italy74 Posted March 22, 2011 Share #1 Posted March 22, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hi while looking at Erwin Puts leicapocket file, I realized in the year I was born M4 (and also M5) were out. Now, I prefer M4 design despite the meterless thing. I see that in that file, some M4 are clearly defined "Schwarz", some others, just "M4". Should I expect there were Silver M4 (which I'd prefer) in the range from 1381651 - 1382600 ? I'm too difficult in searching one of these samples ? Thanks in advance. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted March 22, 2011 Posted March 22, 2011 Hi italy74, Take a look here Any Silver M4 1381xxx (1974) out there ?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
jpattison Posted March 22, 2011 Share #2 Posted March 22, 2011 looks like the answer is "no", I'm afraid... Leica Serial Numbers: M's Sorted by Type How about a chrome M5? John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted March 22, 2011 Share #3 Posted March 22, 2011 Hi Dino the M4 of 1974-75 are, generally speaking, all black items (some exception can exist); on the contrary, the M4s of the first years 1967-70 are mainly silver chrome (and the black are rare, and very valued if original). So if you like chrome (like me), find an item of those years (they aren't rare, easy to find in Bologna or Milano...), unless you want to have a camera of your birthyear... being me of '56... ... I had not the problem (my M4 is from 1967... but my M3 is of 1956 ) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
italy74 Posted March 22, 2011 Author Share #4 Posted March 22, 2011 Thanks Luigi.. so I should have to look for an earlier year or stick with the black one. On a side note, just by chance in my (three letters blue american IT ) company (enough hints?) works a colleague called exactly like you and has probably your same age. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Geschlecht Posted March 22, 2011 Share #5 Posted March 22, 2011 Hello Dino, Given the above from John & Luigi why not get a 1974 bright chrome MDa of which there were more than 1,000 but less than 1,400 made & ask Leica to convert it to an M4? The MDa was the range/viewfinder-less M4 used for laboratory, Visoflex, etc @ the time. Leitz offered a service for converting M1's to M2's years ago. MDa's to M4's is pretty much the same thing. Best Regards, Michael Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
doubice Posted March 23, 2011 Share #6 Posted March 23, 2011 Hello Dino, Given the above from John & Luigi why not get a 1974 bright chrome MDa of which there were more than 1,000 but less than 1,400 made & ask Leica to convert it to an M4? The MDa was the range/viewfinder-less M4 used for laboratory, Visoflex, etc @ the time. Leitz offered a service for converting M1's to M2's years ago. MDa's to M4's is pretty much the same thing. Best Regards, Michael I doubt very much that Leica still offers this conversion and converting an MDa to an M4 is hardly 'pretty much the same thing' as converting an M1 to an M2.... Converting an M1 to an M2 was 'relatively' simple - the M1's top plate was designed with the openings for the M2's rangefinder and viewfinder optics. All that was needed was to install the rangefinder optics and mechanism. No small feat, but possible. The MDa had no such openings - it was a solid top cover, without any provision for a viewfinder or rangefinder - the whole top plate would have to be changed and the complete optical and rangefinder system installed. Since Leica would have to exchange the MDa top plate for an M4 top plate, one is back to the beginning - getting a chrome M4 top plate with a serial number dating to 1974..... Even if this conversion was still available (it is not), it would cost more than a mint M4 body with a lens.... Not a very good recommendation Michael..... I would suggest following Luigi's advice - decide what is more important - a chrome finished body from 1974 or a Leica M4. If it is the M4, just get one in black. If the year 1974 is special, you may be able to find a chrome M5 but, be prepared that chrome ones are not as plentiful at black ones. With the mass exodus to digital though, there are many bargains in classic film Leicas to be had.... Best, Jan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
italy74 Posted March 23, 2011 Author Share #7 Posted March 23, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) Thanks guys, I have no rush to get it but you gave me enough food for thoughts. I'll let you know. A couple more question: what about M4/M5 viewfinder ? is it more flare prone (like M6) or more on the safer side (M3 and MP like?). How much does it affect common operations on the field? Any known specific issues to check? Thanks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted March 23, 2011 Share #8 Posted March 23, 2011 Dino If you would really like a Leica M camera from the year you were born in, then a chrome MDa with a sutable 21mm lens and bright line finder from the same year would fit the bill and the lens could be used on another Leica M too! I have a chrome MDa myself and they are certainly pretty cheap currently - far less than an M4. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
