Purple colouring top left only?

[dwbell]

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Hi all,

 

First post, first time Leica user. M9 with 35 cron asph. Only been through first 500 images or so, getting used to the differences between RF and SLR. I'm noticing a distinct purple tinge to the top left of my images. It doesn't seem to be any sort of fringing I'm used to as it's not confined to edges or local high contrast, just like a subtle purple vignette, however only in the top left?

 

Is this sensor problem, is it specific to RF, is it even a "problem" - it's certainly a pain to fix in PS?

 

Kind regards,

DWBell

[ho_co]

DW--

Welcome to the forum!

 

From your description, this may be the "red edge syndrome" that some have experienced with the M9. Use the forum search function ("red edge," "purple edge," "magenta edge" etc) for examples and more information on that.

 

Not uncommon with some bodies and some lenses, though IIRC, a 35 mm focal length doesn't usually show the problem. Can be corrected with the program CornerFix (CornerFix | Download CornerFix software for free at SourceForge.net), since it's obviously bad enough to be noticeable.

 

You might also want to post a sample here, since what I'm saying is just guesswork.

[dwbell]

Thanks for the welcome. Here's a sample (not a great image, just wanting to see if it's all four corners or only one) Seems it may be left hand side only.

 

I'm trying corner fix - many thanks for the link. Not willing to pass any judgements etc until I've learnt the camera, and it me. I will say do love shooting with it though.

 

Kind regards,

DWBell

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[250swb]

The first question is, is the lens coded? But the answer so far from me is that I've never seen purple edge on any of my 35mm Summicron Asph photo's.

 

Steve

[adan]

Well, part of the problem is you have an overall "pink cloud" problem, as revealed by giving a heavy saturation boost to your image. Even the clouds in the center are pink, as are the ones on the right.

 

(Block-y artifacts due to the jpg compression you needed to post to the web, as amplified by saturation)

 

Since the upper-left corner has more clouds, it naturally shows more pink.

 

However, that doesn't mean that the "red edge" phenomenon is not also playing a role, especially if your lens is in fact not corrected for - by coding, or manual selection from the menu list.

 

I see a touch of brown/yellow creeping into the grass in the corners, so likely there is some red-edge effect. Red + green = yellow; red + blue/magenta = magenta

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[dwbell]

Forgive my newbie-ness. Camera is on "auto" - how do I know that it is detecting correctly.

I'm sure it is coded, it's brand new?

[Artichoke]

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Forgive my newbie-ness. Camera is on "auto" - how do I know that it is detecting correctly.

I'm sure it is coded, it's brand new?

you can do this from the menu options

I find manual coding more reliable & as I have many uncoded lenses, I tend to use manual coding all the time

it looks as if you have this lens improperly coded

I have to remember to set the code when I change lenses & I am getting better at that

[adan]

Press the "INFO" button.

 

In shooting mode it should report the lens currently mounted down below the battery/SD card bars. E.G. "Lens: (red box) 35 f/2".

 

In review mode it should report the lens it sensed for any particular picture. E.G., top right, "35mm"

[ho_co]

Thanks for the example, DW! You're right, that's definitely ugly. And extremely unusual. But the guys here can help figure out why it's happening.

 

You're not using a filter on the lens, are you?

 

Are you shooting RAW or JPG?. If the latter, you may be starting with too high a setting for Saturation. That could amplify an otherwise invisible "red-edge" problem, but you shouldn't be seeing anything like this with the current 35 Summicron.

 

With the M9, using "auto" can mean a number of different things. If you're in "Snapshot" mode, Lens ID is automatically read if present, and files are JPG only, so CornerFix won't help.

 

 

As to the lens coding, as Andy said, the first check is whether the camera recognizes the lens used.

 

If not, there could be two reasons:

1) Maybe you don't have the camera set to read the Lens ID. See manual page 124. (Not applicable in "Snapshot" mode.)

2) Maybe the lens is not coded, as Steve said. Check item 1.11 on the first illustration page of the manual. Does your lens have six black and white stripes on the bayonet? If so, it's coded.

[mtomalty]

DWBell,

To eliminate environmental influences,expose an evenly lit white wall or sheet of paper

Expose so that the white is slightly underexposed giving a light gray.

