Backpage Posted February 14, 2011 Share #1 Posted February 14, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) With the “Firmware” thread approaching 300 posts, I think it’s time for some perspective. When I was in college (a million or so years ago), a good friend was a student at the School of Visual Arts in NYC. She majored in drawing which she did astonishingly well. She also owned the cheapest Minolta Camera with a 50mm lens. By today’s standards, that camera was junk. But here’s the thing and the reason for this post, her pictures were far superior to anyone else's in our group. She had a great eye and the camera she used was meaningless. So when I see the endless back and forth about the X1 and why the completely unproven X100 might be a better camera, I have to laugh. People!! It’s not the camera that takes pictures. It’s you!! Get a grip! Not for the camera, but for yourself. The X1 is an amazing camera. It’s not perfect. So what? It’s a hell of lot better than that Minolta my friend used way back when and her pictures are still likely better than most of ours. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted February 14, 2011 Posted February 14, 2011 Hi Backpage, Take a look here Firmware Thread Reaches 300 Posts. It's Time for Some Perspective.. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
jsrockit Posted February 14, 2011 Share #2 Posted February 14, 2011 The camera is a tool. A more comfortable tool will help you get the results you want to acheive. So YES the camera matters somehwat. We love the X1 but know it can be better (the slow AF inhibits certain types of photography in a way that cheaper cameras do not), so we await the firmware update. Your friend's Minolta was based on numerous years of tweaking manual cameras so Minolta had a proven formula. Digital cameras are still in their infancy. I think it may be more of man vs. woman thing really. Most women I know who photograph tend to use one or two cameras and just use them. Most men I know who photograph (and don't do so prfessionally) obsess about gear while using many cameras. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
elbonedeedo Posted February 14, 2011 Share #3 Posted February 14, 2011 AF speed notwithstanding, I really like that the 'manual' aspect of the X1 has slowed me down. It's kind of brought me back to my days with a Pentax K1000. Sure, there are some differences, but the whole aspect of manually selecting your speed/aperture based on what you want, versus some built in algorithm choosing for you for optimal exposure (not artistically optimal, technically optimal). It's nice to have a compact that actually works like a camera, and not a gadget that needs tweaking. That's the allure for me. So yes, if an AF update happens and maybe a distance scale update happens, that will be nice. But, I don't necessarily feel held back or let down by what is available now. It's like any tool; you have to take the time to learn it's subtleties before you can truly use it to full effect. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Backpage Posted February 14, 2011 Author Share #4 Posted February 14, 2011 @jsrockit - Most men I know who photograph (and don't do so professionally) obsess about gear while using many cameras. That is a very inciteful comment. Why are amateurs obsessed with this stuff and not the pros? I think it's because pros only care about the output of their tools and think less about whether a camera looks better in black or chrome. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
earful Posted February 14, 2011 Share #5 Posted February 14, 2011 i've kind of become a believer in the squeaky wheel theory. i own a k5 and several nice primes to go with it. before that i owned a k10. i used to roll my eyes about all the whining from pentax owners about various imperfections - i knew when i bought the k10 it was far from perfect. but now i think the whiners made a difference with their feedback to pentax. i could be wrong, of course. no way to know for sure, but i wonder how many improvements there would have been without feedback (whining) from customers? as far as the x1 is concerned, the fact that i love it doesn't mean there's no room for improvement. i'm looking forward to those improvements as much as anyone - despite no intention of selling or shelving my x1 in the interim. and if anyone asked me right now about buying one, i would definitely hedge. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted February 14, 2011 Share #6 Posted February 14, 2011 Most men I know who photograph (and don't do so prfessionally) obsess about gear while using many cameras. I don't, and I'm not a professional. I suspect that I'm not the only one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsrockit Posted February 14, 2011 Share #7 Posted February 14, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) @jsrockit - That is a very inciteful comment. Why are amateurs obsessed with this stuff and not the pros? I think it's because pros only care about the output of their tools and think less about whether a camera looks better in black or chrome. Yeah, that and they may be too busy to care. That said, Araki-san sure seems to use a pleathera of cameras. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsrockit Posted February 14, 2011 Share #8 Posted February 14, 2011 I don't, and I'm not a professional. I suspect that I'm not the only one. Yes, that means you fall outside of "most" in my scientific experiment. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted February 14, 2011 Share #9 Posted February 14, 2011 That's OK then. Just so long as we have that straight... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
