28mm voigtlander ultron or 28mm summicron?

[hnaa]

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Hi again guys,

sorry about bombarding you with all these "which lens" questions, but I have currently come into a little bit of money that I decided to spend on some glass for my M8. In the 28mm focal length I currently own the Voigtlander 28mm ultron, a very capable lens indeed, but I was wondering if it would be worth it to exchange it for the 28mm summicron? People seem to rave about it. Maybe some of you guys gave experience with both these lenses? Cheers, Christian

[chuber]

Can't speak for the Ultron but the Scron Bokeh is just outstanding.

[sean_reid]

Hi again guys,

sorry about bombarding you with all these "which lens" questions, but I have currently come into a little bit of money that I decided to spend on some glass for my M8. In the 28mm focal length I currently own the Voigtlander 28mm ultron, a very capable lens indeed, but I was wondering if it would be worth it to exchange it for the 28mm summicron? People seem to rave about it. Maybe some of you guys gave experience with both these lenses? Cheers, Christian

 

Are you using IR-cut filters? I ask because its relevant to your question and my answer.

 

Cheers,

 

Sean

[Kittyphoto]

Christian, I own CV28 ultron too. I also have a chance to try 28 summicron asph. CV is not a bad lens the color is pleasing. But leica glass is better in both color and b&w a bit more contrast but not too much. I don't like b&w from CV. And from I remember leica is smaller too. If money is not problem, get leica. You get what you pay.

 

I like to get leica 28 mm too. But I feel 28 mm is too limited on M8. I am thinking of getting 21mm or 24mm instead of paying for leica 28mm. I think I still can live with CV28 mm but uncomfortable that 28mm is my widest lens now.

 

kitty

[Kittyphoto]

Sean, I just read your reply. I don't have IR yet. But ordering and hope coming soon. What is the diffference.

 

kitty

[eckart]

If you want a outstanding performance by open lens, there is no choice at all.

If you use the 28 with 5,6 or smaller you can take the cheaper one.

Cheers,

Eckart

[hnaa]

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Hi Sean,

I do use IR cut filters, and actually I ordered a John Milich codeable adapter a little while ago. So maybe the differences won't be that big? I have mostly been using it from f/5.6, but it seems silly to have a f/1.9 lens that I won't feel comfortable using unless it is stopped down, especially considering the substantial size of the CV 28. I haven't really done any test shots with it wide open, but have just been shooting it stopped down to be on the safe side. And I KNOW I will be able to use the 'cron wide open. Looking forward to your replies

[jackal]

ive owned both

 

paid about 170 quid for the ultron secondhand and 1700 quid for my summicron which i still have

 

is the cronw orth 10 times the price of the CV .. of course not

 

does it have a sweeter more appealing fingerprint, of course it does

 

 

like all these things, depends how crazy or wealthy you are

 

sensible people will just stick with the ultron because its a damm fine lens in its own right

[2Bébèrt]

I do like my Ultron 28/1.9 but you better read the Erwin Puts comments on this lens

 

"The Ultron 1.9/28.

 

The difference between 1.9 and 2 can be neglected so I limit myself to the f/2 aperture. At full aperture the lens exhibits low to medium contrast and definition of very fine detail is soft but very even over the image field extending till the corners. The extreme corners are very soft. Even finer details are resolved in the center, but rapidly become softer when going to the zonal area. There is no astimatism and only a very small amount of curvature of field.

 

There is some barrel distortion, but quite small. At 2.8 the overall contrast improves and at f/4 the optimum is reached. After f/8 contrast lowers again and from there we see a softening of image details with every additional stop. This is usual behaviour. At f/4 we note a resolution over the whole image area of above 100 lp/mm.

 

As a design philosphy this lens is a bit tuned to high resolution versus high contrast.

 

Mechanically this lens is excellent: no decentring at all, collimation at zero. As with the 3.5/90 there is a definite amount of play in the focusing mount. Also the amount of dust in the lens is above what we are see in Leica lenses.

 

Still at wider apertures the lens is a shade soft and lacks the clarity and crispness of the Summicron-M 2/28. I shot pictures with Kodak E100VS and in low light and contre-jour situations and noted the low contrast compared to the Summicron. Specifically the tightness and sparkle of high light and shadow rendition was excellent with the Summicron and a bit dull and washed out with the Ultron 28.

 

These differences in rendition are quite visible in critical inspection and may or mey be not be not interesting for some users. Fact is they exist.

 

Where the Summicron 28 excels is the high contrast and the very crisp rendition of extremely fine detail, given the Summicron images a brillance and clarity that can be compared to the Ultron's duller representation.

 

Stopped down the differences are quite small.

 

The Leica Summicron 28 has the advantage of superior mechanical engineering and materials. It also sports a visibly better imagery at wider apertures. Wide open there is no contest: Leica is still the one to beat. If you do not see the difference, you are the cause! It as simple as that! And while the Ultron comes close, it just is not able to challenge at wide apertures. Stopped down it is a draw.

 

The Ultron 28 is one third of the price of the Leica and delivers excellent, and close to outstanding imagery. For heavy duty use the choice is simple: Leica. For somewhat less demanding situations the Ultron is a tempting alternative, if you can live with its lack lustre wide open performance. To get some perspective: an older 28mm lens from Leica is blown to pieces by the Ultron.

