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51 minutes ago, derleicaman said:

Wonderful replies here, everyone!

Let's see if we can get together in Wetzlar in Ocotber during the LSI annual meeting. I can see about setting up a meeting with Tim Pullmann in the Archiv, to see if we can get access to some of these records.

Let me know who is interested.

 

I am certainly interested!
It would be fascinating to find out how the cameras of the 1924-1926 Leitz engravings register (Nr. 126-2066) travelled through time and ended up in the delivery register 'Kamera'.
This information is not available now.

In this way we could also see what additional cameras (apart from Nr. 130, 132, 143) were part of Auftragsnummer 416.
It is very well possible that one of these cameras was presented to Curt Emmermann.
 

Roland

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Jim Lager will be there, as well as William Fagan and myself. Ed Schwartzreich is still undecided about attending, but I am trying to persuade him. I am sure I can get Ulf Richter to come. Perhaps I can convince Lars Netopil as well.

Anyone else?

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That is good news indeed.
Please try and convice Ed Schwartzreich!
I have registered with my wife for the October Wetzlar event already.
The programme includes a visit to the archive.
But this is only a very short visit; not enough for the questions that I have in mind 🙂

Roland

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2 hours ago, derleicaman said:

Wonderful replies here, everyone!

Let's see if we can get together in Wetzlar in Ocotber during the LSI annual meeting. I can see about setting up a meeting with Tim Pullmann in the Archiv, to see if we can get access to some of these records.

Let me know who is interested.

 

That would be great.  Please include  me.

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56 minutes ago, derleicaman said:

Jim Lager will be there, as well as William Fagan and myself. Ed Schwartzreich is still undecided about attending, but I am trying to persuade him. I am sure I can get Ulf Richter to come. Perhaps I can convince Lars Netopil as well.

Anyone else?

I hope to visit the archive with Jim Lager and yourself to see a few specific record items. Lars, who is an LSI member, should be there and he he will have got his own auction out of the way earlier in the month and he should have No 121 sold by then. For general archive tours Tim Pullmann says he can maybe take up to 15 people at a time. At this stage we have over 150 people booked which could potentially mean up to 10 tours which would be difficult to handle as Tim is doing all of these himself at the moment, unless he can train in someone else before October. I have reached out to Hari Subramanyam who is organising and chairing the Wetzlar Conference about facilitating archive visits and he is talking to the Leitz Park people.

52 minutes ago, Roland Zwiers said:

 

That is good news indeed.
Please try and convice Ed Schwartzreich!
I have registered with my wife for the October Wetzlar event already.
The programme includes a visit to the archive.
But this is only a very short visit; not enough for the questions that I have in mind 🙂

Roland

I look forward to meeting you there, Roland. The restriction on questions will probably remain the case. Leitz Park does not currently have the staff resources to enable long and detailed research visits. I advised you before to ask specific short questions, a few at a time. On general visits Tim will be showing and demonstrating to groups and won't have the space and time for looking up details. 

Best Wishes

William 

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William,

My most burning question is short and specific: how have the cameras of the 1924-1926 Leitz engravings register (Nr. 126-2066) ended up in the delivery register 'Kamera'?

but this question cannot be answered in 15 minutes!

My second short and specific question would be: what names on page 115 of Oskar Barnack's work notes can be found in the delivery register 'Kamera' as well?

 

Kind regards and take care,

Roland

 

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Perhaps we can organize some questions to be addressed ahead of time. I did this with seeing M875 when we were there last October. It took Ulf Richter to finally track it down. Frank Heymel was working in the archives up until last year when he was re-assigned to Customer Care. Perhaps we can have Fank assist us while we are there, which would help free up Tim. The records we want to see are not in the general Archive room, but are located with the Rolf Fricke collection in a seperate room. There are files in the full height cabinets where the production files are. I am sure they have Barnacks's work notes there as well. Perhaps Lars can give us some insight into this as well.

Tim is a very nice person, but out of his depth with locating what we are looking for. This needs to be addressed as these valuable records are going to waste. Jim Lager used to have a good handle on these records as he had access to them years ago in the old Admin Building across from the old factory in Wetzlar. All of those files have been moved to Leitz Park. Another person who may be able to help is Helmut Lagler. I don't know him personally, but Ed has been working with him on reviewing his new book series for Viewfinder.

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16 minutes ago, derleicaman said:

Perhaps we can organize some questions to be addressed ahead of time. I did this with seeing M875 when we were there last October. It took Ulf Richter to finally track it down. Frank Heymel was working in the archives up until last year when he was re-assigned to Customer Care. Perhaps we can have Fank assist us while we are there, which would help free up Tim. The records we want to see are not in the general Archive room, but are located with the Rolf Fricke collection in a seperate room. There are files in the full height cabinets where the production files are. I am sure they have Barnacks's work notes there as well. Perhaps Lars can give us some insight into this as well.

