New Customer Programme For Leica S2 Lenses

[c6gowin]

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I picked this up from another S2 owner on another forum. Leica has introduced a new program for Leica S2 lenses. Basically, you can purchase an S lens now (or if you have already purchased) trade it in for a central shutter (CS) lens and only pay the difference between the published prices - no deduction for wear and tear.

 

S Lens Trade In Program

 

This new program seems like a good way to attract potential customers who have been waiting on the CS lenses before making a move. Now they can get into the system without any depreciation in lens value when switching over to CS lenses in the future.

[LeicaS2]

Very very smart option

[zeitz]

Why not just produce CS lenses now? We can't buy products already announced, yet now we have a new 35 1.4 M waiting list to get on. I just understand Leica's product strategy.

[tllabron]

Hey folks,

 

This may sound a little off, but what is the big deal about the CS option. I have used a Linhof Master Technika for a long time and, of course, I used CS shutters because that was all that I had in my Linhof lenses, but Leica mentions that the reason for the CS shutter is for electronic shooting, which suggests a studio environment. I personally have only seen two shoots where electronic flash were used. Virtually everything else is outside shooting and no one ever mentions that the pic was shot with the CS option, so I assume the FPS is what is used..

 

Do you want because "it is there" or is there some real photographic necessity that you will need the CS in the lenses? When I get my setup I can only see getting one lens with the CS option. The rest will be without it. Why increase the cost of your lenses by an extra thousand dollars each just to have the CS option.

 

Just wondering and trying to put the frustration in to prespective.

 

Tom L.L.

[mwilliamsphotography]

Hey folks,

 

This may sound a little off, but what is the big deal about the CS option. I have used a Linhof Master Technika for a long time and, of course, I used CS shutters because that was all that I had in my Linhof lenses, but Leica mentions that the reason for the CS shutter is for electronic shooting, which suggests a studio environment. I personally have only seen two shoots where electronic flash were used. Virtually everything else is outside shooting and no one ever mentions that the pic was shot with the CS option, so I assume the FPS is what is used..

 

Do you want because "it is there" or is there some real photographic necessity that you will need the CS in the lenses? When I get my setup I can only see getting one lens with the CS option. The rest will be without it. Why increase the cost of your lenses by an extra thousand dollars each just to have the CS option.

 

Just wondering and trying to put the frustration in to prespective.

 

Tom L.L.

 

Tom, depends how you use a medium format digital camera, doesn't it?

 

Haven't you ever seen a professional photographic shoot ... like those even depicted in movies with the flash going off .... pop ... pop ... pop ... done outdoors?

 

The ambient light level outside with a high shutter speed that still syncs with studio strobes is a very desirable attribute that allows use of the best aperture for the situation rather than be stopped at what a 1/125th sync speed dictates.

 

There is a reason the superb leaf shutter Rollei and Hasselblad Vs were some of the most successful medium format professional cameras of all time.

 

Personally, I'd want all of my lenses to be leaf shutter because of what I shoot. In fact they are exactly that, because I use a Hasselblad H4D/40 for my work. The S2 initially interested me, but the snail's pace of getting out the system of leaf shutter lenses made it difficult to wait. This promotion would have made me think about it as being more viable. Maybe next time around. Meanwhile, I have jobs to shoot that require a complete system of lenses and accessories.

 

-Marc

[JMacD]

A leaf shutter allows for 1/500 sec. The focal plane is 1/125.

That's two stops difference. Let's say I am out doors shooting macro in the sun with fill.

ISO 160 would then say I want to shoot f11 to f16 at 1/125, but oops, there is a breeze and even though I am on a tripod, I need a higher speed. So I open up two stops and go to 1/500 to nail movement. With focal plane, I can't do fill anymore. With leaf I can.

Same applies to a portrait. David F said he goes to 1/250 handheld to stop hand held motion, that requires leaf if he is using a flash or strobe.

 

We will learn in time why the CS lenses were delayed, but it good that they are finally coming. For an extra $1,000 they should retain value of at least that over the non. The size of the lens is built to have the leaf shutter, might as well have the capability. That's why their exchange program is such a good marketing move. Get the macro lens out now to let people see how good it is, upgrade it as fast as possible with CS.