 

This should give you a pretty accurate idea if your camera/lens combo is suffering

from the red edge effect. (I'd say you are,IMHO)

 

Mark

[lars_bergquist]

In the camera MENU menu, the top item is "lens detection". Is it set to "auto"? If not, set it so, and try again.

 

You are having typical 'red edge syndrome'. There is also a 'cyan edge' at the right edge, but it is seldom as visible, because green is a far more prevalent colour in our subjects. But there is likely nothing wrong with the lens. It may be camera settings, or camera firmware (latest version?), or even camera hardware, though that is very unlikely.

 

If the lens is an older un-coded one, try this: Set lens detection to manual, identify your lens ("35mm f/2 ASPH") in the pop-up menu, press "set", and see if the syndrome disappears. Unfortunately, you will have to change lens identification back to auto of you mount another (coded) lens!

 

The old man from when only barrel-organs were digital

[dwbell]

Firstly, thank you all for your replies and assistance - what a strange forum! =)

 

Right, i was on auto lens detection but it was picking up 35mmf/2. (Test shot below is manual lens input but auto seems not to be the problem)

 

I shoot compressed DNG, no jpeg saved.

 

Lens is coded, checked the black and white stripes.

 

I took my studio lastolite backdrop outside this morning overcast sky, uniform illumination (didn't check it with a mete but to my eye it was flat and even). File below. Looks pretty grim to me?

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[lars_bergquist]

Is this a new camera, under warranty? You should not accept this.

 

The old man

[dwbell]

One week old tomorrow, same with the lens.

 

I'm not sure where "it's handmade, it's a range finder not an SLR etc" stops and "that's not acceptable for €8k" starts. I'm also not looking to start any typical forum slagging match, however, a very cheap canon DSLR does way better than this!?

 

So, the feeling is that this combo (new M9, new 35 cron ASPH) should be giving me better results than my test shot displays. Back to Solms? Not very confidence inspiring.

 

Kind regards

DWBell

[jaapv]

Obviously some optical vignetting is acceptable with a 1.4 35 mm lens, but red shift is something else. To one's eyes, any red shift can be aggravated by the normal optical vignetting. Can you measure the image RGB values, to assess the real problem? Btw., I suppose it has the latest firmware loaded? I would start off by sending the files to Solms and hanging on to the camera.

[dwbell]

Jaap, yes, I have the latest firmware - it was loaded when it came. (it's the cron, f/2 not the 1.4). Indeed I can handle optical vignetting, it's not just wide-semi wides, my canon 70-200 exhibits this on the 5dii. The purple shift however, just trashes skies and adds a unpleasant "feel" to the left side - visually.

 

Have sent the file to Solms to see what they advise. Suspect they're busy with photokina though, I might ask them there about it.

 

Thanks for the response.

 

Kind regards

DWBell

[ho_co]

... I'm not sure where "it's handmade, it's a range finder not an SLR etc" stops and "that's not acceptable for €8k" starts....

 

Being a rangefinder means it has a way of seeing and working that's different from that of an SLR, but doesn't mean inferior image quality.

 

Something similar to this 'red edge effect' was called the "Italian Flag Syndrome" on early Kodak professional Nikon-based dSLRs, so it has been around a long time. To my knowledge, the cause still isn't (fully?) understood.

 

I don't think any of us have seen this kind of result from a 35 mm lens. You've got the problem in spades, and Leica will unquestionably take care of it. Do keep us posted on the progress of your dealings with them.

[ho_co]

... - what a strange forum! =) ...

 

Best description I've seen of us! Welcome aboard!

 

 

... they're busy with photokina though ...

 

Case in point: you even spell 'photokina' properly with a minuscule. Like it or not, you fit in this woodpile!

 

 

Enjoy the fair.

[dwbell]

Thanks ho_co (Howard County?)

 

Basically my plan was thus:- I'm a bit OCD, I like things to be just so. Mechanically speaking I don't like that my 24-105 f/4 L has a little slack in the barrel and can slip out when you're shooting from above, there are many more examples. In terms of IQ I seriously love the images produced by the combination or Canon 300D and the plastic fantastic EF 50 f/1.8, don't laugh, go get a silver one off ebay with that lens and shoot with it, you'll be amazed. 30D, 5DmkII etc all very nice and so on (clearly the 5D is amazing in low light) but somewhere in all those cameras the image has not got the "it", the "x" that I'm after.

