JHAG Posted October 29, 2009 Author Share #21 Posted October 29, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) I understand C1 is a relatively small people that hasn't the commercial clout of Apple or even Adobe, but it seems sensible from them to do such a limited offer. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted October 29, 2009 Posted October 29, 2009 Hi JHAG, Take a look here C1 Pro 5 - Just a test - Interesting…. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
ho_co Posted October 30, 2009 Share #22 Posted October 30, 2009 Do I understand correctly that Phase One is saying so much as: A. If you paid for version 3 or version 4, then you can upgrade to version 5.B. If you didn't actually spend money on version 3 or version 4, then there's no upgrade to version 5, and you have to buy in instead. In that case, what we got from Leica (C1 3.7) is either a dead end or a red herring, depending on how much you want to stay with Capture One. Leica got sold a bill of goods on that one. I remember C1 saying that we could get two free upgrades (which was nice and gained some friends), but I don't think we were ever told that using this one-shot free product would later lock us out of the standard upgrade procedure. Sounds to me like cutting off one's nose to spite one's face. Truly a stupid policy from Phase One, IMHO. When I worked at a university, I bought the student-discount version of Photoshop. Since then, I can upgrade to later versions via the regular route. Adobe doesn't come to me and say, 'You got in cheap once--now you have to pay through the nose.' Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHAG Posted October 30, 2009 Author Share #23 Posted October 30, 2009 When I worked at a university, I bought the student-discount version of Photoshop. Since then, I can upgrade to later versions via the regular route. Adobe doesn't come to me and say, 'You got in cheap once--now you have to pay through the nose.' Adobe just told that to my wife when she wanted an upgrade from her student CS2 to CS3. No upgrade available. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wparsonsgisnet Posted October 30, 2009 Share #24 Posted October 30, 2009 I got LE with my M8. I upgraded that for free to v.4. Just the other day, I upgraded to 4.8.3 PRO for $299. And ... just a few minutes ago, I upgraded that to v.5 for $99. Hope I'm done for a while. Going on Jamie's enthusiasm, here. [Note: the 95GB download has 22 mins of 35 to go -- and I've got fiber. Yowee!] Regards to all, Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHAG Posted October 30, 2009 Author Share #25 Posted October 30, 2009 William, Normally, 4 to 4.8.3 PRO is 229. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted October 30, 2009 Share #26 Posted October 30, 2009 Adobe just told that to my wife when she wanted an upgrade from her student CS2 to CS3. No upgrade available. Well, now that I've come clean in public, I guess the Adobe posse will be out looking for me to get me to pay up. Seriously, there's some kind of communications messup there, don't know whether at your end or mine. But it's certainly par for the course, considering the conflicting anecdotal reports everywhere about the Capture One upgrades. Gee, next thing, we'll be getting reports that gray M9s can't be produced because of fingerprint problems.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted October 30, 2009 Share #27 Posted October 30, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) Well, now that I've come clean in public, I guess the Adobe posse will be out looking for me to get me to pay up. Seriously, there's some kind of communications messup there, don't know whether at your end or mine. But it's certainly par for the course, considering the conflicting anecdotal reports everywhere about the Capture One upgrades. Gee, next thing, we'll be getting reports that gray M9s can't be produced because of fingerprint problems.... Howard, The messages have been flying backwards and forwards all evening between myself and Phase One. I have explained to them in detail how I think they are cutting off their nose to spite their face, by not offering C1 V5 Pro at an upgrade price of €229/$299 to Leica users, who originally got 3.x LE. They would make far more money by offering this and have some happy customers as well. Otherwise many of us who are getting M9's will either stick with LR, stay with the current and adequate version of C1 4.8.3 or pay the €69/$99 upgrade price for C1 V5 non-pro. I hope they will be discussing this at a management meeting today and will see the logic of what I am suggesting. So if you were considering upgrading, it might be worth holding off a couple of days or so to see if there is any good news. Some additional messages to Phase One from V4.8.3 users might emphasise that there are other like thinking people. Wilson Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wparsonsgisnet Posted October 30, 2009 Share #28 Posted October 30, 2009 William,Normally, 4 to 4.8.3 PRO is 229. That may be what I paid. I confess to having difficulty telling apart similar numbers that end in 9. I think that is the basis of ALL marketing. (Also, it's not in the same league as the price of Leica hw.) Haven't installed yet. It was too late last nite when I got the D*O*W*N*L*O*A*D completed 96 MG for cripes sake, and I find C1 installs a pita. These guys should have been the ones to design the copy protection for Hollywood. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
