ChiILX1 Posted February 16, 2011 Share #321 Â Posted February 16, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) Show us the pictures from your X1- or your M9- or your S2!!! I can't wait! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted February 16, 2011 Posted February 16, 2011 Hi ChiILX1, Take a look here X1 Firmware v2 Upgrade [Merged thread]. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
phancj Posted February 16, 2011 Share #322 Â Posted February 16, 2011 Not holding my breath coz I doubt any photos will follow but will be sure happy if he can back up with some stunning images for all of us to look up to! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JanCderidder Posted February 16, 2011 Share #323 Â Posted February 16, 2011 I have been reading through most of the X1 "poor AF threads" and although I do agree the AF is far from stellar I must also admit that I focus faster with my X1 than I ever will with my M8 and 35mm. Reason for this is my "old eyes" of course I can zone focus with the M8 this however doesn't always make the picture perfect, and apart from that imo the IQ of the M8 is not as good as that of the X1 (at all iso's) So for me the X1 is a perfect little camera, with shortcomings for sure, but still perfect, I wouldn't think of exchanging it for anything of similar size be it cheaper or more expensive. Â As for AF speed, when needed we (my wife and I) well actually more my wife has added the Pentax K5 to her arsenal, this along with a couple of Ltd lenses is able to perform nicely, but at the cost of some bulk. Mind you my wife needs fast AF speed most of the time and this is why she didn't adopt the X1 although she likes the form factor and IQ she came to the conclusion that in the short run she would be disappointed with it's speed and would replace it by something faster, hence losing out on some money. Pretty wise decision don't you think, one that some of you "know it all's" should of thought of upon buying the X1. Â Is it our Testosterone values that make us buy things we know we won't appreciate in the short/middle/long run, and this just to be part of the "in-crowd" the early adopters the braggers, the knit-whits, I would almost mention arseholez, but don't want to get to personal here (and I know about the "z") Upon your next purchase why not consult a woman .... (not kidding here) Â ... one last jaunt; if you're not able to make a reasonably nice image with the X1 I sincerely doubt, no, let me rephrase this, I would suggest you take up another hobby(past time for photography is clearly not for you, and then choose a hobby which will end up a bit more economically feasible like; collecting matchboxes, cigar bands even beer cans ... I am confident this will bring you more pleasure in the end, and you don't really have to mention it to any of your acquaintances, and the only thing you need to impress them and your friends are expensive italian ties... simple solution no? Â And I am sure there are also fora on italian ties, matchbox collecting and such, you can join those instead of aggravating the cats fiddle out of the more "serious" X1 users, in other words "go play elsewhere" please.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsrockit Posted February 16, 2011 Share #324 Â Posted February 16, 2011 ... one last jaunt; if you're not able to make a reasonably nice image with the X1 I sincerely doubt, no, let me rephrase this, I would suggest you take up another hobby(past time for photography is clearly not for you, and then choose a hobby which will end up a bit more economically feasible like; collecting matchboxes, cigar bands even beer cans .... Â Come on, nobody is saying they cannot make good images with the X1... it's just that we'd like to use our X1 in a wider range of situations because we like it so much. As a user of multiple cameras from different manufactuers, I can say that the X1 is the least versatile of the bunch... and it has nothing to do with the fixed lens. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JanCderidder Posted February 16, 2011 Share #325 Â Posted February 16, 2011 @JSROCKIT I don't mean anybody posting in these forums, I understand your predicament, but there are also visitors here rather doing nothing than to enrage the once nice X1 community and somehow getting pleasure out of that .... I realize too that most of them don't even own an X1 or have used one, still any community like our X1 community should be an uplifting one, yes touching the downfalls but thriving on the qualities and hence bringing ourselves to a next level of photography, even if we do use inferior tools.... for photography has nothing to do with inferiority of tools used, it's all about the ability to create nice images within the limitations of the instruments used ... blabla ... you grab the essence hopefully :-) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
h00ligan Posted February 16, 2011 Share #326  Posted February 16, 2011 Come on, nobody is saying they cannot make good images with the X1... it's just that we'd like to use our X1 in a wider range of situations because we like it so much. As a user of multiple cameras from different manufactuers, I can say that the X1 is the least versatile of the bunch... and it has nothing to do with the fixed lens.  I agree. I feel for my level, the x1 can be a great camera.. but as it's the one I take everywhere, I just want it to deal with my lack of preparation and 'life's sponetenatity' a bit better.  I am rapidly coming to the conclusion that anyone visiting these forums who does not own a Leica would be very unlikely to ever purchase one  I know what you mean, there is some great content here too. Try hitting the fredmiranda alt image thread. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
