reshoot a normal person, perhaps Bob Shell could.. Perhaps you are phtotgraphing the pavement/sidewalk? Noel Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Holy Moly Posted May 23, 2011 Share #38 Posted May 23, 2011 Noel, when you have THE sense, know your cam and have a certain portion of luck (but it's funny because your luck seems to grow over time), even moving bodies are slow because your brain is faster than everything and then you get it. If not, don't bother, this situation will be put into your internal library to be pulled out later..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
prunelle Posted May 23, 2011 Share #39 Posted May 23, 2011 ... you cannot reshoot a normal person, perhaps Bob Shell could.. Perhaps you are phtotgraphing the pavement/sidewalk? Noel Actually, we are kinda hunters; we keep watching and we shoot, in that order. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stunsworth Posted May 23, 2011 Share #40 Posted May 23, 2011 Shutter lag is probably a factor a SLR or DSLR or autofocus is 'slower' unless you can anticipate and capture a long video sequence, with a high end DSLR Didn't Willy Ronis use a Pentax? Seems a pretty fine photographer to me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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