italy74 Posted March 23, 2011 Author Share #9 Posted March 23, 2011 Thanks Paul, but I'm not sure a "blind" Leica plus external finder is what I want. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted March 23, 2011 Share #10 Posted March 23, 2011 It looks like you will have to settle for black. Unless you can accept a pair of 1970 chrome M4's with consecutive serial numbers. User condition. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbo Posted March 23, 2011 Share #11 Posted March 23, 2011 Well I am really pleased to discover from the list that my M2, serial no. 947189, was born in the same year as me 1958. I wonder if my father was aware of this when he bought it or even if that was a determining factor The sun is shining today Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
italy74 Posted March 23, 2011 Author Share #12 Posted March 23, 2011 I wonder if my father was aware of this when he bought it or even if that was a determining factor That's an interesting suggestion, thanks. My "stork" is slowly flying from Ethiopia right this year.. I should consider such an idea.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbo Posted March 23, 2011 Share #13 Posted March 23, 2011 Good luck with your anticipated arrival Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
doubice Posted March 23, 2011 Share #14 Posted March 23, 2011 Thanks guys, I have no rush to get it but you gave me enough food for thoughts. I'll let you know. A couple more question: what about M4/M5 viewfinder ? is it more flare prone (like M6) or more on the safer side (M3 and MP like?). How much does it affect common operations on the field? Any known specific issues to check? Thanks. The finders in the M4 and M5 were just as good and 'flare-free' and the previous M2 finders (same magnification). The only issue with the M5 could be the body shape, which some Leica traditionalists objected to. I owned one, along with a black M4 many years ago - you do get used to the shape eventually. It was the first Leica with a built-in meter and the only mechanical film Leica with shutter speed display in the finder. The only issues to check on any camera this age are shutter accuracy and rangefinder alignment. If you decide to go this route, allow for a CLA (Clean, Lube, Adjust). Good luck, Jan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Geschlecht Posted March 23, 2011 Share #15 Posted March 23, 2011 Hello Jan, I never said it would be easy. Two things can be done. FIrst: Modify the existing MDa bright chrome top cover. Second: A blank bright chrome replacement M4 top cover can be used & the original MDa # will then be appropriately engraved on it as a record of the change & this will be kept in the records @ the factory. As far as I can tell these are the only answers in this Thread so far that give Dino an actual 1974 bright chrome M4. In this World not that many things are impossible. Best Regards, Michael Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
doubice Posted March 23, 2011 Share #16 Posted March 23, 2011 Michael, Not only would this conversion not be easy, it would be pretty nigh impossible as Leica simply do not do these conversions anymore. End of story. 1) To “modify” an existing MDa top cover would involve machining openings for the viewfinder ocular, viewfinder front window, finder illumination window and rangefinder window. Than, the complete view/rangefinder mechanism would have to be installed. Once this was done, there would be no way to attach the finder eyepiece (unless you wanted to use glue), as the M4 body mould is different. Additionally, there would be no way to properly seal the machined openings (unless you forced some sort of sealant into the openings). If you could compare MDa and M4 bodies side by side, you would hopefully see this. 2) Blank M4 chrome replacement covers are not available at Leica anymore. They do pop up from time to time on a 'well known auction site' at rather exorbitant cost. And - you would still need the rangefinder assembly, lots of labour and knowhow to finish the job. You forgot another expensive option: take a black chrome M4 top cover and have it chemically stripped. The top cover can be than re-chromed by somebody who has the technology to replicate the Leica chrome finish and who is willing to put up with the environmental issues associated with plating. Any of the above three scenarios (if possible to perform), would end up costing Dino between $3,000 and $4,000 for an M4 body. I believe Dino was looking for a sensible solution……. Actually, there many things in this world that are impossible and hard to come by. Common sense being one of them. Best, Jan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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