Any M8 users with Nikon D3 or d300 experience?

[ptomsu]

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Plus of course, the 14-24mm on a D3 goes much wider than a WATE at 16mm does on an M8 (equivalent to 21mm FF).

 

That front lens element is vulnerable and good to hear the lens hood took the knock. Let us know how much Nikon charge...

 

You are right with the 21 mm of the WATE on the M8.

 

But I am already clculating the M9 FF and then it will be 16mm

 

Maybe this is just my wishful thinking.

 

Anyway it shows how I feel about my M system. I completely took it out of this daily competition, I know what I can achieve with it and I love to work with it and touch it. So I am slowly reaching the point where I will have collected all actual available new M glass and I m also using it. Maybe not to the extent I am using my DSLR, but when I use it I know why

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[Eikonphoto]

Something no one yet has mentioned on the D3, is the 'virtual horizon' feature. Absolutely brilliant.

Even though I am not a landscape photographer it is incredibly useful. I've already used it several times in church situations where it's helped get the shot right. The 12-24 is a great lens, but for the majority of my work the new 24-70 2.8 is just a fabulous all rounder. I will continue to use the M8 professionally because there are situations to which it lends itself very well. Having said that, the D3 has taken away some of that territory with it's extraordinary low light capabilities.

[marknorton]

Karen - I agree, with the 14-24, 24-70, 70-200, 200-400 and a few select primes, all bases are covered. I like the virtual horizon feature, it would have been good to have it work on the tilt (forwards/backwards) axis as well.

 

I certainly hope that Leica pull something special out of the R10 hat which will confound even us D3 converts. The R has never enjoyed the sales volume of the M and they are going to have their work cut out to avoid a "ho-hum" reaction and so put the R10 on the map. DMR users will be able to confirm, but I have this feeling that DMR IQ is better than M8 IQ and the R10 will need to steal a march on the competition. If we really have to wait until 2010 for an M9 (seeing as the M8 is best seen as a "learning exercise"), I think the M8 will be looking rather long in the tooth by that stage.

 

Looks like they are are busy though - if you look at the career section of the web-site, a number of positions on offer for hardware and software developers and optical designers with start dates "as soon as possible". Given the lead time for a new recruit to become productive, they look to be resource constrained.

[Eikonphoto]

Karen - I agree, with the 14-24, 24-70, 70-200, 200-400 and a few select primes, all bases are covered. I like the virtual horizon feature, it would have been good to have it work on the tilt (forwards/backwards) axis as well.

 

I certainly hope that Leica pull something special out of the R10 hat which will confound even us D3 converts. The R has never enjoyed the sales volume of the M and they are going to have their work cut out to avoid a "ho-hum" reaction and so put the R10 on the map. DMR users will be able to confirm, but I have this feeling that DMR IQ is better than M8 IQ and the R10 will need to steal a march on the competition. If we really have to wait until 2010 for an M9 (seeing as the M8 is best seen as a "learning exercise"), I think the M8 will be looking rather long in the tooth by that stage.

 

Looks like they are are busy though - if you look at the career section of the web-site, a number of positions on offer for hardware and software developers and optical designers with start dates "as soon as possible". Given the lead time for a new recruit to become productive, they look to be resource constrained.

Mark

I had not thought about the forward/back axis. I was close to taking the R dmr route, and more recently close to jumping ship from Nikon to Canon ..... usually when I get that feeling, it's good to wait. In this case I'm glad I did. Along with the line up you mention I also have the 80-400 VR - which is a dog of a lens until you need it - but now coupled with incredible iso capabilities, the D3 gives this lens a whole new lifespan. I am not a tech geek, but this D3 is just truly allowing me to push my own creative boundaries with the aid of some amazing photographic technology. I don't think it takes away from what my M8 and noctilux can do - it just gives more creative choices.

[Guest guy_mancuso]

Karen - I agree, with the 14-24, 24-70, 70-200, 200-400 and a few select primes, all bases are covered. I like the virtual horizon feature, it would have been good to have it work on the tilt (forwards/backwards) axis as well.