 

That said Tom, I am getting the 35mm without the CS because I will be shooting it outside for landscape not in a studio.

[mhoersch]

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The size of the lens is built to have the leaf shutter, might as well have the capability. That's why their exchange program is such a good marketing move. Get the macro lens out now to let people see how good it is, upgrade it as fast as possible with CS.

 

It may look like a good marketing move at this time but it also seems to be a rather desperate one. The CS lenses should have been there in the first place, and trading in a used lens regardless of its condition can't be a money maker, or can it? As you can read in this thread some people simply don't want to wait years for the S2 system to materialize, and move on.

[Guest guy_mancuso]

Tom, depends how you use a medium format digital camera, doesn't it?

 

Haven't you ever seen a professional photographic shoot ... like those even depicted in movies with the flash going off .... pop ... pop ... pop ... done outdoors?

 

The ambient light level outside with a high shutter speed that still syncs with studio strobes is a very desirable attribute that allows use of the best aperture for the situation rather than be stopped at what a 1/125th sync speed dictates.

 

There is a reason the superb leaf shutter Rollei and Hasselblad Vs were some of the most successful medium format professional cameras of all time.

 

Personally, I'd want all of my lenses to be leaf shutter because of what I shoot. In fact they are exactly that, because I use a Hasselblad H4D/40 for my work. The S2 initially interested me, but the snail's pace of getting out the system of leaf shutter lenses made it difficult to wait. This promotion would have made me think about it as being more viable. Maybe next time around. Meanwhile, I have jobs to shoot that require a complete system of lenses and accessories.

 

-Marc

 

 

Agreed. Just for data sake all Hassy H lenses are leaf shutter and go to 1/800 flash sync.

 

Phase- 3 new lenses are leaf shutter 55, 80 and 110 and go to 1/800 flash sync plus 1/4000 focal shutter. Additionally coupled with the new DF body and P40+ or P65 + backs you can get 1/1600 flash sync. Works very nice and I have tested it the only issue is some transmitters will not reach that level of speed but that is changing to accommodate the 1/1600 flash sync. My Skyports can go as fast as 1/1000 and it does work.

[tllabron]

OK Guys,

 

I understand what you are saying, but I haven't been on this list very much because it seemed that Leica was giving up when it canned the R9 and I was unimpressed and with what they were doing with the M situation, especially with the cost of the new lenses, so I didn't realize that I was talking to individuals that were doing a lot of outdoor/indoor studio type work. I remember those days, but I am older now and have sold most of what I used to haul around to get the job done. I had a great portable lighting setup that I used in a lot of places. Had great "portable" stands that would stand up to almost anything short of a hurricane. They worked great outside when the power pack was hooked up to an high powered inverter and preformed like a champ as long as there was no rain.

 

It must be great to have leaf shutters that sync over 1/500th of a second. I was talking with David of Dale's Photo and I think he told me that the new Leica flash the SF58 would sync with the S-camera at almost any of it FPS speeds. It was explained to me that the flash gave out multiple flashes as the shutter moved acrossed the focal plane to light up the whole field. I assume that these are not full power flashes, but more of a fill type of exposure for the flash. Sounded good to me. In any event, it is interesting that as large as the focal plane shutter is on the "S" that it still is flash sync'ed at 125th of second.

 

I don't know if other Leica dealers are doing this, but Dale's Photo In Florida told me that they would take in trade items of older Leica camera systems. I think I might have some other Leica stuff that I could use as trade ins. I even offered my 400mm Telyt-R lens that I still have. It seems that no one really appreciates this lens beings it is a long focal length lens with slide focusing and only F/6.8, which actually is equivalent to a T stop of 5.6. It sure was a life saver in Africa. I was the only one in the group that had that long of a lens with the only other long lens around being a 300mm telephoto that a guy had in another vehicle. I did a lot of shooting with my 400mm and my 180mm that trip.

 

I guess that the shift in photography has really changed. Years ago you used to pack film and button batteries for your meters in case one died. Let me pose this question, if you were going to Africa for a shoot what would you guys take with you. I have heard a lot about thumb drives and small laptops to store your photos. Or would you just take multiple cards like to new 32 and or 64 gig cards with download speeds of 600X/400X? What about batteries; would the two be enough? David said that when he used a S2 that battery took a lot of pictures. How does heat affect these new Lithium batteries? Dealing with the cards if you storing you pics on them how would you go about keeping track of them and what is on the each card?

