edlbell Posted November 14, 2006 Share #41 Posted November 14, 2006 Advertisement (gone after registration) Ed-- On C1 Pro (Windows, anyway) there's this little checkbox in the color management window that says, appropriately enough, "show only Phase One profiles"... Uncheck that, and you should see all the profiles (even ones you'd never use) that are installed on your system. I tried that, and they only show up in the top box titled Camer Product. They do not appear in the second box titled Camera. Any othr thoughts? Thanks!! Ed Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted November 14, 2006 Posted November 14, 2006 Hi edlbell, Take a look here Magenta Work-around for Capture One workflow. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Jamie Roberts Posted November 14, 2006 Author Share #42 Posted November 14, 2006 Ed--how did you install the profile? It should be showing up in the second drop-down. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie Roberts Posted November 14, 2006 Author Share #43 Posted November 14, 2006 Hey--I just installed C1 LE WINDOWS 3.76 and it lets you change profiles just like C1 PRO! Can someone confirm that C1 LE really has this dialog box... Under Workflow... Show Color Management Settings... and when you select that it looks like the attached file (well, except if you don't have that test profile it won't show)? If it does, and you can select others, then all you'd have to do is 1) install the profile and 2) select for the M8. That's it--all done! I'm suspicious because I have C1 Pro installed here too, and heaven only knows what it's doing PS--I just saw the LL thing! Wow! If I had email I'd mail Micheal a thank-you Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/9028-magenta-work-around-for-capture-one-workflow/?do=findComment&comment=92908'>More sharing options...
AShearer Posted November 14, 2006 Share #44 Posted November 14, 2006 I have C1 LE, the latest update on Mac. But, when I select Color Management under preferences, nothing drops down. I mean nothing. It's like" nope, that's all you get? Is that because it's LE? I have not installed any profiles separately. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
osera Posted November 14, 2006 Share #45 Posted November 14, 2006 Jaimie- I have C1 LE on windows, and it looks just like that. AShearer- it's a small window that pops up where last I left if. Could you have it hiding under something, another C1 window? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
osera Posted November 14, 2006 Share #46 Posted November 14, 2006 Jaimie- Here's test shot I'm trying to sort out, taken with the Leica 21/2.8 with a small on-camera flash (24D). The first shot is using the standard M8 generic in C1 LE. The second is using the test new profile in C1. The fabrics are black, the jacket is navy blue. Magenta corrects towards black, but black and blue cannot be distinguished. I'll try it with the IR cut filter later. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/9028-magenta-work-around-for-capture-one-workflow/?do=findComment&comment=92921'>More sharing options...
edlbell Posted November 14, 2006 Share #47 Posted November 14, 2006 Advertisement (gone after registration) Ed--how did you install the profile? It should be showing up in the second drop-down. I just uninstalled and reinstalled C1 LE. I also viewed the ICC profiles. Curiuosly the profiles which appear under the camera window are not in the profiles. I searched the hard drive for Phase and found no files titled "Phase One P25." Do you know where I can download these profiles? Ed Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie Roberts Posted November 14, 2006 Author Share #48 Posted November 14, 2006 Jaimie- Here's test shot I'm trying to sort out, taken with the Leica 21/2.8 with a small on-camera flash (24D). The first shot is using the standard M8 generic in C1 LE. The second is using the test new profile in C1. The fabrics are black, the jacket is navy blue. Magenta corrects towards black, but black and blue cannot be distinguished. I'll try it with the IR cut filter later. Alan-- The original here looks really overexposed (going by the WhiBal cards). Now, I'm on my laptop, so it's hard to tell precisely. But does the jacket look blue in the original? It doesn't to me... So I'm thinking your WB is off here. The filter won't correct for that. If you send me the DNG through YouSendIt: The Leader in File Delivery. I can have a look. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie Roberts Posted November 14, 2006 Author Share #49 Posted November 14, 2006 I just uninstalled and reinstalled C1 LE. I also viewed the ICC profiles. Curiuosly the profiles which appear under the camera window are not in the profiles. I searched the hard drive for Phase and found no files titled "Phase One P25." Do you know where I can download these profiles? Ed Ed--sorry, I misunderstood you. Capture One LE doesn't include the whole set of Phase profiles--only C1 . But I'll send you a test profile through a PM. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stevenrk Posted November 14, 2006 Share #50 Posted November 14, 2006 Alan-- The original here looks really overexposed (going by the WhiBal cards). Now, I'm on my laptop, so it's hard to tell precisely. But does the jacket look blue in the original? It doesn't to me... So I'm thinking your WB is off here. The filter won't correct for that. If you send me the DNG through YouSendIt: The Leader in File Delivery. I can have a look. Jamie, you seem to be pushing a bit hard here. The idea that the issue here is overexposure is a reach. What happens if we're not just talking about a couple of simple colors? How about a mix of people and fabrics in an outdoor scene? The idea that you have to build C1 profiles for a Leica just to get close to barely passing color (and that is reaching also) -- and only in a perfectly exposed simplistic shot -- is just not what I think this should be about. I'm not sure who would buy such a camera other than a few dedicated Leica fans and hobbyists. Until off the card this camera produces images with the color quality of a DMR, this camera isn't going to sell enough to make it viable. And even then, I wouldn't bet the ranch. So we should be encouraging Leica to figure this out for real, rather than finding fault in a well presented simple test shot that overwhelms a simplistic solution to a complicated problem that threatens something we all agree on -- we want to Leica to survive and build an M_ that delivers quality equal to or greater than current 2006 technology, not 1995 digital technology (or is it 92?) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
blakley Posted November 14, 2006 Share #51 Posted November 14, 2006 Steven, I'm sure that Jamie is waiting for exactly that. In the meantime, though, I imagine he's wanting to use his new M8, and I'm grateful that he's letting the rest of us in on what he's doing to reach that objective. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie Roberts Posted November 14, 2006 Author Share #52 Posted November 14, 2006 Jamie, you seem to be pushing a bit hard here. The idea that the issue here is overexposure is a reach. What happens if we're not just talking about a couple of simple colors? How about a mix of people and fabrics in an outdoor scene? The idea that you have to build C1 profiles for a Leica just to get close to barely passing color (and that is reaching also) -- and only in a perfectly exposed simplistic shot -- is just not what I think this should be about. I'm not sure who would buy such a camera other than a few dedicated Leica fans and hobbyists. Until off the card this camera produces images with the color quality of a DMR, this camera isn't going to sell enough to make it viable. So we should be encouraging Leica to figure this out for real, rather than finding fault in a well presented simple test shot that overwhelms a simplistic solution to a complicated problem that threatens something we all agree on -- we want to Leica to survive and build an M_ that delivers quality equal to or greater than current 2006 technology, not 1995 digital technology (or is it 92?) Steven--I'm not pushing hard in the slightest. I have no vested interest in a solution except to use the M8 professionally. So let's talk DMR. If you have an overexposed shot with a DMR then when you WB RAW from your (no longer) grey card, your WB will be off. If the WB is off, there is no point talking about color differences, profiled or not. And the DMR "off the card" is a much harder camera to use than the M8. The M8 is far more forgiving. But neither are as forgiving as a 5D or 20D. The Canons have pretty uncannily mediocre (I mean that in a good way) AUTO WB; the M8's is poor (Leica has admitted they're working on it) and the DMR's is awful--the worst I've seen on any digicam, period. Of course, since the R9 part of the DMR wasn't ever "meant" to be a digicam, you can hardly blame Leica for that! But no-one would expect good results from a DMR "off the (JPEG) card" under these lighting and exposure circumstances. The DMR shot would look equally poor, IMO (and I've processed a *lot* of DMR shots--doing some right now, as it turns out ) In other words, I don't know any pro who doesn't pay close attention in digital to exposure and WB. You have to. Now--having said all that--the profile is there whether you know it or not. It's in the JPEG firmware; it's absolutely in your RAW converter. Think of it as your basic film. Unfortunately, Leica shipped their "film" for the M8 in a quasi-defective state. Quasi-defective because even with the non-neutral C1 profile, the M8 produces fabulous shots! But--honestly--for this specific shot, the top jacket looks exactly the same as the bottom jacket, with the exception of the saturation, which is to be completely expected from the profile itself. So what happens if you 1) expose properly 2) set the WB carefully and 3) adjust the saturation? Can't tell from this shot, which is why I asked for the DNG. And the more you push navy in exposure, without a proper WB, the more gray it will look. That's true on film, too. So I haven't yet seen the profile tweak--and that's what it is, an incompleted tweak--fail. It could be that it *does* fail under on-camera flash conditions, but I'm just saying I can't tell from the posted JPEG. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