 

I certainly hope that Leica pull something special out of the R10 hat which will confound even us D3 converts. The R has never enjoyed the sales volume of the M and they are going to have their work cut out to avoid a "ho-hum" reaction and so put the R10 on the map. DMR users will be able to confirm, but I have this feeling that DMR IQ is better than M8 IQ and the R10 will need to steal a march on the competition. If we really have to wait until 2010 for an M9 (seeing as the M8 is best seen as a "learning exercise"), I think the M8 will be looking rather long in the tooth by that stage.

 

Looks like they are are busy though - if you look at the career section of the web-site, a number of positions on offer for hardware and software developers and optical designers with start dates "as soon as possible". Given the lead time for a new recruit to become productive, they look to be resource constrained.

 

 

Mark not sure you think 2010 for a M9. Why not next year. The whole ball game is changed and if not sooner than Leica maybe in trouble. My bet is Photokinia 08 with the R10. Now Leica has to ramp up the technology and the production times to do it but I'm hoping a year from now in my hands for both of them. They can't wait two years from now. If they want to be in the game than they need to come alive with product soon.

[terrycioni]

Mark

I had not thought about the forward/back axis. I was close to taking the R dmr route, and more recently close to jumping ship from Nikon to Canon ..... usually when I get that feeling, it's good to wait. In this case I'm glad I did. Along with the line up you mention I also have the 80-400 VR - which is a dog of a lens until you need it - but now coupled with incredible iso capabilities, the D3 gives this lens a whole new lifespan. I am not a tech geek, but this D3 is just truly allowing me to push my own creative boundaries with the aid of some amazing photographic technology. I don't think it takes away from what my M8 and noctilux can do - it just gives more creative choices.

 

Exactly - the M8 is a great tool and in many situations is the only way to go. On the subject of the Nikkor 80-400, I agree. With the D3 it does take on a whole new life because of the excellent ISO capabilities the camera. Recently using the 80/400, I set-up the D3 with auto ISO and a minimum shutter speed of 200 and ISO 2000 - all of this considering the light levels I was shooting in. The D3 auto ISO implementation is a real bonus feature on a pro body.

 

I have set-up the horizon level feature on one of the changeable front function buttons so I can check the horizon without putting the camera down, yet another nice feature.

 

That all said - the M8 is near and dear to my heart.

 

Best Regards. Terry.

[Eikonphoto]

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Exactly - the M8 is a great tool and in many situations is the only way to go. On the subject of the Nikkor 80-400, I agree. With the D3 it does take on a whole new life because of the excellent ISO capabilities the camera. Recently using the 80/400, I set-up the D3 with auto ISO and a minimum shutter speed of 200 and ISO 2000 - all of this considering the light levels I was shooting in. The D3 auto ISO implementation is a real bonus feature on a pro body.

 

I have set-up the horizon level feature on one of the changeable front function buttons so I can check the horizon without putting the camera down, yet another nice feature.

 

That all said - the M8 is near and dear to my heart.

 

Best Regards. Terry.

 

Terry

That's a good idea on the the front function button - I will have to look up in the manual how to do that. Not having a manual like a phone book is one of the things I love about the M8. Of course learning the M8's quirks and how to focus one's noctilux is the flip side I guess. I have not experimented with the auto iso feature but now the ball game has shifted from the usable max of 800 into a whole new stadium, I suspect it will come in very handy. For my personal work, and to carry around - the M8 is it. If I was not a pro, I couldn't imagine the need for some of this huge equipment we lug around. Having just written that sentence I realize I'm the one that slepped a 300lb medium format kit through a rainforest a few years ago!! Times change

Best wishes

[marknorton]

Mark not sure you think 2010 for a M9. Why not next year. The whole ball game is changed and if not sooner than Leica maybe in trouble. My bet is Photokinia 08 with the R10. Now Leica has to ramp up the technology and the production times to do it but I'm hoping a year from now in my hands for both of them. They can't wait two years from now. If they want to be in the game than they need to come alive with product soon.

