ShyTot Posted September 29, 2008 Share #21 Posted September 29, 2008 Advertisement (gone after registration) just like to make shit talk. I apologize if I've offended you Guy, that was not my intention. Just wanted to expose the false premise on which all your good advice was based on and make the vulnerable amongst us wary of getting on the Canon/DMR/M8/MamiyaZD/PhaseOne/S2/Canon/DMR/M8/MamiyaZD/PhaseOne/S2/Canon/DMR/M8/MamiyaZD/PhaseOne/S2/Canon/DMR/M8/MamiyaZD/PhaseOne/S2/ ..... roller coaster to disappointment. Why don't you spout all his stuff on your GetDpi personal platform? Join me and Guy on the next: Studio Lighting Workshop, September 16th through 20th, 2008 in Fort Lauderdale! - The GetDPI Workshop Forums Studio Lighting Workshop, September 16th through 20th, 2008 in Fort Lauderdale! - The GetDPI Workshop Forums Studio Lighting Workshop, September 16th through 20th, 2008 in Fort Lauderdale! - The GetDPI Workshop Forums Studio Lighting Workshop, September 16th through 20th, 2008 in Fort Lauderdale! - The GetDPI Workshop Forums Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted September 29, 2008 Posted September 29, 2008 Hi ShyTot, Take a look here Leica S2 compared to MF. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
earleygallery Posted September 29, 2008 Share #22 Posted September 29, 2008 Does anyone else think that the S2 is eerily similar to the Pentax Medium format?? Obviously digital vs film but the same concept of looking and acting like a 35mm camera body. I've been thinking this too, its a digital Pentax 67, and that's meant in an entirely positive way. I wonder what the guys at Pentax are thinking.......... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rick_dykstra Posted September 29, 2008 Share #23 Posted September 29, 2008 My M8 failed and I took it to my dealer friday the 16th September. Here is Australia it's a 4 to 6 months, IME. 5 would be normal. Is it any wonder I'm trying to fix my motor drive myself. Enjoy the quick turnarounds! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjh Posted September 29, 2008 Share #24 Posted September 29, 2008 I've been thinking this too, its a digital Pentax 67, and that's meant in an entirely positive way. I wonder what the guys at Pentax are thinking.......... In terms of being a not completely modular medium format DSLR, the S2 most closely resembles the Mamiya ZD. I think (and hope) that in all other ways it doesn’t. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stunsworth Posted September 29, 2008 Share #25 Posted September 29, 2008 Guy, you are so off-track. The S2 has been out with trusted Pro's and in at least 10 studios for development feedback I've also heard that they've all said that they were very interested in buying into the system. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolo Posted September 29, 2008 Share #26 Posted September 29, 2008 In terms of being a not completely modular medium format DSLR, the S2 most closely resembles the Mamiya ZD. I think (and hope) that in all other ways it doesn’t. Michael, Other than seeing it at a show, I have no experience/knowledge of the ZD, so can you expand on your comment a little? What are the shortcomings ? Rolo Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rick_dykstra Posted September 29, 2008 Share #27 Posted September 29, 2008 Advertisement (gone after registration) Geez, Guy's coping some hits on this thread! I must say I don't see a reason for it. I think it'd be great if Leica were to toss him an S2 system and ask him to put it through its paces. After the M8 introduction, it would give me some confidence. I may be wrong but my recollection of that time is that Guy didn't whine and moan about the magenta shift, he just got on with solving it. I also think that one of the valuable and constructive features of this forum is that people use their proper names. Thank you. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stunsworth Posted September 29, 2008 Share #28 Posted September 29, 2008 I may be wrong but my recollection of that time is that Guy didn't whine and moan about the magenta shift, he just got on with solving it. I thought it was Leica who solved it? I can't remember when Guy got his M8, but wasn't the magenta problem already recognised and fixed by then? Maybe I'm wrong. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