 

MTF measurements show that the Ultron at wide apertures delivers quality that is one step behind the Summicron: The 20 lp/mm of the Summicron have a contrast transfer of 90%. The Ultron has 76%. At 10 lp/mm the Ultron has 88%. So Voigtlander at 10 lp/mm is as good as Leica at 20 lp. That does show!

 

While the Summicron is still the one to beat, the Ultron delivers quality, that was unbelievable some years ago. Leica designers are challenged!!"

 

Viewpoint | Photography and image capture: the Leica technique and philosophy by Erwin Puts | Erwin Puts

[Mauribix]

ive owned both

 

paid about 170 quid for the ultron secondhand and 1700 quid for my summicron which i still have

 

is the cronw orth 10 times the price of the CV .. of course not

 

does it have a sweeter more appealing fingerprint, of course it does

 

 

like all these things, depends how crazy or wealthy you are

 

sensible people will just stick with the ultron because its a damm fine lens in its own right

 

I second Jackall's thought.

I personally don't like th 28FOV on M8 (i.e. 37mm +/- in 35mm form), and it's just my personal opinion, but maybe when you get a "body-cap" lens you'll find yourself wanting always something more, and in the 28mm focal, the cron is the masterpiece...

[jackal]

the ultron is available secondhand only and also given the recent 28mm price hike, is much more like one tenth of the price of the leica lens

[Maggie_O]

New Ultrons are still available at CameraQuest Home and since it is exponentially less expensive than the 28 'Cron, it was a no-brainer for me. The results are outstanding and if you don't like the medium contrast look, all it takes is a nudge of the slider in Capture One LE to dismiss that concern.

[sreidvt]

In many respects, the Ultron compares well with the Summicron, including resolution wide open. The filters are a factor because the Ultron is not as well coated as the Summicron. This contributes to its lower contrast (which I often like) but it can cause problems when one adds:

 

28 Ultron + filter + light sources in the lens' FOV (which of course is wider than what we see in the M8 capture)

 

The filters add enough flare potential that, coupled with the Ultron's weaker coatings, lighting sources within the lens' FOV can create strong flare in the final picture.

 

I like lower contrast lenses and I like my 28 Ultron, which I've used professionally for several years. But when I'm using filters, I prefer higher contrast lenses because of the flare problem sometimes induced by the filters.

 

I discuss all this in my review of 28 mm RF lenses.

 

Cheers,

 

Sean

[sreidvt]

I do like my Ultron 28/1.9 but you better read the Erwin Puts comments on this lens

 

"The Ultron 1.9/28.

 

The difference between 1.9 and 2 can be neglected so I limit myself to the f/2 aperture. At full aperture the lens exhibits low to medium contrast and definition of very fine detail is soft but very even over the image field extending till the corners. The extreme corners are very soft. Even finer details are resolved in the center, but rapidly become softer when going to the zonal area. There is no astimatism and only a very small amount of curvature of field.

 

There is some barrel distortion, but quite small. At 2.8 the overall contrast improves and at f/4 the optimum is reached. After f/8 contrast lowers again and from there we see a softening of image details with every additional stop. This is usual behaviour. At f/4 we note a resolution over the whole image area of above 100 lp/mm.

 

As a design philosphy this lens is a bit tuned to high resolution versus high contrast.

 

Mechanically this lens is excellent: no decentring at all, collimation at zero. As with the 3.5/90 there is a definite amount of play in the focusing mount. Also the amount of dust in the lens is above what we are see in Leica lenses.

 

Still at wider apertures the lens is a shade soft and lacks the clarity and crispness of the Summicron-M 2/28. I shot pictures with Kodak E100VS and in low light and contre-jour situations and noted the low contrast compared to the Summicron. Specifically the tightness and sparkle of high light and shadow rendition was excellent with the Summicron and a bit dull and washed out with the Ultron 28.

 

These differences in rendition are quite visible in critical inspection and may or mey be not be not interesting for some users. Fact is they exist.

 

Where the Summicron 28 excels is the high contrast and the very crisp rendition of extremely fine detail, given the Summicron images a brillance and clarity that can be compared to the Ultron's duller representation.

 

Stopped down the differences are quite small.

 

The Leica Summicron 28 has the advantage of superior mechanical engineering and materials. It also sports a visibly better imagery at wider apertures. Wide open there is no contest: Leica is still the one to beat. If you do not see the difference, you are the cause! It as simple as that! And while the Ultron comes close, it just is not able to challenge at wide apertures. Stopped down it is a draw.

 

The Ultron 28 is one third of the price of the Leica and delivers excellent, and close to outstanding imagery. For heavy duty use the choice is simple: Leica. For somewhat less demanding situations the Ultron is a tempting alternative, if you can live with its lack lustre wide open performance. To get some perspective: an older 28mm lens from Leica is blown to pieces by the Ultron.

 

MTF measurements show that the Ultron at wide apertures delivers quality that is one step behind the Summicron: The 20 lp/mm of the Summicron have a contrast transfer of 90%. The Ultron has 76%. At 10 lp/mm the Ultron has 88%. So Voigtlander at 10 lp/mm is as good as Leica at 20 lp. That does show!

 

While the Summicron is still the one to beat, the Ultron delivers quality, that was unbelievable some years ago. Leica designers are challenged!!"

 

Viewpoint | Photography and image capture: the Leica technique and philosophy by Erwin Puts | Erwin Puts

 

Erwin's is *a* perspective.

 

Cheers,

 

Sean

[elviskennedy]

Erwin's is *a* perspective.

 

Cheers,

 

Sean

 

Just like everyone else's is.