microview Posted October 30, 2009 Share #29 Posted October 30, 2009 Changing the subject somewhat:D:D, has anyone any comment on Nik Software's Viveza? They emailed me yesterday and it looks interesting. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted October 30, 2009 Share #30 Posted October 30, 2009 Sorry guys - tried my best but at the bottom of this post is the final response I got from Phase One. I still think they are missing the point, that they could sell a lot more upgrades at €229/$299 than they will full copies at €299/$399 but commercial reality has never been a strong point with software makers other than Microsoft and Apple. I note that the non-pro version of C1 V5, no longer offers the ability to make automatic back up copies of your DNG files to a folder of your choice, maybe on an external back up disc (if you can get the external disc to work on Snow Leopard without 10810 finder error on wake from sleep), as you download from the SD card. Wilson Wilson, Given the specifc key that you own, this is not something that we are inclined to entertain. I completely understand your position on the matter but I would humbly ask that you try to understand ours. The Key that you own was given to you for free, at least on our behalf. The key is a Leica Key and as such we generously provided these to Leica as per an agreement, the agreement being that the preliminary and secondary software would be free to those users that Leica saw fit but any subsiquent upgrades would not be free. If we were to provide you a free upgrade or discounted upgrade at this point we would be losing even further sales than what has already been lost as per this agreement. If you really want to fight for this discount I think that Leica is the one that should provide it for you as we (Phase One) has already welcomed you into our product line at no charge for more than 2 years. I have no desire to see another talented photographer go to Lightroom over our software. Nor do I wish to see you do so over something trivial such as the cost of software, which in the grand scheme of things is insignificant when compared to the quality results of your images. However, given all the factors, if you wish to move onto lightroom I fear there is nothing I can offer you to prevent it. I apologies for this and wish you luck in your future photographic endeavors. Kind Regards, Phase One Support Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHAG Posted October 30, 2009 Author Share #31 Posted October 30, 2009 Snow Leopard : 29 euros. Soon to be released LR3 : probably 99. Ap X : probably the same. CS5 early 2010 : probably less than 249 for an upgrade. And you begged him for 229 ? Tssk, C1… Thx for trying anyway, Wilson. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie Roberts Posted October 30, 2009 Share #32 Posted October 30, 2009 That may be what I paid. I confess to having difficulty telling apart similar numbers that end in 9. I think that is the basis of ALL marketing. (Also, it's not in the same league as the price of Leica hw.) Haven't installed yet. It was too late last nite when I got the D*O*W*N*L*O*A*D completed 96 MG for cripes sake, and I find C1 installs a pita. These guys should have been the ones to design the copy protection for Hollywood. Bill, download's been slow because their servers are swamped. Having said that, I got mine in under 5 minutes, even with the server slowness You need to look into faster internet! The install of V5 was simplicity itself. They need to be congratulated on that. I installed V5 in addition to V4 because I wanted to make sure all the profiles etc... have been updated. Believe me you're going to be pleased with it Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie Roberts Posted October 30, 2009 Share #33 Posted October 30, 2009 Well, now that I've come clean in public, I guess the Adobe posse will be out looking for me to get me to pay up. {snipped} Not to mention that you're in violation of your agreement with Adobe if you used your student licenses--or the ensuing upgrades--for commercial work of any kind Just thought I'd mention. C'mon guys--give C1 a break. I agree they probably should have given Bill a break since he just bought C1 v4 or something, but the rest of you who got it free from Leica, well, I don't think Phase owes you anything on the major upgrade for V5. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted October 30, 2009 Share #34 Posted October 30, 2009 Snow Leopard : 29 euros.Soon to be released LR3 : probably 99. Ap X : probably the same. CS5 early 2010 : probably less than 249 for an upgrade. And you begged him for 229 ? Tssk, C1… Thx for trying anyway, Wilson. I will grit my teeth and buy the full copy of V5 pro but then I am a pretty committed (maybe I should be) C! user. I just think this is a poor commercial decision. It is just like I went to my local car dealer to ask for a copy of an updated DVD map for my Sat-Nav. Yes certainly sir - that will be £600. As I recoiled, I asked "how many of those have you sold?" "Er well - actually none" was the answer. So they would have been far better pricing the update at £200 and selling lots, as the development costs, just like Capture One's V5, have already been spent and what they need to do is to price the product to maximise the inwards cash flow. About day 2 of an MBA course - not rocket science. Wilson Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