 

Does make me think that Photokina needs to be held every year, not every other year given the pace of developments, or else Leica need to become comfortable launching products at PMA, not just Photokina. Sadly, because I am so tied up with Nikon, the R10 is of interest only as a Leica enthusiast, a third system is out of the question!

[stnolan]

I have two M8's and now with all of the great reviews of the new Nikons, I'm thinking of selling one of them and picking up either a D300 or D3. Tried a D300 out and was impressed by high ISO low light performance. Two totally different formats, but now I'm thinking it would be better to have some variety for the types of shooting I do. I was also amazed that the size difference between M8 and D300 (w/ 50mm f1.8) was negligable.

[monza]

These two complement each other very well.

 

D300 with 50/1.4 manual focus AI lens, and M8 with a 21/4 Skopar. (Sorry for the crappy cell phone photo.)

 

[chris_livsey]

I was also amazed that the size difference between M8 and D300 (w/ 50mm f1.8) was negligable.

 

In the posted shot above that difference does not, to my eye, look negligible. M6 to M8 now thats negligible but I still find it disconcerting.

[stnolan]

I had my M8 with me when I went to try the D300. In your hands the difference does not seem great, but I agree the picture looks as though it is.

[chris_livsey]

I had my M8 with me when I went to try the D300. In your hands the difference does not seem great, but I agree the picture looks as though it is.

 

Subjective counts for a lot. As I said the M6/M8 difference is negligible but the difference feels far more. I don't doubt in the hand D300/M8 feel similar. I have only held the D3 and again subjectively it felt the size of a series 1 Canon. (Apologies for using the C word in this thread.)

[Guest tummydoc]

I must say that I am rather struck by the cavalier attitude on the part of so many in regards to changing kit, particularly very expensive (>$5000) pieces thereof. People seem almost impatient for their current kit to be replaced by the next iteration. I make "a good buck" as they say, and yet I am not the least bit anticipatory of trading off my M8 in another year for half that which I paid, no matter if the M9 no longer needs the IR filters (I've already bought a stack of them, which will likewise become a valueless footnote to the M8's idiotic "feature"), or if it is full-frame (I keep a C/V 12mm which equates to 16mm on the M8, and if I truly wanted to go ridiculously wide I could probably mount a Nikkor fisheye with the appropriate adaptor). I suppose my arrogance has its limits, because I can't bring myself to claim that my photographic talent is so immense that it's crippled by the limits imposed by the M8's capabilities.

[stnolan]

I would say that I'm considering altering my kit more than changing. I have two M8's and am considering changing one of them for the "D". Seems like it might be best of both worlds. Another forum member mentioned "different horses for different courses". Two different tools that I think will give me better coverage for my work. I love the M8 and still regularly use my M3 and M7.

[marknorton]

Vinay, I'd say your arrogance has no limits but that's amother matter. The attraction for me of the (theoretical) M9 is that it has the opportunity to fix some of the fundamental issues with the M8. My investment in M lenses is far greater than M bodies and I think the M8 will be seen in time as a stepping stone, not a timeless classic.

 

The opportunity to use the full image circle of my lenses has been reinforced by my experience with the D3 - no, not the Digilux 3, the other one. My message to Leica is that if they have learned from the M8 and the M9 offers real progress in terms of sensor and focussing, I'll be there to support it (though not necessarily to buy 3 of them and dismantle one....). Bring it on, I say.

[Guest guy_mancuso]

Short story , I bought a Mac Pro Sept in 06 when the new model just came out. Jack just bought a newer model last week and paid about 700 less and has more processing power. We just ran a test on a image doing the same action, my box took 1:31 to complete it. His took 51 seconds. There will ALWAYS be bigger, better and faster computers and camera's and for that matter any electronics that can do the job better. We all now this in almost anything we buy. Will the M9 be better , sure it will and no question will it not be. It does not make the M8 a dinosaur though and one like everything else will have to figure if the cost is worth the benefits. I love the M8's with warts and all but if a M9 comes and it is truly a better box than me like many others will get one. My Iphone firmware was just updated and it made the investment even better. A M9 will be better just simply by technology available at the time it is made. The Wagon had a wooden wheel now we have run flat tires with steel and rubber.