 

I guess that my situation with the S2 is that I look at it as a R camera on steroids. I loved my R system. When it looked like Leica was giving up on it and I was going to have send a number of my lenses to get cleaned, but with my health problems I decided just to sell as is, and now after listening to a number of the people from Leica that they are planning an R10 digital camera with older lens capability, so I guess I missed out on that one except that they probably won't be working on this project until the S2 is fully up and running. I wonder how big a 500mm for the S2 would be; granted it would only be equal to about a 350mm on a 35mm system, but it sure would be nice. I still have my small Lecia table top tripod, I was going to keep it for senitmental reasons, but I guess I will be keeping that since in one of the shoots that I read about the gentleman used this tripod to hold the camera for a night shoot on a table out of doors.

 

Well, I've got to get cracking so I will stop for now.

 

Tom L.L.

[dfarkas]

 

It must be great to have leaf shutters that sync over 1/500th of a second. I was talking with David of Dale's Photo and I think he told me that the new Leica flash the SF58 would sync with the S-camera at almost any of it FPS speeds. It was explained to me that the flash gave out multiple flashes as the shutter moved across the focal plane to light up the whole field. I assume that these are not full power flashes, but more of a fill type of exposure for the flash. Sounded good to me. In any event, it is interesting that as large as the focal plane shutter is on the "S" that it still is flash sync'ed at 125th of second.

 

 

The S2 will sync up to 1/4000th with the SF58. You are correct that it is best used for fill flash. For portraits it can be nice to be able to shoot wide-open at f/2.5, 1/4000th and have some nice natural fill.

 

 

I guess that the shift in photography has really changed. Years ago you used to pack film and button batteries for your meters in case one died. Let me pose this question, if you were going to Africa for a shoot what would you guys take with you. I have heard a lot about thumb drives and small laptops to store your photos. Or would you just take multiple cards like to new 32 and or 64 gig cards with download speeds of 600X/400X? What about batteries; would the two be enough? David said that when he used a S2 that battery took a lot of pictures. How does heat affect these new Lithium batteries? Dealing with the cards if you storing you pics on them how would you go about keeping track of them and what is on the each card?

 

 

We were just on a professional high-end fashion shoot where the photographer shot 160GB (about 1800 frames) with the S2 in under five hours.... on one battery and he still had 1/3 charge left. You could easily get by with 2 or 3 batteries for a week-long shoot. My current philosophy is now to travel light and just shoot to cards. Four 64GB cards would give you 256GB of shooting capacity (~3500 shots). For most people this is plenty. For organization, you can generally just shoot and let Lightroom organize files by date and time. You can then create folders for each location/subject and drag and drop within LR. I just number the cards on the backside (1, 2, 3, etc). Simple is good.

 

I've also found that the S2's rear LCD is sharp and color-accurate enough to gauge the results that I am getting while shooting or reviewing in the evening.

 

Heat and cold don't seem to effect the S2's lithium batteries as much as older alkalines and rechargeable NiMHs. I have a customer who was in freezing (and raining/snowing) conditions for a few days and shot hundreds of pictures without a single recharge.

 

 

I still have my small Lecia table top tripod, I was going to keep it for sentimental reasons, but I guess I will be keeping that since in one of the shoots that I read about the gentleman used this tripod to hold the camera for a night shoot on a table out of doors.

 

 

That "gentleman" was me in Savannah.

 

The vibration of the camera is so minimal that that little Leica table-top tripod really does the trick. I think you will definitely get good use out of it.

 

David

[Grummz]

Silly question?

 

I'm assuming that if you upgrade to the CS lens later, you'll still be able to use the Focal Plane shutter? In other words, are the CS lenses selectable between both options for the best of both worlds?

[wildlightphoto]

I'm assuming that if you upgrade to the CS lens later, you'll still be able to use the Focal Plane shutter? In other words, are the CS lenses selectable between both options for the best of both worlds?

 

IIRC the FP/CS switch is on the camera body so the answer to your question is yes.