osera Posted November 14, 2006 Share #53 Posted November 14, 2006 Alan-- The original here looks really overexposed (going by the WhiBal cards). Now, I'm on my laptop, so it's hard to tell precisely. But does the jacket look blue in the original? It doesn't to me... So I'm thinking your WB is off here. The filter won't correct for that. If you send me the DNG through YouSendIt: The Leader in File Delivery. I can have a look. Jaimie- Yes, I'm not sure, but I'll send the DNG files, both without and now with the ir cut filter. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie Roberts Posted November 14, 2006 Author Share #54 Posted November 14, 2006 Jaimie- Yes, I'm not sure, but I'll send the DNG files, both without and now with the ir cut filter. Thanks Allen. If you post the yousendit link here, I'll make sure I get it (why does travel always do stupid things to your email? ) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie Roberts Posted November 14, 2006 Author Share #55 Posted November 14, 2006 Steven--one more before I hit the hay for the evening... because, you know, the Leica does way more than give "passing color". It's fabulous colour, really. Just because the original profile needs tweaking means, really, nothing at all. This is why I'm breathing a huge sigh of relief here. You don't need perfect lighting conditions to get a great shot with the DMR or the M8. But both need good exposure relative to the lighting conditions. In other words, you just can't be sloppy with digital. Let me explain a bit. For those of you who know this, just skip it, but for those of you coming from film, you gotta get this now... Shooting high-end digital is like shooting chromes. Really--print film is just so much more forgiving in terms of colour and exposure it isn't even funny. The DMR is brutal about this. Nothing on earth looks worse than an underexposed DMR shot (even overexposed DMR shots look better!) The Canons are more forgiving, but in they actually look worse overexposed than the DMR. They tend to band with lovely rainbow / banding effects. A profile only maximises what you get out of a digicam. But you need to feed it a good exposure. From my preliminary tests, btw, the M8 is as easy to use under 1250 ISO as the 5D (well, not for WB, but for underexposure). Over 1250, though, with the M8 you have to be spot on. Then the camera "magically delivers" a great shot. It's not magic, actually, but I'm finding you can get away with a lot more with the M8 than the DMR. So here's a shot I took tonight in a very, very dark restaurant in Atlanta. I'm sitting next to these people and they don't even know I took this...tungsten light, 28 2.8 APSH, at 1/16 of a second, no less! ISO 2500, with the test profile, which is very neutral, and, as you can see, the colour is more than passable for a very difficult lighting situation! Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/9028-magenta-work-around-for-capture-one-workflow/?do=findComment&comment=93029'>More sharing options...
edlbell Posted November 14, 2006 Share #56 Posted November 14, 2006 Ed--sorry, I misunderstood you. Capture One LE doesn't include the whole set of Phase profiles--only C1 . But I'll send you a test profile through a PM. Here is a message from the Phase One Forum. I asked how to access the profiles you mentioned. You are referring to the Phase One "Easy Black" profiles for the Phase One digital backs. You wish to use one of these to remove the color casts from black material that has an high infrared reflectivity that is being picked up by the Leica M8 which is IR sensitive. Unfortunately the LE version of Capture One that is included with the Leica does not include the profiles for Phase One's backs, as they are only supported by the Pro and DB versions. That only leaves you with the option to upgrade to the Pro version, or wait to see if anyone makes an "Easy Black"-like profile for the Leica to reduce the color cast issue. It seems that Leica is on top of this problem, although their solution may be to provide a high-pass IR filter to be installed on the lens along with a firmware upgrade to the camera. That still doesn't help with shots you've already taken. Since Leica did work with Phase One to have the software included in the box, a profile solution may be in the works. Ed Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonoslack Posted November 14, 2006 Share #57 Posted November 14, 2006 Ed--sorry, I misunderstood you. Capture One LE doesn't include the whole set of Phase profiles--only C1 . But I'll send you a test profile through a PM. Hi Jamie - I only have LE too - but I'd love to check out your test profile. kind regards jono slack Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhoelscher Posted November 14, 2006 Share #58 Posted November 14, 2006 ... with a small on-camera flash (24D). .... I'm curious - did the SF24D work in TTL mode with the M8? Guy Mancuso couldn't get the 3502/Metz combination to do the TTL thing with his camera. DH Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbretteville Posted November 14, 2006 Share #59 Posted November 14, 2006 AFIK Guy hadn't set his 3502 up correctly or it didn't have the right mod firmware, it must be Mod4 or later. Guy did report geting the SF24D to work in 'ttl/gnc' mode on the M8. Edit: aparently he didn't get the SCA to work. Strange. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean_reid Posted November 14, 2006 Share #60 Posted November 14, 2006 I'm curious - did the SF24D work in TTL mode with the M8? Guy Mancuso couldn't get the 3502/Metz combination to do the TTL thing with his camera. DH As I reported in my M8 review, TTL works beautifully with the SF24D on the M8. Too bad the SF24 is so limited. I'm going to try Metz next. Cheers, Sean Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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