jrh68uk Posted April 7, 2009 Share #1 Posted April 7, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) I've just come off the phone to leica U.K. Service. They have had my 35 f/2 ASPH for over a month now and it became clear that they haven't even looked at it yet. It needs adjustment for slight rear-focus (about 2 cm at close distance wide-open - also noticable at distance because stopping down only really seems to extend focus depth backwards). Not long ago I sent in my 28 Elmarit ASPH for a similar rear-focus issue. Within a month the lens had gone to Germany and was returned fixed and spot-on. I know my M8 is already spot-on because it's perfect with all other lenses (Leica and CV) and confirmed by the fact that my Elmarit was obviously adjusted to a known standard which agrees with my M8. I've just been told, though, that they will check my 35 and, if it really is off (it is!) I'll need to send both it and my M8 to Germany. When I queried this (using my Elmarit as an example) I was told that this was a factory requirement. I don't want my M8 touched, though - and, if they can do it with my 28 Elmarit, why not my 35 cron? So I'm expecting my lens to be returned as "correct" or some kind of request to send in my M8 as well (which I'm not inclined to do). Anyone else experience this? Cheers Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted April 7, 2009 Posted April 7, 2009 Hi jrh68uk, Take a look here 35 'cron adjustment :(. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
jaapv Posted April 7, 2009 Share #2 Posted April 7, 2009 You should have sent the Summi with it.... If you don't mind paying a bit of money to get it right, you could send it to CRR. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
glenerrolrd Posted April 7, 2009 Share #3 Posted April 7, 2009 You have somewhat of a dilemma. Here are a few things I learned the "hard way" . (1) Assuming that your M8 is correctly calibrated because all your other lenses (which are wideangles with small apertures) isn t reliable. You ability to focus and to evaluate focus accuracy may give you a false sense of confidence. Your M8 may be slightly off, your other lenses maybe slightly off and ,of course, your tests maybe slightly off. (2) Testing an M8 for focus accuracy (not just within tolerances but exactly where the focus is calibrated) requires at least a 50mm lens. In NJ one of the tests includes using a 90mm Summicron(brass mount ) . (3)Calibration of your lens can be difficult. Beyond a certain range ...that is I can pull it forward or push it back just so far.....it requires major disassembly. Some lenses are more difficult than others to get this right, Generally the Summiluxes and the Noctilux are quite difficult....the summicrons are generally OK . This is more than the difference in aperture . I had no trouble with any of my Summicrons. (4)From a practical standpoint...Leica is right to ask for the camera and the lens. Why shoot at a moving target. Make sure the M8 is calibrated not just within tolerances but to a solid midpoint . If you M8 has even minor backfocusing this should be corrected first. Then they would test the lens against their standard battery of calibration tests and adjust. Finallly they would mate the lens to your body and test them together(fitness for use). This is how it should be done. (5) You are right to be concerned that they will just adjust your M8 slightly to fix the backfocus. This is fast and simple . It might work but it might throw off your other lenses. Unfortunately the system is designed to work with and accept tolerances on both lenses and bodies. Its a tuning process that brings these tolerances together so that they offset . (6) The best way to learn about your lenses and bodies is to find another M8 user or a cooperative camera store and test your M8 and lenses against another set. You will not get exactly the same results but you will learn about the general direction of the focus error. Finding "spot on" occurs sometimes but normally its an acceptable variance that isn t seen in most images. You have two alternatives with advantages and disadvantages: (1) Send it to solms with the body. It will take forever(most of the time) but you can pay for fast turnaround. The big advantage is that they will test you body and I do believe that only Solms has the test equipment to do the complete job. Keep in mind that it includes the sensor alignment as well as the rangefinder. Personally I think they have become much better at calibration of the M8 series since its introduction. My new M8.2 and my upgraded M8 all seem accurate. (2) Send the body and all your lenses to a qualified independent repair service. The testing will be less accurate (more tuning than a quantitative analysis) but the tuning will normally bring the system into harmony. This may cost more (no warranty work) but may be faster . If I was in europe I would sent the kit to Solms and pay for the faster service. You can always fall back on the tuning as the next step. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrh68uk Posted April 7, 2009 Author Share #4 Posted April 7, 2009 Thanks very much, both, for your responses. The 35 'cron is brand new and I didn't own it at the time I decided to send in the 28 Elmarit ASPH. If I'd had it at the time, they'd have gone together I'm sure that it's the lens and not the M8 because my M8 is spot-on with my 50 'cron, my 90 Summarit, now my 28 Elmarit and also both my CV 35/2.5 and CV 21/4. There is no way I'd want my M8 adjusted to match the 35 'cron as all the others would be out. (When I bought the 90 Summarit I also tested a 90 Elmarit on my M8 whose focus appears to be identical to the Summarit; needless to say, I'm confident that my 90 is accurate as is my 50). Having spent a relative fortune on this new 35 'cron ASPH, I wanted to see how much better it was than my CV 35. How disappointed I was to see that the CV was unquestionably sharper and more detailed. It then struck me that, like my 28 Elmarit, the 35 'cron could have been slightly out. Sure enough, a slight pulling forward of focus revealed its full potential. I suppose one could assume that my M8, 90, 50 and CV35 (the 21 is pushing it a bit as it's so wide and slow) are all out and the 28 Elmarit was correct in the first place and the 35 'cron is correct, too. But that fact that Leica adjusted my 28 to internal standards, which fixed the rear-focus completely, makes me believe that the problem is with the lens. Jaap, what is CRR? Cheers, Jason Edit: It's just occurred to me: I'm sure I was told, "we'll have a look to see if it's ok or not and, if it's not, both lens and M8 will need to go to Germany." But if they determine that it's not OK, surely they can see what would make it OK and have it adjusted accordingly? After all, that's presumably what they did with the 28 and that worked a treat. I'd expect them to need my M8 if they determined that the lens was within tolerance but that I was insisting that it was out... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted April 7, 2009 Share #5 Posted April 7, 2009 A highly respected independent technical service for, amongst others, Leica gear in the UK CAMERA REPAIRS & RESTORATION - LUTON , ENGLAND Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hookeye Posted April 7, 2009 Share #6 Posted April 7, 2009 Jason, I had to send my M8 and a 35mm Summilux ASPH which was backfocusing to Solms for adjustment. In order to ensure they would not tamper with my M8, i.e. make adjustments to it that would throw all my other lenses out of alignment - I tied an ordinary luggage tag to one of the ringlets for the strap. Here I wrote: "Please do NOT make adjustments to this camera housing. It is well adjusted to ALL my other lenses. Thanks!" The camera and lens came back after 3 - 4 weeks. The M8 now focused allright with all my lenses including the 35 Summilux. Cheers, HP Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrh68uk Posted April 7, 2009 Author Share #7 Posted April 7, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) Jaap: Thank you. HP: Interesting! Odd thing is, with my 28 Elmarit adjustment, the letter of work details that came back with it indicated that they had "adjusted M8" - so I don't know whose M8 they adjusted but presumably it's now as good as mine! Cheers Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrh68uk Posted April 9, 2009 Author Share #8 Posted April 9, 2009 Well, I had an unexpected delivery today. My lens was returned and, upon testing, it's clear that nothing has been done. But there was nothing in there to say that anything had been done, either. All I have is an estimate, of zero cost, which just states "focus adjustment". So, what does this mean? Are they agreeing that it needs adjustment (in which case, why send the lens back)? Are they saying that "focus adjustment" is what I'd requested but that they're not doing anything about it because they think it's within spec? Or, have they sent it back so that I can send it back again together with my M8 (seems odd - why not just ask for my M8)? I really don't understand why they didn't simply forward it to Germany just like they did my 28 - which is now perfect. What's the difference this time? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanG Posted April 9, 2009 Share #9 Posted April 9, 2009 Well, I had an unexpected delivery today. My lens was returned and, upon testing, it's clear that nothing has been done. But there was nothing in there to say that anything had been done, either. All I have is an estimate, of zero cost, which just states "focus adjustment". Do they follow up with an independent survey to judge your satisfaction with the "service?" Almost every place I've dealt with for service in the past few years has done this. If they don't do any kind of satisfaction survey, how can management know what is going on? Plus it gives management incontrovertible documentation to put in front of the technicians to make them shape up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob_x2004 Posted April 9, 2009 Share #10 Posted April 9, 2009 Why dont you do what any reasonable person would do. Telephone them and ask. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrh68uk Posted April 10, 2009 Author Share #11 Posted April 10, 2009 Well, perhaps I'd be unreasonable to assume that they'd be working over the Bank Holiday weekend. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrh68uk Posted April 10, 2009 Author Share #12 Posted April 10, 2009 Never mind. Thanks for responses everyone. I guess I'll find out next Tues or Weds but it's been a frustrating experience and so different to the last one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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