earleygallery Posted February 14, 2011 Share #10 Posted February 14, 2011 With the “Firmware” thread approaching 300 posts, I think it’s time for some perspective. When I was in college (a million or so years ago), a good friend was a student at the School of Visual Arts in NYC. She majored in drawing which she did astonishingly well. She also owned the cheapest Minolta Camera with a 50mm lens. By today’s standards, that camera was junk. But here’s the thing and the reason for this post, her pictures were far superior to anyone else's in our group. She had a great eye and the camera she used was meaningless. So when I see the endless back and forth about the X1 and why the completely unproven X100 might be a better camera, I have to laugh. People!! It’s not the camera that takes pictures. It’s you!! Get a grip! Not for the camera, but for yourself. The X1 is an amazing camera. It’s not perfect. So what? It’s a hell of lot better than that Minolta my friend used way back when and her pictures are still likely better than most of ours. I have to take issue with this. In what way is the X1 better than your friends Minolta? I suspect she was using one of their film SLR's with a Rokkor lens? Hardly junk. Minolta made very fine cameras (some Leica SLR's and lenses were based on Minolta designs) and don't forget, her camera had a 'full frame' sensor! As you say, it's the photographer not the camera that really makes the images, so no need to rant about the X1 v X100 either! That said, the equipment one uses does matter - I know I can work more comfortably with a camera that handles like the more traditional models, with a proper viewfinder and the kind of controls I'm used to. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecaton Posted February 14, 2011 Share #11 Posted February 14, 2011 With the X1, Leica has repeatedly over promised and under delivered that is the real issue here. Read e.g. Leica's web page concerning the X1's AF performance, their statements (yes plural form) concerning release dates of FW updates to address the camera's substandard AF speed etc. Utterly unprofessional by Leica and clearly not up to the benchmarks set by competitors, be they small or big companies or small camera divisions of large corporations. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiILX1 Posted February 14, 2011 Share #12 Posted February 14, 2011 I have to take issue with this. In what way is the X1 better than your friends Minolta? I suspect she was using one of their film SLR's with a Rokkor lens? Hardly junk. Minolta made very fine cameras (some Leica SLR's and lenses were based on Minolta designs) and don't forget, her camera had a 'full frame' sensor! I have to agree with this statement. I fixed my father's 1979 XG-7 and have a 50 rokkor-x and a 200mm Celtic for it. The quality isn't something to be made fun of at all. Although I prefer the IQ of the X1 (and the workflow) when I go to shoot action I have to take the Minolta. The X1 is just such a frustrating experience. For example, yesterday I had to shoot lion dragon dancers or something like that at a Chinese new year ceremony. After about 30 minutes fiddling with the X1 to try and get workable shots, I finally just grabbed the Minolta with the 50. Focusing was no longer an issue, I was no longer missing the shots I wanted, and I'm sure they will turn out great like they always do with that camera. When it came down to reliability in my shots and getting the pictures I wanted when I pressed the shutter, I had to put the X1 back in my bag. I'm one of the people hoping a firmware update will at least diminish that pain a bit and make it a bit more usable. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Backpage Posted February 15, 2011 Author Share #13 Posted February 15, 2011 It's time for all of you who are so disappointed with your X1 to sell it, drop it into the nearest body of water or give it away to someone far less discerning than you are. You could also bolt it to the hood of your car and have a $2000 hood ornament. Or stuff it with Cheeze Whiz and mount it over your fireplace. Whatever you do, don't take any more pictures with it as you might seriously injure your mental health...if you haven't already. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiILX1 Posted February 15, 2011 Share #14 Posted February 15, 2011 I wish it was so simple- the best shots from the Minolta (or any other camera I've owned) don't compare in IQ to my X1. "it's complicated" The X1 is a great camera- there are just some things it can't do well. I'm hoping the firmware will change that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
elbonedeedo Posted February 15, 2011 Share #15 Posted February 15, 2011 I think the 'one size fits all' 'all things to all people' paradigm just doesn't fit here. But with what camera does that fit? Heck, I still have my Kowa 6x6 because it does things my digitals can't. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Photoskeptic Posted February 15, 2011 Share #16 Posted February 15, 2011 I know when I receive mine I will adapt to it because I'm a photographer first and foremost. I will bend the equipment to my will (as I always have ). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
