vla Posted September 21, 2009 Share #1 Posted September 21, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) good evening, quite some time ago i noticed those well-known light reflexes when using my 35mm 'cron in low-light situations with one strong light spot. originially, i attributed this to the uv/ir-cut filter. however, i realized that all my other lenses are much more less likely to produce those annoying reflections than my 35mm 'cron. enclosed a shot from last friday without any filter - as you can see something else in the lens lead to a reflection of the candlelight and a strange 'halo'-effect around the light. i bought my 'cron used, but it's relatively recent, serial number is 388 xxxx. anyone else had a similar experience with this or other lenses? any ideas how to avoid this (other than using a different lens for such situations ...)? feedback and comments welcome. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/97617-strange-light-reflexes-in-35-mm-summicron-asph/?do=findComment&comment=1044854'>More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted September 21, 2009 Posted September 21, 2009 Hi vla, Take a look here strange light reflexes in 35 mm summicron asph. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
wstotler Posted September 21, 2009 Share #2 Posted September 21, 2009 anyone else had a similar experience with this or other lenses? any ideas how to avoid this (other than using a different lens for such situations ...)? I've never seen that behavior with my 'cron. It sure does look like a cut-filter reflection--really weird that you're getting that without the filter on. (I've had the *exact* trouble you're showing with the "birthday cake" shot and a cut filter.) Thanks, Will Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted September 21, 2009 Share #3 Posted September 21, 2009 Well, a filter is not the only glass surface in a lens. It is possible to induce flare in any optical system, and this is just the type of shot to do it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
vla Posted September 21, 2009 Author Share #4 Posted September 21, 2009 will, jaapv - thanks for your comments. i am fully aware of the fact that lenses do not 'need' filters to produce flare. what strikes me is the fact that my 35mm 'cron seems to be so much more susceptible to flare than my other leica glass. and i would like to know whether this is something also experienced by other 35mm 'cron users or not. further comments, markus Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philinflash Posted September 22, 2009 Share #5 Posted September 22, 2009 ...my 35mm 'cron seems to be so much more susceptible to flare than my other leica glass... Agree...that is my experience, too. I have reduced it somewhat by modifying the lens hood to mask out extraneous light. That works for out-of-frame light sources but would not help for your candlelight situation. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
batmobile Posted September 22, 2009 Share #6 Posted September 22, 2009 This is one area where the ZM Biogon is mind bogglingly good. This does seem pretty extreme though for a modern leica lens without a filter. Loks almost like a kind of ghosting. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicoleica Posted September 22, 2009 Share #7 Posted September 22, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) Just a thought, but could these reflections be caused by some out-of-frame reflective item? (Something metallic on the table perhaps?) The reflections appear to be groups of 3 lines rather than just single blobs. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted September 22, 2009 Share #8 Posted September 22, 2009 will, jaapv - thanks for your comments. i am fully aware of the fact that lenses do not 'need' filters to produce flare. what strikes me is the fact that my 35mm 'cron seems to be so much more susceptible to flare than my other leica glass. and i would like to know whether this is something also experienced by other 35mm 'cron users or not. further comments, markus Is it the asph? - I have that one and it is very flare-resistant. I understand that was one of the improvements over the previous version. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjh Posted September 22, 2009 Share #9 Posted September 22, 2009 i am fully aware of the fact that lenses do not 'need' filters to produce flare. what strikes me is the fact that my 35mm 'cron seems to be so much more susceptible to flare than my other leica glass. It is not your usual kind of flare after all, but a reflection of light off the sensor, back to the lens where it gets reflected for a second time to hit the sensor as a mirror image (in this case the two flames appearing upside-down across the child’s face). This is more prevalent with flat surface such as filters, but lenses can produce the same effect (note that the backside of the Summicron’s aspherical element is more or less flat). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chilihead Posted September 22, 2009 Share #10 Posted September 22, 2009 "This is one area where the ZM Biogon is mind bogglingly good". - agreed - The 35 ZM Biogon is "mind bogglingly good!" Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