erl Posted October 30, 2009 Share #35 Posted October 30, 2009 I was so confident that V5 would be a winner (I read earlier comments in this thread from respected posters) that I paid my money, 69Euro (upgrade from V4Pro) and then downloaded. It installed easily, except that the Microsoft 'net' thing took for ever to download. This W/E will see some snappy procressing I am sure. Also, I am very impressed with the M9 skin tones (C1 4 Pro) using Jamie Roberts V1 profile. Will try it in Pro 5 very soon. Personally, I can't see any problems with the current crop of fantastic gear available. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHAG Posted October 30, 2009 Author Share #36 Posted October 30, 2009 I just think this is a poor commercial decision. Wilson But a kindly phrased letter though. Personally, I can't see any problems with the current crop of fantastic gear available. Yeah, I know I will buy an M9, CS5, Aperture X, LR3 andC1 V.5 Pro (cause since 2 years I cannot decide between the last three) in the few months to come, and that's why I'm complaining. Too much on my plate. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted October 31, 2009 Share #37 Posted October 31, 2009 ... The key is a Leica Key and as such we generously provided these to Leica as per an agreement, the agreement being that the preliminary and secondary software would be free to those users that Leica saw fit but any subsiquent upgrades would not be free. If we were to provide you a free upgrade or discounted upgrade at this point we would be losing even further sales than what has already been lost as per this agreement.... "secondary software would be free to those users that Leica saw fit but any subsiquent upgrades would not be free" Well, as he later acknowledges, we're not asking for "free," so that argument doesn't apply. "If we were to provide you a ... discounted upgrade at this point we would be losing even further sales than what has already been lost as per this agreement." Lost sales? Okay, I got the product free via Leica and Phase One did give me support as I tried to revert to a previous version, so they did spend money on me. But here all I'm saying is, "give me a hug and tell me I'm a valued customer, and I'll send you my money." My experience with the product has been horrible from a user-interface standpoint, but it produces good results. Here's their chance to take my $299 and make me a customer for life, paying for future upgrades--or to send me to Adobe. There's something more here than meets the eye. Wilson, when your email suggests that you should ask Leica to subsidize your C1 upgrade (!), they're saying that they've broken ties with Leica and they don't owe Leica anything. Looks to me as if the Leica departure left some very ruffled feathers at Phase One. They are pissed at Leica, and when we try to keep our own individual relations going with Phase, they'll have nothing of it, and want us to blame the intermediary. Thanks for the try, Wilson, and for keeping us posted. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHAG Posted October 31, 2009 Author Share #38 Posted October 31, 2009 There's something more here than meets the eye. […] Looks to me as if the Leica departure left some very ruffled feathers at Phase One, and not enough sales opportunities to be worth the hassle of getting us in the door for a discount. Turned down lovers… Understandable. From an output point of view, C1 V.5 gives still better results with the M8 than LR3, so it might be a smart commercial move from Leica, but IQ wise it remains to be seen. I don't know for the M9, as there seems to be no LR profile yet. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted October 31, 2009 Share #39 Posted October 31, 2009 I was so confident that V5 would be a winner (I read earlier comments in this thread from respected posters) that I paid my money, 69Euro (upgrade from V4Pro) and then downloaded. It installed easily, except that the Microsoft 'net' thing took for ever to download. This W/E will see some snappy procressing I am sure. Also, I am very impressed with the M9 skin tones (C1 4 Pro) using Jamie Roberts V1 profile. Will try it in Pro 5 very soon. Personally, I can't see any problems with the current crop of fantastic gear available. Erl, Can you confirm that the Pro version of C1 V5 retains the ability on downloading from a card, to create a back up copy of the DNG files in a folder of your choice, as well as creating the dated work folder in the C1 library. I like to keep a back up copy of all my DNG files. Sadly I lost my first six months worth, during a thunderstorm when my iBook died and scrambled the FAT on the attached external hard disc. I did try using Data-Rescue II, as all the data was still there but the files no longer had a file name and now were all named Leica 3904 x 2622. It would have taken forever to separate them out and rename them. I now keep multiple back ups on different machines. Wilson Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
erl Posted October 31, 2009 Share #40 Posted October 31, 2009 Wilson, I just check and compared 4 & 5. Pro 5 does NOT retain the provision for separate B/U as you described. I had never used it, I have a different B/U plan, but it is now absent from Ver 5 Pro. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.