 

On top of that I wanted to see what all the fuss was about with Leica M's. I looked into film bodies and such but in the end the calculation suggested the M9 with a 35 cron and shoot loads for a year or so. All the benefits of instant feedback and the never ending possibilities of digital storage. The body I hope will hold some value and lens is sure to. I hope, after a minimum of one years shooting to have formed my own opinion about the whole thing. I'm open to positive and negatives, I'm pretty individual, but an opinion I shall form. Having the best of the best - a range finder, a Leica M - is it "all that and more?"

 

Anyway, I'm a week in and already using a shareware third party program to make my images half way pleasurable to look at. Not a great start I'll admit. The sharpness of the 35 hasn't cut me, maybe I was expecting too much, more likely my focus then pan skills need improvement. The body itself doesn't fit "like a glove" and doesn't "just feel like a camera should" - in fact it's down right uncomfortable and slippery, until I added the EP1 and learnt how to hold it properly.

 

But what do you know, it really is pleasurable to take pictures with and I do love the rendering, it does have "something" that allures me, it has a magnetism that my other bodies haven't had. I'm loving the restriction of focal length and exposure settings. With the markings on the lens you can zone focus, set hyperfocal focus AND see what your DOF is going to be! Why did they do away with that in SLR's? Only a week in and it's already a ride with all the ups and downs of good novel. It's the journey, not the destination.

 

I will keep the thread updated with the response from Leica. I've heard only great things about their customer service.

 

Kind regards,

DWBell

 

PS - Cornerfix is actually doing a great job with chroma 1 luminance 0 and a custom lens profile. It's just a step I could do without in the workflow to be honest.

 

PPS - Not sure if this is a hack or not but I find it useful. I have shutter set to discreet and review on release (under duration) If you want to view the image for longer having released however, you can quickly press the shutter to the second pressure point after release (and re-cock) and the image stays on the screen in play mode. At this point you can zoom etc as if you'd pressed the play button. Best of many worlds in one shooting mode.

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[ho_co]

...Anyway, I'm a week in and already using a shareware third party program to make my images half way pleasurable to look at. Not a great start I'll admit. The sharpness of the 35 hasn't cut me, maybe I was expecting too much, more likely my focus then pan skills need improvement. The body itself doesn't fit "like a glove" and doesn't "just feel like a camera should" - in fact it's down right uncomfortable and slippery, until I added the EP1 and learnt how to hold it properly....

 

1) There's a whole history behind CornerFix, which grew out of the M8's oversensitivity to IR. Luckily, Sandy's application also solves this unanticipated problem with the M9. Personally, I think the degree to which this problem occurs on your lens/camera combination will be a shocker to Leica.

 

2a) Your 35 Summicron is good, but it's one of Leica's older aspheric designs. Probably the 28 Summicron or current 35 Summilux would outperform it. Read Erwin Puts' reviews (Home).--Personal caveat: I find Puts readable and insightful. Others will recommend Sean Reid (Welcome to ReidReviews) instead.

 

2a) Could also be your skills, as you suggest. Years ago I discovered the rangefinder and found that it worked for me better than any SLR, so I'm always surprised to hear that someone is having trouble focusing it. But then, I'm not doing as good a job with it as I did back then, either.

 

3) You're right that the M9 isn't as comfortable to hold as the film cameras were. The EP1 is a big help. How Leica can have slipped up so badly on its ergonomics is beyond me. I think the titanium M9 shows they're considering whether they can't improve it.

 

 

... But what do you know, it really is pleasurable to take pictures with and I do love the rendering, it does have "something" that allures me, it has a magnetism that my other bodies haven't had. I'm loving the restriction of focal length and exposure settings. With the markings on the lens you can zone focus, set hyperfocal focus AND see what your DOF is going to be! ... Only a week in and it's already a ride with all the ups and downs of good novel. It's the journey, not the destination.

 

That's the magic of the M. You've framed it well. Personally, I almost never use my dSLR because I'm not an SLR kind of person. Some people can easily go back and forth between the two types. And others can't understand what could make a person prefer a rangefinder.

 

Those 'ups and downs' never end with Leica. From what you say, you may already have caught the Leica bug.

 

 

PS--Enjoy photokina. I think you'll find the people behind the Leica as interesting as the camera.