flappo Posted February 26 Share #1 Posted February 26 (edited) Advertisement (gone after registration) So I bought a D Lux 8 , thinking it had a semblance of a hands on easy to use interface like in the good old days Wish I'd read up on this , I am starting to dislike this camera and should've bought something with real button control , this is just annoying , really ridiculous you have to go through a load of menus to set the camera mode ... smh... slows everything down .. photography is about spontaneity , capturing that special moment not navigating through a maze of archaic options then missing the picture opportunity ... VERY disappointed there is no physical knob on the camera to change modes.. I can see why people love the old rangefinder M leica's now Edited February 26 by flappo 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted February 26 Posted February 26 Hi flappo, Take a look here Why are modern cameras SO complicated ??. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
evikne Posted February 26 Share #2 Posted February 26 My wife has a Leica V-Lux that she only uses in full Auto Mode. I myself only use fully manual settings on my M10. I've tried borrowing her camera and setting it manually but have given up; I can't figure out even the most basic settings. I end up using it on Auto as well. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
espelt Posted February 26 Share #3 Posted February 26 That's probably how it will be in 2025. Everything seems to be very simple, technology makes everything easier and AI takes care of the rest. It's all just too much for me. Not just with modern cameras. I'm already failing at the new TV. Luckily I bought it in a small shop. And the owner came by to make a quick adjustment. The last rental car was also exciting. Some Asian model. All not bad. But by the time I had all the flashing and beeping under control, I was almost there after an hour. A bit annoyed... Maybe I'm getting too old for this kind of thing. I don't need a Thermomix. You throw the ingredients into the top and lunch comes out at the bottom after an hour. I also don't need a smart home where the lights and music automatically turn on. I still like doing things myself. Preferably with an M2 or M4. Just take it, preset the distance, then the aperture and time - done. You're ready to go. The Monochrom does what I want too. You don't really need to spend much time looking at the menu here. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pippy Posted February 26 Share #4 Posted February 26 I have a couple of the older Leica P'n'S cameras (D-Lux 4 and V-Lux 40) and whilst the results are perfectly fine for casual snapping having to search through the various menus to find 'stuff' drives me to distraction. I do like the cameras themselves - the D-Lux 4 in particular - but the User Experience is, for me, quite maddening. The fact that there is little 'common ground' between the controls and menu settings of both models is another minor annoyance and the effect of all of these numerous Minor Annoyances does add up. Things, I'm fairly sure(?), would be OK were I to stick with only one of the cameras and use it regularly but I can't understand why the menu settings are so counter-intuitive (IMO) in the first place. As such I try to avoid using them altogether which, of course, doesn't exactly help matters in terms of familiarisation with the things... Philip. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viv Posted February 26 Share #5 Posted February 26 The simplest rangefinder camera I owned was the Zeiss Ikon. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris W Posted February 26 Share #6 Posted February 26 (edited) Cameras are complicated because online reviewers and users demand multiple features, no matter how niche. I like that Leica and Hasselblad have bucked the trend, even removing video from some models. Unfortunately, the systems with the best focussing and low light are often the systems with the most buttons, knobs, complex menus etc. Edited February 26 by Chris W 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wda Posted February 26 Share #7 Posted February 26 Advertisement (gone after registration) I agree generally with members. My solution is to get the camera set for general situations and save that as a User Setting. Shoot, making adjustments as I proceed, then before I finish , I reset the camera to my User Setting, ready for next time. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
roydonian Posted February 26 Share #8 Posted February 26 My solution was to buy an M-D in 2017, followed by a Series 60 last year. No screen, no menus - Yippee! The Typ 109 that I used when attending trade shows is now consigned to a drawer. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
flappo Posted February 26 Author Share #9 Posted February 26 The M-D Looks like my kind of camera !! Think I'll investigate further !! Thanks !! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pippy Posted February 26 Share #10 Posted February 26 (edited) 2 hours ago, Viv said: The simplest rangefinder camera I owned was the Zeiss Ikon. The simplest rangefinder camera body I own is an M-D Typ-262. Other than ISO and Shutter Speed there is essentially nothing else(*) which can be set / adjusted on the body. As the lens used will only has adjustments for Focus and Aperture using such a camera is simplicity itself. Philip. * EDIT : It does, additionally, have a 'self-timer' setting... Edited February 26 by pippy 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dazzajl Posted February 26 Share #11 Posted February 26 5 hours ago, flappo said: really ridiculous you have to go through a load of menus to set the camera mode What modes exactly are we talking about here? Mostly with these sorts of cameras, there is pain to be taken getting them set the way that works for you but after that one time deal, everything you need should be at your fingertips. What's much worse than your problems though, is that I now want an M-D because of this thread!! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
