Should I take the M9 jump!

[MikeD700]

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"So in short, I'm undecided... :)"

 

 

@Richard: Pffffff (wiping brow), that's a relief.

 

For a moment, reading your, obviously cobbled together from random arguments, half-truths, fabrications and utter lies, rather forced exposé against the M9 (the horror, the horror), I thought you'd robbed us of the opportunity of reaching 2k posts on this thread you so kindly started.

 

"Undecided". That's not really "Close to a decision" now is it? It's more like "A bit farther from a decision".

 

We'll get there!

[pimver]

Hi all,

 

 

 

The metering of the M8 is... well... let's say 'less sophisticated' than from the X1 that - to me at least - seems better balanced and much more consistent. Not a small point. And last, the highly praised unobtrusiveness and silence of the Ms. That one must go to the X1 too imo. It's smaller and whisper quiet compared to the M8 (which is plain loud) and the M9.

 

 

Richard.

 

HI,

 

I can understand most of your points, however on the metering please mind the following:

 

I have gone pretty much the same way as you did, up to the fact that we have both been customer at the same place albeit for me so far for my Nikon gear.

So when I joined this forum and spotted your thread, I found out about the loaner M8 and picked it up a day after you brought it back.

 

When I brought it back my major disappointment with the M8 was the metering. Now having picked up my M9 from Pieter, I must say the metering with the M9 is much better than the M8

So far I am very happy I took the jump

[Clive Murray-White]

All I can say is that its always far easier to argue yourself out of something than into something.

 

I think the great thing about this thread is that it exposes just how good the M8 is/was and it is far easier to justify buying an M8 than a M9. Someone said a few pages back, at current prices M8 works out as a refundable down payment on M9 with the added advantage that you start building your little stock of fabulous lenses. M9 will come down in price? so its win win.

 

I actually think it's a great mistake to get bogged down in ISO numbers etc as what is great about a Leica picture is that it is different.

[jaapv]

I don't have your experience with M files but I find that a pretty bold statement. Based on my own experience and what I've seen & read around the web I don't agree. The X1 doesn't have ISO 1250 but definitely not at 1600.

Not my opinion. for instance: ISO 1250:

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[MikeD700]

I'm totally with you Clive. I've seen so many beautiful M8 (and some M9) pictures that I can only think the drawbacks cán be overcome. If I weren't an slr man I'd get myself an M8.2/28 or 35 combo, used preferably.

 

On the other hand, magenta casts or corners still seem to rule, even in M9 land.

 

Great men always have the choice of three options: do it, don't do it, argue. They usually don't choose the third option...

 

 

 

It's like Abraham Lincoln (a great man): shall I go to the theatre tonight, shall I not, or shall I argue about it with my wife?

[Clive Murray-White]

Mike - Re: Abe Lincoln - was the theatre on his schedule, if so he may not have had a choice.

 

Newbie question alert!! I think I need to get a lenshood for my Summicron 50 version 4, I'm not inclined to search for an expensive original, I think the clip-on type which according to some wasn't that great anyway. There seems to be quite a few "for Leica" cheap ones around - any worth recommending? any links?

 

I guess my personal criteria would be, minimum amount of lenshood visible through view finder - v - opperating effectively, Or any arguments about wether one really needs one.

 

Thanks in advance Clive

[RichardM8]

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What was your thinking this time Mike? What I lack in decorum, I make up for with an absence of tact?... Or revitalize the word obnoxious?...

 

 

Most of my part in this thread is about the consideration to buy a Leica M to replace my X1. The 'start' of the process, the trail of the M8. And now I just shared my thoughts a little while later not having an M around to hold and admire.

 

@Clive, yes I agree that to argue away from a purchase is easier than into it. But I do think both are - or should be - part of a decision that involves a considerable investment.

 

There is a lot to say in favor of getting an M8/8.2 instead of a new M9. I thinking about this too. If anything it takes away a large part of the massive depreciation that inevitably comes with a new M9.

 

 

@Jaap, tnx for posting the image. But at this size it doesn't tell me much. With careful processing I can make an ISO 1600 image from the X1 look like ISO 100 in this size.

 

 

Richard

[ThorkilB]

nice shot Jaap without any signs of grain. But perhaps Richard is a bit right. And what I've seen, it seems that one should not get higher than 800 iso unless you are willing to "pay the price"

But what about colors? I've seen a lot of M8 shots that seemed a bit wierd in the colors (incl. in the LFI-magazin) and here it seems that the M9 colors are more spot on (and are more "bold" in the good sense of the word, without beeing overdone), and here it looks like the X1 and M9 are walking hand in hand.