waileong Posted September 29, 2008 Share #29 Posted September 29, 2008 Well, you're not him, so don't answer for him. He never said he was comparing against H's for instance. So I pointed out some areas where his superlatives may not hold. As for your views, they just your views. Couldn't care less about them. I cannot answer for Guy but what is the point of comparing a modern AF digital camera with a 120 folder? BTW, seen many of theses used by pros recently? I had the impression that the most used MF cameras were Blads, Mamiya 645 & 7, Rollei 6008 and Pentax 6x7... Once again, one can wonder why Blad launched its new body with AF... Maybe because no body/back integration and the difficulty of precise manual focusing with a digital back were real problems. So maybe a Hassy 200 with a back is not really a competitor for the S2 just like the 120 folding. Once again, the target is the Blad H. And it not using Zeiss glass. No when we are talking about the H cameras, once again. We are not comparing a digital AF camera with a manual film one. Was not. You are still talking about the V series. Your right but my guess is that you are focusing on 1/10th of Blad sales and R&D. My guess is that you did not notice that a few things changed in the photographic equipment these last years: now, we have AF, lightmeter and automatic exposure in the bodies, a digital part fully integrated for obvious ergonomic/post-processing/precision of adjustment reasons, motors to recock the shutter. Not so many people are really using 120 film folder and I doubt they will hesitate to switch to a Leica S2 because of the bigger size and the need for a battery Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShyTot Posted September 29, 2008 Share #30 Posted September 29, 2008 Of course obviously you know better than me and just like to make shit talk. Also Mr Troll if you can't come up with a real name than to me your just some little chair hugger and should be ignored by all. Obviously you fit in this category, If you want to demean someone than have the balls to let us know who you are Really Guy, that's misleading information again, for I am not a Troll. You won't find any other negative posts from me on any subject. Even here I'm just responding to you for promoting yourself as someone who should be advising Leica on their S2 programme. Guy, Leica have taken the world by surprise and don't need your ongoing drivel to guide them home on this one. They have developed a break-through product AFTER consulting with the industry on the needs of the segments requirements that they are pursuing. They know your name and address and chose not to talk to you, because you're not their target. Your not even a Leica user anymore after leaving to be the Mamiya guiding star, so why would they want your input. They don't and that seems to be getting to you. If you go back over my posts you'll read that I was providing advance positive information on these boards to try and turn the forum wrist slashers from being so negative about Leica new product launches. I want you to stop pronouncing that Leica will fail if they don't give you a pre-production version for your comment - "they need the input of us pro's". IMO that suggests they can't manage their programme and I view that as an insult to Leica. This is not a personal campaign at all, I just think your brimming with, Shyt Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted September 29, 2008 Share #31 Posted September 29, 2008 I apologize if I've offended you Guy, that was not my intention. Just wanted to expose the false premise on which all your good advice was based on and make the vulnerable amongst us wary of getting on the Canon/DMR/M8/MamiyaZD/PhaseOne/S2/Canon/DMR/M8/MamiyaZD/PhaseOne/S2/Canon/DMR/M8/MamiyaZD/PhaseOne/S2/Canon/DMR/M8/MamiyaZD/PhaseOne/S2/ ..... roller coaster to disappointment. Why don't you spout all his stuff on your GetDpi personal platform? Join me and Guy on the next: Studio Lighting Workshop, September 16th through 20th, 2008 in Fort Lauderdale! - The GetDPI Workshop Forums Studio Lighting Workshop, September 16th through 20th, 2008 in Fort Lauderdale! - The GetDPI Workshop Forums Studio Lighting Workshop, September 16th through 20th, 2008 in Fort Lauderdale! - The GetDPI Workshop Forums Studio Lighting Workshop, September 16th through 20th, 2008 in Fort Lauderdale! - The GetDPI Workshop Forums What false premise may I ask. Did not like the Canon when i had it and said so at every turn, The best they ever made was the 1ds that camera i liked but was noisy , moved to the new 1dsMKII and hated it . Wound up with 11 Leica lenses in my bag . Decided to take a shot at the DMR loved it and 600 pages of exhaustive test proving why i liked it. Sold all Canon gear at a loss. Bought 2 DMR's and sold one to try the M8 . I liked the M glass and how the M8 felt . All documented how much i liked it and made the stupid mistake of selling my second DMR to get a second M8. I needed both really. Sold all the M8 stuff to move up to MF digital which was very much client pushed. Clients making banners the size of a house and the M8 obviously could not handle that big a push and it was hard to maintain a M8 only system as a Pro. Documented everywhere and made the MF purchase . Tried the ZD since i got in at a deal from Camera West