ho_co Posted May 26, 2010 Share #321 Posted May 26, 2010 Advertisement (gone after registration) Drop the M's special microlenses. As I suggested above: ...Sounds exactly like the digital CL so many have been requesting: Limited range of lenses designed for its specific capabilities. Limited usability with M lenses. But full usability with R lenses, even if only with stop-down metering. And price-point. At half the price of the M, another "Cheap Leica." ... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted May 26, 2010 Posted May 26, 2010 Hi ho_co, Take a look here The M10 or a new camera line? [Merged]. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Rick Posted May 31, 2010 Share #322 Posted May 31, 2010 Stefan Daniel 2009 (Luminous Landscape interview on M9 launch)Leica M9 Stephan Daniel Interview on Vimeo This really is an excellent resource for any interested in hearing Leica Camera's current thinking and of course it's far more authoritative than anything we speculate here. Interestingly, Stefan does suggest that CMOS with Live View IS possible (but not definite) for a future M. Some text following may be slightly paraphrased. "The question for us is really do we want to move in that sharkpool of the dSLR" "A classic dSLR as you know it from Canon, Nikon, Sony, Olympus something is not going to happen from Leica" "Our connection with Panasonic will concentrate on compact cameras. We will not launch a cooperation or own developed micro four thirds camera" When asked about a collaboration with,Panasonic to produce an M mount 'digital CL' "No, it is not an option... Because the M is our heart" On function complexity: "If you compare to the initial M8 we have added a lot of functions,... For my taste we are at the end of what we should do for the camera otherwise it will change its spirit. We have to be very careful not to overload it with everything that is possible. On features it is OK but we shouldn't do more". . Hoppyman, this is very good text and then add to this the way Stephen holds the M9 in the video and you can clearly see he is very proud of his M9 just how it is. He knows what product he is selling. He is a lot like Jobs when he say's Apple sells desire. The M is a camera, that represents a concept, that evokes an emotion. Change the concept too much and you lose the emotion and the sales. Now, on the lighter side ... There has to be room for the EVF electronics and port and everything needed for it under the flash shoe on the top plate. All that is in there is air and the rangefinder. There has to be some room in the visual pathway of the rangefinder for some more circuit boards and wires. I purpose making the rangefinder mechanism smaller and using cheaper optics because it will become superfluous once we have a EVF and it will be relegated to a mere cosmetics nod to the old M system of rangefinder focusing. I predict that eventually the EVF will push its way right into rangefinder window and will completely replace the entire rangefinder mechanism. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riley Posted May 31, 2010 Share #323 Posted May 31, 2010 I think its a real shame they kept with the re-badged compacts and didnt upgrade that to the micro four thirds strategy. I cant for the life of me see where contract built X1 would be all that different from a Leica designed mFT and a small but sweet set of lenses. But thats another story I guess. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted May 31, 2010 Share #324 Posted May 31, 2010 ...I cant for the life of me see where contract built X1 would be all that different from a Leica designed mFT... DoF i guess. APS is the best compromise between FF and small sensor cameras IMHO. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted May 31, 2010 Share #325 Posted May 31, 2010 ... Now, on the lighter side ... There has to be room for the EVF electronics and port and everything needed for it under the flash shoe on the top plate. All that is in there is air and the rangefinder. There has to be some room in the visual pathway of the rangefinder for some more circuit boards and wires. I purpose making the rangefinder mechanism smaller and using cheaper optics because it will become superfluous once we have a EVF and it will be relegated to a mere cosmetics nod to the old M system of rangefinder focusing. I predict that eventually the EVF will push its way right into rangefinder window and will completely replace the entire rangefinder mechanism. Ah, Master of Irony! Brilliant! People are already complaining that the current rangefinder isn't accurate enough, so let's make it cheaper. (After all, it's the heart of the M and the most expensive part of the camera. Good place to save money. ) And as you say, Mark Norton's teardown showed that there isn't any place to add an external PC socket because of the way so much is already crammed into the top. So let's cram in more! Seriously, I think you've hit it, as have a lot of others here. There'll be an M10, but a totally different concept is on the way. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riley Posted May 31, 2010 Share #326 Posted May 31, 2010 DoF i guess. APS is the best compromise between FF and small sensor cameras IMHO. I dont know that its the 'best' compromise however it is shallower than mFT with fast lenses, how fast is the X1 lens? there is a 0.54 stop to Canon APSC, and 0.72 of a stop to Nikon/Sony/Pentax APSC Im not sure how big the X1 sensor is so,.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoppyman Posted May 31, 2010 Share #327 Posted May 31, 2010 Advertisement (gone after registration) Howard, I do believe that RickLeica is teasing Just say NO to EVFs in M's Or as my American friends might say "Don't want no stinkin' EVF" Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted May 31, 2010 Share #328 Posted May 31, 2010 ...there is a 0.54 stop to Canon APSC, and 0.72 of a stop to Nikon/Sony/Pentax APSC.... To get roughly the same FoV/DoF as a 28/2.8 on APS-C (1.5x crop), one needs a 20/1.9 on a 4/3 camera (2x crop) if i'm not wrong. Means one good full stop difference if i'm not wrong. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riley Posted May 31, 2010 Share #329 Posted May 31, 2010 To get roughly the same FoV/DoF as a 28/2.8 on APS-C (1.5x crop), one needs a 20/1.9 on a 4/3 camera (2x crop) if i'm not wrong. Means one good full stop difference if i'm not wrong. thats right, you're wrong DoF is controlled by aperture, eventually to light reaching the sensor. Using crop factors works between formats that are the same framing eg. 3x2, but when its 3x2 v/s 4x3 you need to get to the sensor e/v. The difference then is the e/v of each sensor. or using the calculator below Online Depth of Field Calculator a 28/2.8 is 42.56mm EFL on 1.52x APSC equivalent FL on 4/3rds is 21.71mm, to get the same DoF APSC 28/2.8 @ 10ft = 4.58ft 4/3rds 21.8/2.2 @ 10ft = 4.5ft, difference F2.8 and F2.2 between .66 and .75 stops same FoV, should be 0.72 if you can calculate by hand, I dont know how to do that http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F-number sorry its such a long winded answer Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted May 31, 2010 Share #330 Posted May 31, 2010 Howard, I do believe that RickLeica is teasing ... Thanks, Geoff. My mistake. I seem to need more reminding what's real and what's not when threads get this long. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyb Posted June 7, 2010 Share #331 Posted June 7, 2010 Hello everyone, found a great concept idea for the next M series www.mizbot.co.uk/camera I think it looks pretty good, not sure if its a genuine design or whatever either way it looks pretty good.... JB Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill Posted June 7, 2010 Share #332 Posted June 7, 2010 Hmm. It looks like Flash Gordon's washboard to me. Definitely not "official", just a design-monkey's wet dream, thank God. Ghastly. Regards, Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted June 7, 2010 Share #333 Posted June 7, 2010 Where's the rangefinder? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill Posted June 7, 2010 Share #334 Posted June 7, 2010 You don't need one, Andy. A little voice just says "Flash Gordon approaching!" Regards, Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted June 7, 2010 Share #335 Posted June 7, 2010 In that case, it's not an M. It's just a 5 minute hash job in some cheap CAD program by the looks of it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoppyman Posted June 7, 2010 Share #336 Posted June 7, 2010 Check out his 'alien mouse'! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rosuna Posted June 7, 2010 Share #337 Posted June 7, 2010 I find it horrible. Sorry, but it is the truth. I imagine the M10 just like the M9, but thinner and with a different interface, more similar to that of the S2, or even simpler (just a touch screen at the back, and one button). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill Posted June 8, 2010 Share #338 Posted June 8, 2010 (just a touch screen at the back, and one button). Please God, no... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pop Posted June 8, 2010 Share #339 Posted June 8, 2010 Please God, no... Of course not. It will have a touch screen and a pen. All you have to do in order to take a picture is to write with the pen on the screen "Take picture, please". Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
redbaron Posted June 8, 2010 Share #340 Posted June 8, 2010 Lefties could use their nose to take pictures. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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