phancj Posted February 17, 2011 Share #327 Â Posted February 17, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) @JSROCKIT I don't mean anybody posting in these forums, I understand your predicament, but there are also visitors here rather doing nothing than to enrage the once nice X1 community and somehow getting pleasure out of that .... I realize too that most of them don't even own an X1 or have used one, still any community like our X1 community should be an uplifting one, yes touching the downfalls but thriving on the qualities and hence bringing ourselves to a next level of photography, even if we do use inferior tools.... for photography has nothing to do with inferiority of tools used, it's all about the ability to create nice images within the limitations of the instruments used ... blabla ... you grab the essence hopefully :-) Â Hi Jan its been the longest while since you've posted. Welcome back. Â I try to be positive here too but often these detractors can really get on our nerves.... Â Quite often I get the strong feeling that these naysayers cannot bear to see others happy with their lives or gear or whatever. A real loser attitude I must say. Â On the other hand, there are many constructive criticisms too which are useful (like JS and Edward who DO OWN the X1 so I would be more inclined to listen to what they have to say). It's just a matter of discerning info amid all that annoying noise. Â I would have thought more than a year later the same losers who troll here would have given up and moved on but hey what do I know? Probably deep yearnings unfulfilled I think... Â How is anyone capable of anything constructive without extensively using a camera? Â CJ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stkorn Posted February 17, 2011 Share #328 Â Posted February 17, 2011 I have been reading through most of the X1 "poor AF threads" and although I do agree the AF is far from stellar I must also admit that I focus faster with my X1 than I ever will with my M8 and 35mm. Â thank you, i couldn't have said it better myself. i guess like you i must be really slow even after shooting M cameras for years. however, I honestly don't understand why people want to spend so much of their precious time complaining about AF speeds in thread after thread. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
h00ligan Posted February 17, 2011 Share #329 Â Posted February 17, 2011 ..because you guys are comparing it to manual focus cameras.. others are comparing it to modern af cameras.. be they dslr, mft, etc.. cameras that cost less and operate a lot faster. Â Of course I realize it's different needs for different people, but don't discount a different generation or market segment, comparing the x1 to other, more comparable cameras than rangefinders. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
phancj Posted February 17, 2011 Share #330  Posted February 17, 2011 Edward,  But thats it, isnt it? The X1 is not a DSLR so there can be no valid comparison.  I went from film to sony digital then several nikon DSLR and now added the X1. My experience is summarized :  1) Film to digital - loss of beautiful subtle tones in exchange for convenience 2) DSLR to X1 - loss of flexibility and speed but better portability and marginally nicer rendering  So I concede I am stuck with BOTH DSLR and the X1 since they do things differently.  I feel I have a balanced perspective coz my dabbling in photography was at the transition stage from film to digital. I still miss film a lot but seriously think its demise may be imminent. I feel Leica has accomplished something with the digital M and to a certain extent the X1 coz thats the most "film-like" images to my eyes I see, outside of large or medium format like hassy, phase one, mamiya, etc,etc.  Why compare? The X1 will never be a DSLR and vice versa.  CJ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
elbonedeedo Posted February 17, 2011 Share #331  Posted February 17, 2011 I pitched my µ4/3 gear to go X1. My EP-1 wasn't a super speed demon with regard to the autofocus. I do miss the focus ring being on the lens. That being said, there is no comparing the IQ of the EP-1 and the X1, IMHO.  I do hope the firmware update brings faster auto focus, and a better manual distance scale, but I'm not really feeling like I am missing anything at the moment. I suppose that could change, but I'm taken by the image quality. Even my 20mm/1.7 on the EP-1 didn't perform as well in low light even being what, 3 stops faster? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
h00ligan Posted February 17, 2011 Share #332  Posted February 17, 2011 ..be they dslr, mft, etc..  The x1 is not slow compared to a dslr.. it's slow compared to dslr, micro 4/3, sony nex, some PAS, ricoh gxr  IT's also not just af.  Again, the point here is different needs for different people. I do think usually when people pay 'extra' for a 'good brand' they expect excellence.. some just made the wrong choice expecting excellence in the form of class standard performance speed in af and IO. Same thing with the m8 as I read it.. people paid a premium and were shocked with quality control issues.  I would hope by now people don't think i'm an x1 basher, hater, etc. Sometimes I feel like the most objective person on this sub-board honestly.  Can't say good or 'fanboy', can't say bad or 'hater'.. i say both.  I pitched my µ4/3 gear to go X1. My EP-1 wasn't a super speed demon with regard to the autofocus. I do miss the focus ring being on the lens. That being said, there is no comparing the IQ of the EP-1 and the X1, IMHO.  I do hope the firmware update brings faster auto focus, and a better manual distance scale, but I'm not really feeling like I am missing anything at the moment. I suppose that could change, but I'm taken by the image quality. Even my 20mm/1.7 on the EP-1 didn't perform as well in low light even being what, 3 stops faster?  That's not my experience with the gf1. Overall, i think the iq ege goes to the x1, but they are head to head with the speed offsetting the iso advantage in low light.. considering similar FOV/DOF.. though the gf1 has slightly shallower DOF. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