flappo Posted February 26 Author Share #12 Posted February 26 The normal ones program ,ap ,sp , m ..it’s do able just seems to be a lot of faffing about From looking at the manual it appears you can assign the rear buttons to the job ,something I shall investigate further I’m probably over reacting Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dazzajl Posted February 26 Share #13 Posted February 26 15 minutes ago, flappo said: I’m probably over reacting It’s possible but we’ll do the classy thing and not draw attention to it 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
just3aBro Posted February 26 Share #14 Posted February 26 vor 9 Stunden schrieb flappo: So I bought a D Lux 8 , thinking it had a semblance of a hands on easy to use interface like in the good old days Wish I'd read up on this , I am starting to dislike this camera and should've bought something with real button control , this is just annoying , really ridiculous you have to go through a load of menus to set the camera mode ... smh... slows everything down .. photography is about spontaneity , capturing that special moment not navigating through a maze of archaic options then missing the picture opportunity ... VERY disappointed there is no physical knob on the camera to change modes.. I can see why people love the old rangefinder M leica's now I find this statement quite extreme since the Leica actually has an extremely streamlined and super simple-to-use menu. I have a hard time understanding this. After all, you can adjust all settings using the various dials, and the menu provides immediate access to the essential options. Could you elaborate on this so that I can better understand your perspective? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
espelt Posted February 26 Share #15 Posted February 26 vor 34 Minuten schrieb just3aBro: so that I can better understand your perspective? I still have the D-Lux 5. It's a great little camera. Perfect to always have with you. Especially for occasions when you don't really have time for "real" photos. But fiddling with the little buttons - omg. And the menu navigation - somehow a tangle of setting options for everything and yet nothing. That is of course a very individual feeling. I'm probably too old for that kind of stuff and my fingers are too fat now. At least my eyes are still perfectly fine.... That's my favorite menu navigation Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 2 Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/419522-why-are-modern-cameras-so-complicated/?do=findComment&comment=5764298'>More sharing options...
pippy Posted February 26 Share #16 Posted February 26 5 hours ago, Dazzajl said: ...What's much worse than your problems though, is that I now want an M-D because of this thread!!... 23 minutes ago, espelt said: I still have the D-Lux 5. It's a great little camera. Perfect to always have with you. Especially for occasions when you don't really have time for "real" photos. But fiddling with the little buttons - omg. And the menu navigation - somehow a tangle of setting options for everything and yet nothing... That's my favorite menu navigation ... I think I'm correct in saying the D-Lux 4 (which I have) and D-Lux 5 are very similar in their 'functions' and, as such, agree wholeheartedly. As far as favourite menu navigation goes here's the (remarkably similar!) rear screen and button layout of the M-D Typ-262; Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 😸 Philip. 4 Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 😸 Philip. ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/419522-why-are-modern-cameras-so-complicated/?do=findComment&comment=5764316'>More sharing options...
espelt Posted February 26 Share #17 Posted February 26 The M-D - unfortunately very rare and if so, only available as a collector's item at the appropriate price. Still very attractive... But I can still manage the menu of the M Monochrom quite well. You only need it very little. In defense of Leica: I'm not sure whether Leitz has anything to do with the menu navigation of the small point and shot cameras. They come from Panasonic. And somehow come from a slightly different philosophy. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dazzajl Posted February 26 Share #18 Posted February 26 20 minutes ago, espelt said: The M-D - unfortunately very rare and if so, only available as a collector's item at the appropriate price This is a very good, if somewhat sad point. Maybe another M8 is the answer. For most intents and purposes, that’s a camera without a screen too. 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pippy Posted February 26 Share #19 Posted February 26 2 hours ago, espelt said: ...I can still manage the menu of the M Monochrom quite well. You only need it very little... Once again I am in complete agreement. I have an M Monochrom and its screen is used primarily to set ISO, Lens Detection (if I remember!) and Battery Charge Status before I walk out the door. The screen does come in handy on those "Hen's Teeth" days when I choose to shoot with the 21mm f4.0 Super-Angulon as I do not (yet) own a 21mm finder. Going back to the OP; would it be possible for, say, Leica to make a D-Lux with fixed rotary controls for ISO, Shutter-Speed and Aperture and let all the 'unimportant' stuff to be accessible, by those who might like to use them, by using a D-Pad and a few extra buttons set in an out-of-the-way place or is that just 'Pie-in-the-Sky' thinking on my part? Philip. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dazzajl Posted February 26 Share #20 Posted February 26 17 minutes ago, pippy said: would it be possible for, say, Leica to make a D-Lux with fixed rotary controls for ISO, Shutter-Speed and Aperture and let all the 'unimportant' stuff to be accessible, by those who might like to use them, by using a D-Pad and a few extra buttons I think that’s called a ‘Fuji’ 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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