jaapv Posted March 9, 2009 Share #41 Posted March 9, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) I'd also want a separate R10 forum as well, Andreas. People currently put up R10 threads in the "main" digital forum and quickly get pushed to page 2 by the overwhelming D Lux 4 and Digilux 2 threads. An ideal setup would be a R10, a M8, a S2, a Digicam and a Post Processing forum in the "digital section". Just my humble 2 cents though ... It does seem a bit unbalanced, Andreas, to mix up R10 and DMR with the Digilux 2and4.. Those a two wholly different areas of interest.The Digilux 3 is kind of in the middle, but would probably be served best by an R forum. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted March 9, 2009 Posted March 9, 2009 Hi jaapv, Take a look here #002 - Leica Stopps Selling R-System. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
stunsworth Posted March 9, 2009 Share #42 Posted March 9, 2009 The structure I've suggested before is 'Digital Rangefinder', Digital SLR', 'Digital P&S', 'Processing' and anything that doesn't fit into those to be posted in the body of the main forum. If would also allow any additional cameras such as the M9 to be accomodated without having to add a sub-forum. However I can see the attraction of a separate M9 sub-forum to Andreas as it would probably increase traffic if there was an area just restricted to the new camera and would also help increase advertising revenue. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted March 9, 2009 Share #43 Posted March 9, 2009 I think the old Leica R mount with the cams and ROM connections is a lot of baggage to carry forwards into a new camera. I do have to agree. But that said, I don't see an adapter being such a big deal even if it had to contain conversion electronics which at least tell the new (system) camera what has been attached and as much data about it as is possible and/or useful. Legacy lenses are after all exactly as named and I would hope that Leica will produce newer designs in the future which are more effective with digital sensors than lenses designed for film. On the note of compatibility of legacy lenses, am I not correct in thinking that the reality is that of existing R lenses, the only ones which are likely to be of sufficient value to convert to ROM (if this is needed) and use on a new system have always been both expensive and esoteric? Are these not the lenses that existing R users would be upset to lose to a new incompatible system? I imaging that losing old, relatively cheap lenses would not be so much of a blow? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveYork Posted March 9, 2009 Share #44 Posted March 9, 2009 It will be a marketing issue: If Leica's new R10 can't take R lenses, at least the ROM ones, then they stand to lose sales. People will be ticked off that they put all this $$ into R stuff they can't use on a new camera, and because of spite or lack of funds they won't purchase a new R10. It's a lot easier to justify purchase of a new body when you have existing lenses, then to go and purchase a whole new system. And something else people overlook is this new camera is designated an "R10." That means it's w/in the R lineage. Just as past R cameras could take earlier R lenses, the same should be true here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
marknorton Posted March 9, 2009 Share #45 Posted March 9, 2009 We don't know that it will be called the R10 even if there have been comments to that effect. Who knows how any concept has changed in the light of work on the S-2, announcements by other vendors and so on? It would be strange to have put out this announcement - no more stock, no new production planned, all old stock sold off - if Leica intends to reintroduce it at some point. That said, Leica's announcements often confuse, so nothing new there. I agree though, they have to provide some basic compatability for at least recent R lenses if the camera is going to fly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted March 9, 2009 Share #46 Posted March 9, 2009 The statemention mentions a generation change within the R system, so it is reasonable to assum it will be the R10. And to assume that the R10 will be compatible with the rest of the system. As for ROM, let's not forget that even the most recent 1.4x APO-extender does not even have a ROM. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevelap Posted March 9, 2009 Share #47 Posted March 9, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) The structure I've suggested before is 'Digital Rangefinder', Digital SLR', 'Digital P&S', 'Processing' and anything that doesn't fit into those to be posted in the body of the main forum. If would also allow any additional cameras such as the M9 to be accomodated without having to add a sub-forum. However I can see the attraction of a separate M9 sub-forum to Andreas as it would probably increase traffic if there was an area just restricted to the new camera and would also help increase advertising revenue. I'm more with Simon and Jaap on this one, as I'd prefer M, R and S (sounds like a virus:)) and 'other' (or whatever). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
edlaurpic Posted March 13, 2009 Share #48 Posted March 13, 2009 I have owned every Leica M (including the original MP) and every Leica R camera, including the R9 with a DMR. I own Canon DSLR's including IDS MII and 5D with numerous lenses along with three Hasselblads with three digital backs (CFV, CF22 and CF39) and many lenses. Aside from hand held low light street or environmental shots of people in their natural habitat with M8.2's (and very occasionally with an MP or IIIg and film) my favorite digital camera— if size and weight are not important— is the R9 with DMR. And, even when weight and size ARE an issue, if I am shooting telephoto or macro shots, I choose the R9 and DMR over any DSLR or Hasselblad. Partly its the incredible ease of operation, placement of controls and ergonomics and partly its the incredible 16 bit files with gorgeous color, but nothing else, for me, compares to the R9/DMR. Nothing yet, at least. That said, the LCD on the DMR is tiny and the file processing in camera is slow, and the files could certainly stand being bigger, so I ventured off last week to PMA to see and try the S2. Result? NO SALE. TOO BIG. TOO HEAVY compared to the R9 and DMR . . . .at least for me. That said, it might make sense in a studio or if you have a Sherpa on staff. So, you might be wondering, are the Hasselblads any better, smaller, lighter? The answer is NO, which is why I hardly ever use them and the great digital backs I own any more. They are cumbersome, slow and although the files from all of the backs are lovely, the DMR still, for me, produces a file that I like better, partly because it's not as painful to get the file I want, perhaps. And others have written about the R glass. It's