phancj Posted February 17, 2011 Share #333 Â Posted February 17, 2011 Edward, Â I never for a moment thought you are a leica basher. Â Neither am I a fanboy but I do like the X1 a lot. And the reason I like it so much and defend it is because I think it takes fantastic pictures for something so small, red dot or not. I throw the thing in a camo belt pouch not leather and mine has many dents on it. It is a tool and IMO a fantastic one, if taking photos is your thing. You do not see me deciding if I should get the black one, which nice bag to use, etc etc not to slight anyone with those cosmetic inclinations to each his own but I know what I buy a camera for. Â My nikon has its badge covered in black rubber and I use a black rapid strap coz it's convenient and I do not need a giant nikon logo up front similarly I do not need a camera with a big red dot to invite mugging. Â I do not pay for the leica brand, I pay for what to me is an excellent camera. Â My whole point is tools have their strengths and limitations. To work around or live with its limitations is part and parcel of using a tool, not that we do not welcome improvements made to it but to constantly harp on something that currently has no solution is to be unrealistic and to many appears to take the fun out of owning and using the camera. Sad IMO. Â Enjoy it for what it does, and when the joy is gone out it goes. Â My honest from the heart opinion, not to be antagonistic. Â Â CJ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
elbonedeedo Posted February 17, 2011 Share #334 Â Posted February 17, 2011 That's not my experience with the gf1. Overall, i think the iq ege goes to the x1, but they are head to head with the speed offsetting the iso advantage in low light.. considering similar FOV/DOF.. though the gf1 has slightly shallower DOF.Yeah, I never had the chance to play with a GF1, but the EP-1, while a fun camera in it's own right, just wan't a speed demon. The high ISO noise was just unacceptable. I would say though, that the 20mm panny lens was just magic, as long as you didn't need high ISO. Â The portability gain in the X1 is a win for me. I travel a fair amount for work, so I like that I can get a great IQ in a small package. Â Really, I'd like an M9, and have though seriously about picking up an M8 as a companion to the X1, but neither M would fit the bill for travel really, for me anyway. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
h00ligan Posted February 17, 2011 Share #335 Â Posted February 17, 2011 I've been bouncing back and forth on an m8 for a long time, since I bought the x1.. I keep coming back to my thoughts that led me to sell my m3. Â Expensive german out of warranty items are not known for their low cost of ownership.. and probably for me, I'd rather just spend up front, get a three year warranty, and have full frame than possibly spend 2/3 as much on a body in up front and repairs. Â That said, I can't justify the cost of an m9.. especially with lenses. I did however just get a new contract.. so maybe that will sway me:) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
phancj Posted February 17, 2011 Share #336 Â Posted February 17, 2011 Just stop at two lenses for the M9 altho thats easier said than done haha:D Â CJ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
elbonedeedo Posted February 17, 2011 Share #337 Â Posted February 17, 2011 I'm with you Edward, the cost of the M9 and a couple lenses.... jeez, that's a car, or another year at San Francisco Ballet for my daughter. Just tough to swallow. But damn, that image quality is out of this world Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsrockit Posted February 17, 2011 Share #338  Posted February 17, 2011 Edward, But thats it, isnt it? The X1 is not a DSLR so there can be no valid comparison.   True, but the X1 should be able to be as fast as a Ricoh GXR w/ 28mm module no? They are very similar cameras (seemingly). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
phancj Posted February 17, 2011 Share #339 Â Posted February 17, 2011 I'd say they are similar but the image processing of the X1 appears better and the DNG files more robust, so its pretty even. Even then the speed of the updated GXR is nowhere near the DSLRs. Â Of course, because the AF speed of the GXR was enhanced with the FW update, it may suggest the X1 can do likewise. We'll see. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsrockit Posted February 17, 2011 Share #340 Â Posted February 17, 2011 Blah, Blah, Blah... IQ IQ IQ... they are all good at IQ. However, IQ means nothing if you lose the shot. The bottom line is that the GXR and Panasonic G series are fast enough to get the job done while the X1 is clearly not. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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