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Survey for Black & White analogue photographers: What kind of film are you using?

bjdejong

By bjdejong
in Film Forum

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spydrxx

spydrxx

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I hate surveys (having spent a better part of my professional career both designing and using surveys for ancillary functions in my business). There are too many variables in an unprofessional survey to make it of any meaningful value. I can only wish you the best in deriving whatever value you obtain from your survey, although I highly doubt it will produce significantly meaningful results.

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aymoon

aymoon

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Which film should I choose?

 

I suggest buying one of each type of film available to you, trying them out and then deciding which one you like best for your style of photography or for what you wish to achieve. Then just stick to what you like and don't think for one second about what anybody else is using. That's what I'm going to be doing these next few weeks.

 

What I would like to add to the discussion is, that observing some of the reactions on this forum, I become more and more interested in understanding why my surveys evoke such emotional reactions. It is really unclear to me why my questions are approached with so much suspicion.

 

Maybe because market research is a big business, and many people do not want their own personal preferences used by companies as a tool to manipulate sales and sell people things that they don't need. You obviously don't have this intention, but many are sensitive about how personal data is used, myself included, and hence the clarification of your intentions is very important when asking for this kind of information.

 

Also, by not clarifying your needs and intentions, people will assume things... for example, maybe this is an academic study. Perhaps you are simply not interested in Tri-X, but if you were an academic, then your lack of inclusion of this stock would imply sloppy research or ignorance of the subject of discussion. It's that simple.

 

Clarity, clarity, clarity :rolleyes:

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Allen in Montreal

Allen in Montreal

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Who says "Classical analogue photography seems to be under pressure"?.......

 

.

 

My retailer,

the Leica boutique and Camtecphoto in Montreal says they have sold more film last year than any year in recent memory since the Digi Boom.

Film is only now starting to find its groove after the dust starts to settle from the Digi burst.

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hendriphile

hendriphile

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Classical analogue photography seems to be under pressure.

 

This may be accurate in your particular situation. I can say that I am using more black and white film now than at any time during the last 20+ years, and I have more choices regarding film formulations and processing options than I have had in the last 40+ years.

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earleygallery

earleygallery

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The OP was commissioned by a new manager at Kodak who wants to chop Tri-X and thus meet his cost saving target, and earn his bonus.

 

Perhaps :)

 

I've flirted with digital and use it for snaps and some paid work, but I just prefer film for many reasons and continue to use it for the majority of my photography. I use a variety of films, was never one to buy into the idea of choosing one film and sticking to it, which is rather like only ever drinking one wine!

 

Certainly I don't recognise the statement that film use is under pressure, although a lot of people would seem to like to think so.

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Michael Geschlecht

Michael Geschlecht

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Hello Everybody,

 

Could I make a few observations and ask a few questions please?

 

I am just a simple person who lives in an old historic fire house and repairs old clocks for a living. I don't know much about computers and have been seriously ill for a number of years and as such have not necessarily kept up w/ modern times.

 

There are some points I wish someone would clarify for me:

 

On this Film Forum, as I speak, there are four (4) threads collecting information about people's utilization patterns of different things:

 

1. This one

 

2. Your Film Workflow.......

 

3. How Many Film Cameras.......

 

4. M2 Users - How Do You Meter.....

 

There may be others I missed. Are There?

 

I don't understand what this all means.

 

I can undersand there might be some people who would just as soon forget about Plus-X.

 

But I cannot understand how a film photographer can omit Tri-X in a significant film survey.

 

That does not compute.

 

What also does not compute is why 4 such surveys are being done @ the same time in the same place.

 

Would someone explain to me please

 

Best Regards,

 

Michael

 

Who may be another Mary Poppins but even Mary Poppins has an occasional questiion.

 

Talk to bill.

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erl

erl

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Who says it's significant?

 

No proper survey begins by presenting such a leading and negative statement such as this one does.

I think that was Michael's way of declaring it 'insignificant'. ;)

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erl

erl

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snipped.......

 

Certainly I don't recognise the statement that film use is under pressure, although a lot of people would seem to like to think so.

 

Film, just like a good beer or sparkling wine, works best under pressure.

 

Of course, in one scenario the pressure is to prevent it going flat, in the other, to keep it flat. ;)

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M5-User

M5-User

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Well, as a trend observer survey, trends can change over time, personal taste and or opportunity.

 

I only use BW400CN because no local mini lab can do standard BW w/o mailing it off.

If, I send anything out, it will be rare, as total cost is my bottom line concern.

 

I typically shoot Color anyway, and convert in post if I want BW.

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bjdejong

bjdejong

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Classical analogue photography seems to be under pressure.

 

Why did I come to this conclusion; let me provide two quotes:

 

From the 2009 annual report from our beloved Tri-X Manufacturer:

"Net sales of Film Capture decreased 38% compared with the prior year due to secular declines in the industry."