extraordinary. But what about the lack of autofocus? My answer? LONG LIVE MANUAL FOCUS, UNLESS YOU ARE A SPORTS PHOTOGRAPHER OR A FASHION RUNWAY PHOTOGRAPHER SHOOTING "BLOW-UP". Take a look at Doug Herr's spectacular photos. Has he been compromised by a lack of autofocus? Ask him. Truthfully—and I might be a real outlier here—I feel that autofocus actually compromises my photography whenever I pick up one of my canons. And it's not just the way autofocus has a way of picking the wrong element to focus on, it's also the way it compromises the photographic creative process, making it less deliberate and discriminating. AGAIN. LONG LIVE MANUAL FOCUS. Be honest, if you are an M8 user. Do you think you would do better if all of your bodies and lenses were AF-capable? Not likely. So what about the D lux4? I love it, and I have taken a lot of good shots with it, but it feels like something other than photography to me. Not bad, mind you, but different from the experience of visualizing the shot, choosing what to meter on and focus on and squeezing off the shot. Still love the D lux 4, simply because now I never have to be without a camera. I almost shudder to think about the backlash this post will invite, but there. I've said it. If Leica breaks it's promise and does not come out with a successor to the R9 and DMR, like the R10 so many of us had hoped for, what am I going to do? At the moment, the answer is I will buy aother R9 and DMR, used, of course, if you don't beat me to it. If you keep this post buried here and are not able to get the views of other R9/DMR lovers, that would be grossly unfair to us. I urge you to create an R10 sub forum, just as there is a subforum for the M8 or S2. That it's not a currently sold Leica camera shouldn't matter if the forum intends truly to serve its members instead of its parochial marketing goals. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted March 13, 2009 Share #49 Posted March 13, 2009 I almost shudder to think about the backlash this post will invite, but there. I've said it. A very well put post containing a great deal of reality. Although not a DMR owner, i appreciate R glass on my Canons to the extent of considering a mirror shave on a 5D simply to use the 19 (MkII) R. manual focus, stop down metering and all. On a personal note, I'd be perfectly happy with an R10 not unlike an R6 and which only shot RAW - a fully mechanical, manual dSLR ...but I'm probably out of sync here too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
artur5 Posted March 13, 2009 Share #50 Posted March 13, 2009 Let's assume the only existing R lenses that the R10 will be able to use and retain full functionality are the ROM ones. The ROM connections tell the camera what aperture the lens is at don't they? . No, they don't. The third cam does. All existing R cameras from R3 to R9 need the third cam (to know the selected aperture) and the mechanical link (to stop down the lens when the shutter fires). ROM contacts are complementary, they don't replace the functions performed by the third cam. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stunsworth Posted March 13, 2009 Share #51 Posted March 13, 2009 No, they don't. The third cam does Yes, the 3rd cam does, but so does the ROM. See this page... Leica FAQ - Why do R lenses come in 2/3-CAM or ROM mounts? So an R10 wouldn't need a mechanical connection for 'legacy' lenses provided they had a ROM. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevelap Posted March 13, 2009 Share #52 Posted March 13, 2009 .........If you keep this post buried here and are not able to get the views of other R9/DMR lovers, that would be grossly unfair to us. I urge you to create an R10 sub forum, just as there is a subforum for the M8 or S2...... Seconded. Posts concerning 'digital R' in the current forum format are soon lost amongst all the p&s threads. Surely the R is worth more than that? It's your forum of course Andreas, but hasn't the time come to create somewhere for digital R aspirationalists to gather and, perhaps, to give the panaleica aficionados a place of their own? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stnami Posted March 13, 2009 Share #53 Posted March 13, 2009 So you guys want a forum for a camera that doesn't exist........... now that is dumb Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevelap Posted March 13, 2009 Share #54 Posted March 13, 2009 So you guys want a forum for a camera that doesn't exist........... now that is dumb I said 'digital R'. The R9/DMR combo seems to fit that description and, whilst not a current model, people are still using them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stnami Posted March 13, 2009 Share #55 Posted March 13, 2009 ..they say I'd also want a separate R10 forum as well, Andreas. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevelap Posted March 13, 2009 Share #56 Posted March 13, 2009 ..they say Yes, they did.......but whatever a successor digital R might be called, there is certainly plenty of interest being shown in it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stnami Posted March 13, 2009 Share #57 Posted March 13, 2009 ........but it's not available, so it will be a pile of bullshit until it hits the steets Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
artur5 Posted March 13, 2009 Share #58 Posted March 13, 2009 Yes, the 3rd cam does, but so does the ROM. See this page... Leica FAQ - Why do R lenses come in 2/3-CAM or ROM mounts? So an R10 wouldn't need a mechanical connection for 'legacy' lenses provided they had a ROM. ROM contacts transmit to the body the max. and minimal aperture value of the lens, the focal length, the vigneting associated with each aperture of this lens and the dynamics of the diaphragm ( the size of the blades and the timing for open-close) but the actual selected diaphragm on the aperture ring is transmitted only by the third cam. Thus, to know the selected aperture AND to stop-down the iris when shutter fires, the R10 would need mechanical or electromechanical couplings with any existing R lens -ROM or not ROM- Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeyM Posted March 14, 2009 Share #59 Posted March 14, 2009 I don't know if anyone spotted that the Leica catalogue for 08/09 didn't show the R system ! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
veraikon Posted March 14, 2009 Share #60 Posted March 14, 2009 I don't know if anyone spotted that the Leica catalogue for 08/09 didn't show the R system ! Yeah we spotted My personal opinion. The catalogue was planed in Lee times - and Lee wanted to close the R System. After Lee was fired, and the plan changed to continue the R system it was to late to put it back to the catalogue. The change of plans must be made in summer 2008 just before the photokina , when it was clear that the S2 would be available late summer 2009. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.