stump4545 Posted November 9, 2012 Share #1 Posted November 9, 2012 Advertisement (gone after registration) why is it says that prints made from the monochrom is where one can really see the difference from an m9 conversion? why would prints make the advantages of the monochrom become more apparent over images viewed on a for ex. 27in computer screen? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted November 9, 2012 Posted November 9, 2012 Hi stump4545, Take a look here monochrom prints. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Jeff S Posted November 9, 2012 Share #2 Posted November 9, 2012 Because nothing beats a gorgeous print. This is not a Monochrom-specific phenomenon. If all one views are screen displays, a lot of money is wasted on some exceptionally fine cameras, regardless of screen quality, especially when rendering fine gradations of lustrous black/white tones on a beautiful paper. But, the making of a wonderful print results from a lot more than the camera used. I'd be interested in prints from controlled tests using both cameras. Unless controls and conditions are tight (same subject, processing etc), however, any conclusions would be difficult...and that's hard to accomplish here since each camera may require different capture techniques (e.g., use of filters), different PP actions, etc. At the end of the day, very subjective, I would guess. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
michali Posted November 9, 2012 Share #3 Posted November 9, 2012 I agree with Jeff.I posted this in reply to a similar question in another thread yesterday- I have printed several MM images up to A2 size on Ilford Gold Fiber Silk paper on my Epson 4880 printer. Having compared these prints to those which I've made with the M9 and my Hassleblad 503CW & CFV50 digital back, this is what I've seen: Up to A2 size, overall we're splitting hairs between all of them. On closer inspection when comparing M9 prints to the other 2 cameras,I start noticing differences in the overall tones of the images. The MM has deeper blacks with finer detail and the transition from grays to whites appears to be more pronounced, much like prints we used to produce in the darkroom. There is absolutely nothing wrong with the M9 images and I've printed some stunning B&W prints from the M9 which I've framed for clients. The MM does however take it up a notch or two and its results are right up there with the 50MP Hasselblad files. Having said this however, I honestly admit that up to A2 size for a finely tweaked image, it would be difficult to tell the difference. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stump4545 Posted November 9, 2012 Author Share #4 Posted November 9, 2012 i have been using a prolab for prints whcc.com and the prints I have made are on their standard photo paper. To get best print results, should I be using those fancy papers and if so any recommendations on which online lab gives you the choice to choose different high end papers? thanks a lot Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanyasi Posted November 9, 2012 Share #5 Posted November 9, 2012 I don't think it is a question of "fancy" paper. Different types of paper yield different effects. In the end you may prefer the paper the lab uses, but unless you try other papers you won't know whether something else is more to your liking. The other questions that should be asked: Are you doing any post processing, or are you leaving that to the lab? Hopefully you aren't leaving everything to the lab.. Even if you are post processing the files, you need to talk with the lab about how they are printing your prints. There are adjustments that can be made in the printing software (relative or perceptual, e.g.) Good luck. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
michali Posted November 9, 2012 Share #6 Posted November 9, 2012 There is no question that the better quality papers make a big difference to the quality of the final print. Have a look at this review on Ilford Gold Fiber Silk paper which also briefly explains why the finer papers make a difference: Ilford Galerie Gold Fibre Silk photographic paper review | Miscellaneous camera equipment, tests and specs | What Digital Camera As for online labs, I can't give you any advice, I've never used one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stump4545 Posted November 9, 2012 Author Share #7 Posted November 9, 2012 Advertisement (gone after registration) any suggestions for an online lab in the US that has a large paper selection to choose from for prints? i do pp my files and are happy with the prints that i have been getting but would like to experiment. from chemistry darkroom days, would like to get an online photo print that has the beautiful grey tones that fiber based paper provided. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanyasi Posted November 9, 2012 Share #8 Posted November 9, 2012 Except for vacation photos in my early days of photography, I've never used an outside print lab. If you live in or close to a large urban center, I would search for labs in the area using Google. Then go in and talk to them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IWC Doppel Posted November 9, 2012 Share #9 Posted November 9, 2012 Or chat to your local Leica dealer, they will usually have some relevant experience Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted November 9, 2012 Share #10 Posted November 9, 2012 from chemistry darkroom days, would like to get an online photo print that has the beautiful grey tones that fiber based paper provided. Did you make your own silver prints or use an outside service? Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnbuckley Posted November 9, 2012 Share #11 Posted November 9, 2012 any suggestions for an online lab in the US that has a large paper selection to choose from for prints? i do pp my files and are happy with the prints that i have been getting but would like to experiment. from chemistry darkroom days, would like to get an online photo print that has the beautiful grey tones that fiber based paper provided. Try Dodge Chrome. Dodge-Chrome, Inc. Home. I have used them to print Monochrom images, and they are excellent. They have a wide variety of printing options to try. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramosa Posted November 10, 2012 Share #12 Posted November 10, 2012 I agree with Jeff.I posted this in reply to a similar question in another thread yesterday- I have printed several MM images up to A2 size on Ilford Gold Fiber Silk paper on my Epson 4880 printer. Having compared these prints to those which I've made with the M9 and my Hassleblad 503CW & CFV50 digital back' date=' this is what I've seen: Up to A2 size, overall we're splitting hairs between all of them. On closer inspection when comparing M9 prints to the other 2 cameras,I start noticing differences in the overall tones of the images. The MM has deeper blacks with finer detail and the transition from grays to whites appears to be more pronounced, much like prints we used to produce in the darkroom. There is absolutely nothing wrong with the M9 images and I've printed some stunning B&W prints from the M9 which I've framed for clients. The MM does however take it up a notch or two and its results are right up there with the 50MP Hasselblad files. Having said this however, I honestly admit that up to A2 size for a finely tweaked image, it would be difficult to tell the difference.[/quote'] Thank you. I have wanted this type of input all along. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