[ThorkilB]

richard...

speeking against it (the M8 in favour of the M9) could be:

- colors

- the x1,5 faktor

- file size (for printing A3+/A2)

[wlaidlaw]

Not my opinion. for instance: ISO 1250:

 

Jaap,

 

Your other half may be pressing for a kitchen upgrade. Don't let her see the bill for that Noctilux ;-}}

 

Wilson

[jaapv]

What was your thinking this time Mike? What I lack in decorum, I make up for with an absence of tact?... Or revitalize the word obnoxious?...

 

 

 

Most of my part in this thread is about the consideration to buy a Leica M to replace my X1. The 'start' of the process, the trail of the M8. And now I just shared my thoughts a little while later not having an M around to hold and admire.

 

@Clive, yes I agree that to argue away from a purchase is easier than into it. But I do think both are - or should be - part of a decision that involves a considerable investment.

 

There is a lot to say in favor of getting an M8/8.2 instead of a new M9. I thinking about this too. If anything it takes away a large part of the massive depreciation that inevitably comes with a new M9.

 

 

@Jaap, tnx for posting the image. But at this size it doesn't tell me much. With careful processing I can make an ISO 1600 image from the X1 look like ISO 100 in this size.

 

 

Richard

No you cannot. It will be smeared in microcontrast and look digital.

[RichardM8]

richard...

speeking against it (the M8 in favour of the M9) could be:

- colors

- the x1,5 faktor

- file size (for printing A3+/A2)

 

 

Hi Thorkil

I didn't see any color issues with my trail M8. Maybe a matter of firmware and IR filter? The crop size is 'only' 1.3 for the M8x, 1,5 for the X1. I can't comment on the prints but I don't do large prints.

 

The M8.2 would be my choice btw.

 

 

Below a simple example of a high ISO X1 shot reduced in size. ISO 1600 f/2.8. 1/10sec handheld. Not 100% sharp but the resizing squeezes out the visible noise and increases perceived sharpness. Sorry for the few blown highlights though... :-)

 

[ThorkilB]

Hi Richard

Okay...then perhaps it should be an used-M8.2-jump, and keeping the X1(still more pocket-portable than an M)

Still think (or hear all the others state that..and still believe I can see it myself around allthough your shots had nice colors...but dont know how much time you spend on processing...where I am a bit lazy/impatient) there is an issue about better an visibel quality in the M9 files...(I'm convinced that if I jump it must be the M9, instead of M8.2, or stay on the ground using my M6 and get scanning help)

Thorkil

ps. now you got a picture on...I must say THAT I like, nice!, and here on the screen it looks like it fully compete with a M9 picture.

pps perhaps I should take a X1 jump instead (but my Elmarit etc. will feel so lonely)... :-)

ppps but still need the wide shots taken buildings inside/outside

pppps but the X1 as the pocket, street and hollyday/family-camera, keep my D3 for buildings (and wait for a D800 for the 14-24).....hhhhmmmmm

[ThorkilB]

ps impressive result for a 1/10 sec handheld (you have kept your breath)

[RichardM8]

Heheheheheh.... considerations, considerations ehh?...

 

Yes I think I held my breath.

[ThorkilB]

yes...if I was a wealthy man...(a lot would be easier)

[jaapv]

Still waiting what the Fuji Finepix X100 will be like

[MikeD700]

What was your thinking this time Mike? What I lack in decorum, I make up for with an absence of tact?... Or revitalize the word obnoxious?...

 

 

T-i-c.

[ThorkilB]

Still waiting what the Fuji Finepix X100 will be like

Yes, that approch with the X100 i like, but it must have the same drawbacks:

- no wheel for manual distance-settings (and therefore no full control ...combined with some shutter-lag..)

- no interchangeble lenses

- still my wide-M-lense would fell lonely

(but yes I've ben thinking of it as a pocket alternative...but will it compete with the X1 in image-quality..?)

Thorkil

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[ThorkilB]

ps

and the shutter-lag is also an issue I think

The M6, when you had it all preset, can just become THAT extension of your mind and body...because it takes the picture in THE same instance your finger is pressing...and thats a RELIEF compared with compact-cameras as Pana LX-3, E-PL1 i gues, Sony NEX-3 (on which I else could put on a 15mm Voigtländer or the 21mm Elmarit x1,5 factor, the E-PL1 x2 factor which is no good)(just as a P&S-camera)

But I can understand that there is a fair amount of shutter-lag in the X1 and just a little bit in the M9 (shall only guess the shutter speed and iso)?

So X1 would also be a compromise as the X100 etc. would be.....

hhhmmmmmm

(still the M9 must be the nearest thing...beside the huge cost)

(but perhaps the X1 will be the second-place one)(think it will compare with the film-Leica-minilux, which has taken some really nice shots for me)