The Fuji annual report states similar things, e.g. for their Imaging Solutions group:

"
Consolidated revenue declined 15.8% year on year .. Due to the decreased demand for color films and other products
"

Of course, everyone of us is free to consider these kind of statements as relevant or not, but I read this as a market under pressure.

 

 

With kind regards,

 

Barend Jan

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wblynch

wblynch

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To be fair, Kodak reported even larger loss on their digital side, their film based revenue actually delivered a profit.

 

Rather than attributing it to film photography being under pressure, it would more likely be a result of the historic great recession currently underway in the United States and elsewhere.

 

Why did I come to this conclusion; let me provide two quotes:

 

From the 2009 annual report from our beloved Tri-X Manufacturer:

"Net sales of Film Capture decreased 38% compared with the prior year due to secular declines in the industry."

The Fuji annual report states similar things, e.g. for their Imaging Solutions group:

"
Consolidated revenue declined 15.8% year on year .. Due to the decreased demand for color films and other products
"

Of course, everyone of us is free to consider these kind of statements as relevant or not, but I read this as a market under pressure.

 

 

With kind regards,

 

Barend Jan

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wblynch

wblynch

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Now you have shifted your subject from film to cameras. What's your point? That is no measure to determine the pertinence of film usage.

 

Do you have any measure for the sales of used film cameras? Venues such as ebay and others seem to be extremely active.

 

Film is not dead, to the consternation of so many electronic proponents. It won't be dead for a long time since there are millions of existing cameras that people still love using.

 

Even when the large manufacturers, such as Kodak and Fujifilm, have abandoned the film market, smaller and boutique suppliers will continue.

 

And while it is still available, Kodak's Tri-X appears to be the world leader in black and white film usage.

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bjdejong

bjdejong

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Even when the large manufacturers, such as Kodak and Fujifilm, have abandoned the film market, smaller and boutique suppliers will continue.

 

I agree with this statement wholeheartedly. This is why I think it is useful to understand which types of film are actually used by many and probably will survive.

 

Cheers,

 

Barend Jan

 

P.S. The PMA report on film is also available. The problem with that one is that it is not available for free and costs almost USD 100.

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Michael Geschlecht

Michael Geschlecht

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Hello Again Everybody,

 

I'm sorry my last Post was so oblique. I guess I didn't explain things very well.

 

Could we please try again. My apologies.

 

First we have a lens survey (remember?) now a film survey.

 

Why?

 

For what purpose or use is this data being collected?

 

Please let me explain:

 

I am currently living in a parrt of the World where certain stores give some people reductions in the price they pay for certain goods in exchange for information about themselves.

 

This is often done w/ a tracking card/device.

 

The participants sometimes do not understand that what is going on is an exchange of information about themselves in trade for items sold @ a reduced cost.

 

There are many disadvantages to 6 & 1/2 years in divorce court when a number of your soon to be ex-wives are high powered attorneys but one advantage is you learn to read the fine print carefully. If it is monotonous endless droning (think of this) it is still important to read because often unnoticed inside is something pertinent.

 

Very often the more monotonous endless and droning the more important to read and consider. Sometimes that's why it was written that way. So people give up.

 

With some of these cards/devices people have sometimes signed for they may have given an authorization to that store or it's agents to access their major credit file each time they utilize the card/actuating device to secure a reduction in cost of an item.

 

That is the same major credit file one gives access to to a bank when one is contemplating buying a home.

 

Each time that person purchases a "whatever" being reduced for holders/members/etc.

 

This information is often combined w/ a person's activities in the store in question, ie: How often does one buy cloudberries while also buying the ingredients for galettes when the cost ratio cloudberries / galette ingredients is above a certain number?

 

This can be added to for example a person's salary thru their entire working career as well as how often they have been late w/ their insurance premiums.

 

There are many people/organizations who/which want to know this stuff.

 

Well, this is taking longer than I had hoped but I think now I can narrow things down.

 

Andreas has been nice enough to provide us w/ access to his Forum which we often use as an arena to trade ideas and data.

 

As such it has been remarkably efficient and educational as well as providing a great degree of pleasure for many people.

 

Many lasting friendships are made or cemented here.

 

All pluses.

 

Now to data collection specifically:

 

What is the benefit to participants in the collection of data about first lenses and now film?

 

How many hundreds or possibly thousands of responses have there been?

 

Are there equivalent or similar types of things being done w/Nikon/Canon/Hasselblad/etc sites?

 

If not - why not?

 

If yes - why?

 

How is this data being analyzed/parsed/distributed/sold/etc?

 

Where does it go after it is collected and if none of the above is being done how is it being protected from other use.

 

We have already been notified the data is not being internally held but @ least some of it is going elsewhere (telling about the "student" is notification).

 

Don't forget each person who responds to the survey leaves their calling card.

 

Sorry to take so much of everybody's time.

 

Just a few thoughts,

 

Best Regards,

 

Michael

 

BTW: Happy First Day of Photo Kino.

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