Documented. Great back nice quality of files it should a Aptus 22mx was inside it but too slow of review and buffer. Soldit to a dear friend for the IR capability and lost 1200 dollars in 3 weeks or so. Documented. Moved to the Phase 25 back and really like it . The new body is good but not great the back sings though. Documented and BTW all of this is here and on my forum. Please get facts straight before you try and slander people in public. I made moves to improve my gear just like anyone else, i just realize faster maybe than others as i push the ladder up. i left MF after 20 years of shooting it doing film with Hassy , Bronica and Mamiya but at the time could not afford a 60 k back. i pushed 35mm as far as i could and net result finally get back to MF and in the digital realm of it. Nothing can touch the files well documented by me and others. I like the Leica S2 idea and certainly am interested in it because it brings some DSLR speed back into MF which i lost a little of. Will it fly , not sure but i do like the pluses but it has some minuses also and one thing for sure is the money is a lot larger to spend too lose and too waste . Anyone thinking S2 should do so very carefully. So not sure where these comments come from but I have been around the block and certainly know gear very well. I don't think i am any more a gear head than anyone else but i will move gear in and out to achieve my goals and needs of my clients. If there is something better than MF than i will look at it no question. Be nuts not too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted September 29, 2008 Share #32 Posted September 29, 2008 Really Guy, that's misleading information again, for I am not a Troll. You won't find any other negative posts from me on any subject. Even here I'm just responding to you for promoting yourself as someone who should be advising Leica on their S2 programme. Guy, Leica have taken the world by surprise and don't need your ongoing drivel to guide them home on this one. They have developed a break-through product AFTER consulting with the industry on the needs of the segments requirements that they are pursuing. They know your name and address and chose not to talk to you, because you're not their target. Your not even a Leica user anymore after leaving to be the Mamiya guiding star, so why would they want your input. They don't and that seems to be getting to you. If you go back over my posts you'll read that I was providing advance positive information on these boards to try and turn the forum wrist slashers from being so negative about Leica new product launches. I want you to stop pronouncing that Leica will fail if they don't give you a pre-production version for your comment - "they need the input of us pro's". IMO that suggests they can't manage their programme and I view that as an insult to Leica. This is not a personal campaign at all, I just think your brimming with, Shyt Really I guess i will delete the last dozen e-mails from Leica in the past 3 weeks. Also what am I promoting than get those 20 camera's out to folks to help with firmware and software ideas and any hardware glitches in the field before production. I know exactly what they did to get it going but now a prototype is done so all research and development just stops at the door step. I think not. Promoting myself for WHAT, vivid imagination for sure. I start a thread that I thought would be interesting and i get this crap from some unknown person that slanders me. You want me to be respectful of your thoughts sorry bud not going to happen your just trolling. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
elansprint72 Posted September 29, 2008 Share #33 Posted September 29, 2008 ........ If I am not getting paid i don't want any part of a test system.... Oh I do apologise; I must have misunderstood when you wrote "What Leica needs to do IMHO is get those 20 prototypes out to the Pro's let us play with them and see what improvements we can suggest before this even get's close to production." You have set my mind at rest. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted September 29, 2008 Share #34 Posted September 29, 2008 Well, you're not him, so don't answer for him. He never said he was comparing against H's for instance. So I pointed out some areas where his superlatives may not hold. As for your views, they just your views. Couldn't care less about them. I do apologize and should have made that clear i was referring to the modern MF systems. My fault on that. Same thing said at my place also. My bad Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted September 29, 2008 Share #35 Posted September 29, 2008 Oh I do apologise; I must have misunderstood when you wrote "What Leica needs to do IMHO is get those 20 prototypes out to the Pro's let us play with them and see what improvements we can suggest before this even get's close to production." You have set my mind at rest. Pete I am a Pro and i am part of US as Pro's . Does not mean I want to test it. Sure if they want to send me one, certainly not going to count on it. There all in Germany and they do hardware testing there in Germany mainly. Firmware is handled different which i have beta tested for leica well known fact. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted September 29, 2008 Share #36 Posted September 29, 2008 I thought it was Leica who solved it? I can't remember when Guy got his M8, but wasn't the magenta problem already recognised and fixed by then? Maybe I'm wrong. November 6th and Pascal was the first person to find the magenta issue and actually reported it on this forum. We all did a lot of testing to figure out what happened and figured it was a IR issue. Lot's of folks helped try to solve this issue on this forum including myself and there was a lot of hard work from folks and working with Leica trying to solve this. Sean , Jamie and many others put in a lot of time on this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted September 29, 2008 Share #37 Posted September 29, 2008 Geez, Guy's coping some hits on this thread! I must say I don't see a reason for it. I think it'd be great if Leica were to toss him an S2 system and ask him to put it through its paces. After the M8 introduction, it would give me some confidence. I may be wrong but my recollection of that time is that Guy didn't whine and moan about the magenta shift, he just got on with solving it. I also think that one of the valuable and constructive features of this forum is that people use their proper names. Thank you. Thanks Rick was losing faith there. LOL Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted September 29, 2008 Share #38 Posted September 29, 2008 Okay are we done with the rock throwing surely you guy's don't reside in glass homes. Anything else . Otherwise let's move on to the real topic at hand the S2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted September 29, 2008 Share #39 Posted September 29, 2008 Michael, Other than seeing it at a show, I have no experience/knowledge of the ZD, so can you expand on your comment a little? What are the shortcomings ? Rolo The files are actually quite good . It is a Dalsa Aptus 22 mpx 9 micron sensor in it but not good at noise and really ISO 200 is the real limit on it. The other issue with this back was review time 4 seconds to see image on LCD , for some not a big issue . I found it for me to be a issue when working for clients. Long expousure times the best i could get was about 20 seconds than noise camein. Also slow to shoot , can't remember the actually times but felt slow. BTW they did announce a new one that is said to be much faster now. not sure on pricing but the ZD is a cheap way to get in to MF . Buy a used AFD-II and used lenses which is exactly what I did when I got in. I actually bought a demo ZD and AFD-II than some used lenses from Keh. Also the build quality was not the best, good but not in the same league as the Phase , Hassy and Sinar backs. I should add there was a camera /back like the S2 that did not fair well in the market and had some issues, Michael will know them better than me. I had just the back only which was separate. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulmoore Posted September 29, 2008 Share #40 Posted September 29, 2008 after thinking about this system the past week I would not call this a tweeny system.. If we have to use old film names, I would have to call this a medium format.. but that is not the whole picture.. I have not seen a file from this camera but 37 mp is up where large format film was for me when I stopped shooting it.. it is way better than what used to be called medium format...way bigger than most medium format backs in use today(not on store shelves).. again I feel like I am at starbucks and all i want is a small black coffee but I have to call it some stupid name.. 37mp will put out a big hi res file period.. and it is in a smallish camera..seems like a winnning combo..I think most of us with both traditional med format and 35mm experience would take the shape / size of the 35mm over 2 1/4 for pure ease of handheld shooting. Try holding a rz67 for 6 hours..or even the h3 system.. even if the weight is similar the way you hold it makes the S2 feel lighter..It took me a few weeks to get used to the 35 viewfinder after going many years on bigger cameras but it is easier now to shoot than my med.format rollei. So I will shall refer this to the S2 not as medium format but just plan big enough.. and until I get a 60+mp back for the viewcamera(not happening)..I will consider it "large" Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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