 

Honestly ever Leica shooter on the planet should be thrilled that Nikon has taken a major step forward. This is the kind of stuff that makes the industry better for all and it will trickle into the next versions of ever camera OEM out there , if Charlie over there can do it than Harry certainly will copy it and make it better and so on. I'm thrilled for Nikon and it's users they finally have a box that is really good not just good but really good. Is it great only images will tell that story but they certainly put a foot forward and Leica and Canon will do exactly the same next time.

[stunsworth]

Vinay, I'd say your arrogance has no limits but that's amother matter.

 

Remember that Vinay claims to have spent - from memory, and I'm prepared to be corrected here - some $500,000 on Leica cameras and lenses. I imagine when the M9 comes out he'll be first in line to try and buy one regardless of how he may criticise others who wish to do the same thing.

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[ptomsu]

Short story , I bought a Mac Pro Sept in 06 when the new model just came out. Jack just bought a newer model last week and paid about 700 less and has more processing power. We just ran a test on a image doing the same action, my box took 1:31 to complete it. His took 51 seconds. There will ALWAYS be bigger, better and faster computers and camera's and for that matter any electronics that can do the job better. We all now this in almost anything we buy. Will the M9 be better , sure it will and no question will it not be. It does not make the M8 a dinosaur though and one like everything else will have to figure if the cost is worth the benefits. I love the M8's with warts and all but if a M9 comes and it is truly a better box than me like many others will get one. My Iphone firmware was just updated and it made the investment even better. A M9 will be better just simply by technology available at the time it is made. The Wagon had a wooden wheel now we have run flat tires with steel and rubber.

 

Honestly ever Leica shooter on the planet should be thrilled that Nikon has taken a major step forward. This is the kind of stuff that makes the industry better for all and it will trickle into the next versions of ever camera OEM out there , if Charlie over there can do it than Harry certainly will copy it and make it better and so on. I'm thrilled for Nikon and it's users they finally have a box that is really good not just good but really good. Is it great only images will tell that story but they certainly put a foot forward and Leica and Canon will do exactly the same next time.

 

Guy,

 

I only can back this!

 

It is important for al of us and for photography in general that such innovations like the first M8 or the first DSLR - a Nikon D1 - and now the Nikon D3 happen.

 

My hope through all the past almost 10 years from the introduction of the D1 was, to get away from the Crop sensor and get a FF DSLR, where I could use all my FF Nikon glass. And now the D3 is there, but it does not only offer FF for Nikon first time, it also brings a lot of other important and first on the market innovations which will make Nikon photography better and easier but also will make competition to move and adopt or outperform the D3 technologies.

 

Same true for a M9. The M9 - if it hopefully is FF - will be the same for me (and many others) what the D3 was for Nikon. I do not understand all the claims of people her who doubt that some new and better technology shall be introduced as available. This way of thinking is dad. If this is unfortunate everybody has to decide for himself, but in general no vendor nor serious users will be able to survive if they do not accept these rules. Of course there are always exceptions, but mainstream will have different rules. And these rules are the rules of intelligent and helpful change.

[Guest guy_mancuso]

I agree Peter Full Frame is one thing and for some maybe not that important but the other features that Nikon has brought forth are more important to the user overall but even more important to the industry, look just at the high ISO noise levels that are very good just that alone will get others to see what they did and use that going forward. These little improvements will keep coming from Nikon, canon and leica and help build the future technology. Honestly this is all good stuff. Now even though for some folks like myself that try and work only with the M system there are times you just can't and i even just bought a 5d recently just to get some things done easier but I really don't like it on a personal feeling but business dictates it. I need to use it but i may just dump it and get the Nikons. I always liked there lenses better and there flash system a whole lot better than Canon. But now Nikon has introduced some features that are very welcome too for a lot of folks and more important there files are looking really good. So many folks may change things up in there lineup and that can be a good thing for them. It's all about choices in the tools we use to get a final result and whatever works best is what you should go with. Everyone knows how much i love my Leica's but I am not blind either if something is better or needed i will get that also.