epand56 Posted September 22, 2009 Share #11 Posted September 22, 2009 I've only had that kind of reflexes when using lenses with the UV/IR filter on, shooting in dark environment (night, candlelight etc.) no matter the lens I was using. But generally the reflexes I've got were greenish and once dismounted the filter they were no longer there. However, direct candle light is a bad beast to deal with. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Branch Posted September 22, 2009 Share #12 Posted September 22, 2009 If I get a picture with flare, either of the spot or broad patch variety, then I can almost be certain I was using my 35mm Summicron-M ASPH. It is by far the most flare prone Leica lens I own. As others have remarked it does not have to be a bright object in the field of view of the M8 to cause problems. That said I can get flare with any of the other lenses if I subject them to a particularly severe test. The least flare prone sems to be the 50mm Summilux-M ASPH. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted September 22, 2009 Share #13 Posted September 22, 2009 I think Michael's explanation is correct about the flat rear element and the sensor. I have used mine mostly on film - and it is very flare resistant in that case. I never had flare on the M8 either, but then I would not use it in such circumstances, I would mount the Nokton 35/1.2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philinflash Posted September 22, 2009 Share #14 Posted September 22, 2009 This is one area where the ZM Biogon is mind bogglingly good. This does seem pretty extreme though for a modern leica lens without a filter. Loks almost like a kind of ghosting. I did an informal back-to-back test of the ZM against the 35 'cron and the ZM seemed more resistant to flare. Too bad about the absence of coding, however. Except for that, the ZM would be my first choice. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olsen Posted September 22, 2009 Share #15 Posted September 22, 2009 These kind of reflections are common on all digital cameras, unfortunately. I get the same result (with or without filters) when shooting either with 1Ds III (or I or II) or M8. It is a reflex of the shiny candles that reflex at the sensor surface, and, most likely, the rear lens surface. My impression is that certain fast lenses are more prone than others. The two worst in my stable are Leica Noctilux 50 mm 1,0 and Canon's EF 50 mm 1,0L. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
vla Posted September 22, 2009 Author Share #16 Posted September 22, 2009 good evening, thank you to everybody for taking the time to answer my questions. mine is an aspherical 'cron and there was no reflective item on the table. interesting that some of you confirmed the special susceptibility of the 35 mm 'cron asph to flare. @ michael and olsen - your explanations make a lot of sense. i wonder if fast lenses and large sensors generally are more susceptible to this problem than other cameras. i never had this kind of problem with my eos 400d and standard canon zoom lens. bottom-line seems to be that there is not much i can do to avoid this problem, other than avoiding certain lighting situation. this is frustrating, indeed ... however, i will compare my 'cron with one of its more recent siblings. maybe the most recent 'crons show some sort of improvement. i am enclosing three more shots - 1) m8+35 mm summarit - very similar effect, but not as bad as with the 'cron 2) + 3) canon 400d with cheap 'plastic' lens under challenging lighting - several other issues, e.g. hot pixels, noise, but no reflexions (no, i don't want to start a canon vs. leica thread ...) markus Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/97617-strange-light-reflexes-in-35-mm-summicron-asph/?do=findComment&comment=1046518'>More sharing options...
Guest Lotw Posted September 27, 2009 Share #17 Posted September 27, 2009 Olsen's explanation (and Michael's) is an eye-opener to me, thanks!! I have these reflections too, with my Summilux 35 ASPH, but only with candles, so far Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Lotw Posted September 27, 2009 Share #18 Posted September 27, 2009 Although Puts holds that it's the UV/IR filter that is responsible for these aberrations: M8_seven Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
vla Posted September 27, 2009 Author Share #19 Posted September 27, 2009 agree - michael and olsen offer a very good explanation. however, i still wonder why such effects never ocurred on my previous eos 400d ... markus Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Lotw Posted September 27, 2009 Share #20 Posted September 27, 2009 I just tested again, with 3 candles, with and without filter, but in both cases three reflections come up: green without filter, magenta with filter (:-). Summilux 50 other lenses no problem Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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