phancj Posted February 15, 2011 Share #17 Posted February 15, 2011 i've kind of become a believer in the squeaky wheel theory. i own a k5 and several nice primes to go with it. before that i owned a k10. i used to roll my eyes about all the whining from pentax owners about various imperfections - i knew when i bought the k10 it was far from perfect. but now i think the whiners made a difference with their feedback to pentax. i could be wrong, of course. no way to know for sure, but i wonder how many improvements there would have been without feedback (whining) from customers? as far as the x1 is concerned, the fact that i love it doesn't mean there's no room for improvement. i'm looking forward to those improvements as much as anyone - despite no intention of selling or shelving my x1 in the interim. and if anyone asked me right now about buying one, i would definitely hedge. Precisely my thoughts all along. Many X1 owners make it seem almost unusable right now. Strange coz you can feel they still like it, or want to like it. Meanwhile mine is taking great photos (to me at least). It's time for all of you who are so disappointed with your X1 to sell it, drop it into the nearest body of water or give it away to someone far less discerning than you are. You could also bolt it to the hood of your car and have a $2000 hood ornament. Or stuff it with Cheeze Whiz and mount it over your fireplace. Whatever you do, don't take any more pictures with it as you might seriously injure your mental health...if you haven't already. I know when I receive mine I will adapt to it because I'm a photographer first and foremost. I will bend the equipment to my will (as I always have ). Exactly. Went to your site, some gorgeous shots there! What gear are you using right now? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiILX1 Posted February 15, 2011 Share #18 Posted February 15, 2011 I know when I receive mine I will adapt to it because I'm a photographer first and foremost. I will bend the equipment to my will (as I always have ). Totally- and most do- but you also just have to take it for what it is. Take it from all of us who use it- as of now, it can't be used for crazy fast action (unless you want to have a nervous breakdown as some sarcastic person above suggested). You can't will it into being a DSLR any more than you can will yourself into being Napoleon. You can still really enjoy it for what it can do though. Precisely my thoughts all along. Many X1 owners make it seem almost unusable right now. Strange coz you can feel they still like it, or want to like it. Meanwhile mine is taking great photos (to me at least). Phancj you know I love my X1 and I think I take great pictures with it too. I also think describing it as unusable is ridiculously over the top. Also, I use it every day I'm not a museum piece photographer like some are. However, that doesn't mean I need to be stubbornly thick-headed and refuse to admit that it can't do action shots well. I'm 110% for the X1 90% of the time- that's a good way of putting it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan States Posted February 15, 2011 Share #19 Posted February 15, 2011 With the X1, Leica has repeatedly over promised and under delivered that is the real issue here. Read e.g. Leica's web page concerning the X1's AF performance, their statements (yes plural form) concerning release dates of FW updates to address the camera's substandard AF speed etc. Utterly unprofessional by Leica and clearly not up to the benchmarks set by competitors, be they small or big companies or small camera divisions of large corporations. Boo...Hoo....there are tons of people doing fine with the X1....maybe its not the camera.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
phancj Posted February 15, 2011 Share #20 Posted February 15, 2011 Totally- and most do- but you also just have to take it for what it is. Take it from all of us who use it- as of now, it can't be used for crazy fast action (unless you want to have a nervous breakdown as some sarcastic person above suggested). You can't will it into being a DSLR any more than you can will yourself into being Napoleon. You can still really enjoy it for what it can do though. Phancj you know I love my X1 and I think I take great pictures with it too. I also think describing it as unusable is ridiculously over the top. Also, I use it every day I'm not a museum piece photographer like some are. However, that doesn't mean I need to be stubbornly thick-headed and refuse to admit that it can't do action shots well. I'm 110% for the X1 90% of the time- that's a good way of putting it. I do not bring the X1 if I am shooting a football game. But I seriously think many who rant about the X1's AF speed make it seem almost unusable, which is far from my own experience of it. You buy a camera for its strengths, and accept its shortcomings. As with everything in life. We have a choice. Boo...Hoo....there are tons of people doing fine with the X1....maybe its not the camera.... +1. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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