haroldp Posted November 10, 2012 Share #13 Posted November 10, 2012 Ilford Gold Fiber Silk paper on an Epson (mine is a 4900) printer is outstanding for monochrome images. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stump4545 Posted November 11, 2012 Author Share #14 Posted November 11, 2012 thanks for the lead. i always used to make my own prints in my home darkroom and just recently got into the digital game. for b&w prints i am still preferring my own b&w analog prints because the tones just look nicer and more gradual even compared to mm images. maybe now thinks will change with this new service and nicer paper options. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted November 11, 2012 Share #15 Posted November 11, 2012 If you had your own darkroom, then you should know the benefits of doing your own. No reason you shouldn't print your own digitally with some nice papers and custom profiles. Hahnemuhle Photo Rag Baryta and/or Canson Infinity Photographique Baryta (whiter base) will do nicely for b/w. I have no problem hanging inkjet prints with these papers alongside my silver prints....and neither should you if you take the time to refine your workflow. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
algrove Posted November 11, 2012 Share #16 Posted November 11, 2012 Just noticed that B&H has USD300 discount for the 3880 again making your net USD850 with a full set of 80ml ink cartridges. Heck a full set of 80ml ink cartridges is around $500 all by itself. I was printing some Monochrom images via LR4 and SFX Pro2 tonight on Epson Exhibition Fiber Paper and they came out quite crisp in A3 with a 2" border all around. Agree the Ilford Gold Fibre Silk is very good as is the Carson Baryta.... I like the white gloves that come with it too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stump4545 Posted November 13, 2012 Author Share #17 Posted November 13, 2012 thanks for the dodge chrome lead. i dont want to my own printing due to several reasons. found lots of nyc custom print labs. anyone have any recommendations for a nyc based custom printer? thank you Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Printmaker Posted November 14, 2012 Share #18 Posted November 14, 2012 I don't think it is a question of "fancy" paper. Different types of paper yield different effects. In the end you may prefer the paper the lab uses, but unless you try other papers you won't know whether something else is more to your liking. The other questions that should be asked: Are you doing any post processing, or are you leaving that to the lab? Hopefully you aren't leaving everything to the lab.. Even if you are post processing the files, you need to talk with the lab about how they are printing your prints. There are adjustments that can be made in the printing software (relative or perceptual, e.g.) Good luck. First let me say, while I run a custom printing service, I am not soliciting any business. I have a full stable of artists and photographers that keep me hopping and I'm trying to slow down and retire. Okay, that's out of the way... Illford Gold Silk is one of my house papers. I love the way it prints monochrome images. This paper is far better than the old Illford Multi contrast RC darkroom papers. It is a great starting place for photographers who want to make their own prints. Hahnemuhle Photo Rag is no slouch either but has a whole different feel and response. The Epson hot press and cold press papers are nice too. My advice to photographers: get an Epson. A 3800, 4900, 7900 or even a 9900 will serve you well for the next 10 years. Then run it. These printers need to be used. My old 9800s run 6-8 hours a day, day in and day out. Never a problem. Each one uses a set of inks every month and consumes 4-8 rolls of paper or canvas. They are built like tanks. If you are not going to feed your Epson, then find a lab where you can sit down with the printer and talk about how you like your prints. This is important! I have a few photographers who like their prints far darker than I would make them if left to my own taste. Others like a warm tone or do not like a paper base that is too yellow. Look at samples until you find what you like and then tell the printer exactly what it is you like about the print. He or she will remember and you will be assured that you will get the type of print you are after. If the lab will not let you talk to the printer, find another lab. One last thing: do not be cheap. Custom work takes time and the waste factor is huge. Expect to pay a premium. If you are happy with crap, go to Costco. If not, pay the bill with a smile and your printer will always give great prints. Tom Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted November 14, 2012 Share #19 Posted November 14, 2012 Illford Gold Silk is one of my house papers. I love the way it prints monochrome images. Not too shabby for color as well. For a whiter base than Hahnemuhle Photo Rag Baryta, which I also like for b/w, Canson's Infinity Baryta Photographique is superb. [edit...oops, I already said this :>) ] This is a really good time for nice photo papers. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
algrove Posted November 14, 2012 Share #20 Posted November 14, 2012 thanks for the dodge chrome lead. i dont want to my own printing due to several reasons. found lots of nyc custom print labs. anyone have any recommendations for a nyc based custom printer? thank you My recommendation-get a 3880 from B&H $850. and soon the recommended printer for you is YOU. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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