Tim is a very nice person, but out of his depth with locating what we are looking for. This needs to be addressed as these valuable records are going to waste. Jim Lager used to have a good handle on these records as he had access to them years ago in the old Admin Building across from the old factory in Wetzlar. All of those files have been moved to Leitz Park. Another person who may be able to help is Helmut Lagler. I don't know him personally, but Ed has been working with him on reviewing his new book series for Viewfinder.

Bill, I agree about having pre-prepared questions, but these would need to be concise and focussed. All of the records are in large grey cabinets (with revolving wheels) just opposite the Fricke collection.

Tim seems to have a great many functions and it is not his fault that he always seems to have too much to do. We should keep him 'on side', though. Tim drew my attention to the Helmut Lagler books in the Museum shop when I was over last year. They are large and heavy and in German, but they contain a lot of interesting material.  I did not purchase them while I was there because of their size and weight and I am still thinking about an online purchase. I have put Roland in touch with Ed in relation to Wolff and other matters and I suggest that Roland asks Ed about whether the books contain anything relevant to the questions he has raised above. Ed has the books and has reviewed them for Viewfinder. Tim confirmed to me that Lagler's material is not available online, it is just in printed form.

If you can get Frank Heymel free for some time while we are in Wetzlar that would be good. There is also a man called Peter Brieger in Customer Care who has sent me information from time to time. They have scanned all of the delivery registers into a database and will send information on individual cameras by serial number using a look up system via info@leica-camera.com . The Wolff camera delivery details above are examples of that. To see full pages you have to go to the archive with Tim. I also have had contact with a young man called Liam (same as my name in Irish) Arne who works in the Classic Store. Liam seems to report to Tim.

It would be good to have Lars there as well of course, particularly in respect of interpreting records.

All of this would have to be scheduled separately from what could be a substantial number of general tours of the archive during the LSI event. We are hitting record numbers for this event and there will also be museum tours in the same building.

1 hour ago, Roland Zwiers said:

 

William,

My most burning question is short and specific: how have the cameras of the 1924-1926 Leitz engravings register (Nr. 126-2066) ended up in the delivery register 'Kamera'?

but this question cannot be answered in 15 minutes!

My second short and specific question would be: what names on page 115 of Oskar Barnack's work notes can be found in the delivery register 'Kamera' as well?

 

Kind regards and take care,

Roland

 

Roland, the early deliveries are not in books, they are just a few loose sheets in plastic folders - see the example from the 130 series which I posted above. I am sure that Tim will allow you to photograph them. He won't be able to answer your specific questions as they would require further research, but you should be able to compare the material you have already with what is in the delivery registers.  Believe me, I am trying to be helpful in relation to the situation in Wetzlar and to steer you towards the information that you want.

So, let's draw up a list of information that they might have and I would start by throwing in the order numbers and asking them if they have any record or register of those that we can view.

William 

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William, These cabinets are on the right side as you enter the Archive Room with the Fricke collection. The Fricke collection is on the left side and also on the right beyond the cabinets in front.

I think if we approach Tim with some suggestions as to who might help us out, we can get some specific questions and then submit all of this well ahead of time, we can hopefully get this worked out. I will certainly contact Ulf Richter and Lars Netopil. It seems we know three people at Leitz Park who are familiar with the Archive and can help us look at the records we want to see while there. There is a good sized office adjacent to this Archive room, where we can set up a good sized table for us. We would be well out of the way of LSI tour groups, but close to refer to the cabinets in the Archive. There are also some other offices or meeting rooms nearby as well.

Let's get it done!

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Bill and William,

Thank you so much for trying to get access to these important historical primary sources!
Yes I would like to make copies of the delivery register 'Kamera' (the numbers 126-2066 are a good start) and of Oskar Barnack's 1912-1927 work notes 🙂 
In order to analyse Oskar Barnack's handwriting it is important to have access to more pages anyhow!

As a researcher I am seriously handicapped to depend on the bits and pieces of information that I may find in post-war Leica literature.
On one level it is helpful that one can ask specific questions on (all) indivudual cameras.
But how can one get an overall perspective in this way?

For an earlier visit to the archive I already asked two very specific and focussed questions:

  • What other camera numbers and names are part of Auftragsnummer 416 of 19 January 1925 (so apart from Nr. 130, 132, 143)?

Ulf Richter (2009) leaves open the possibility that Nr. 305 to Prof. Muesmann was also delivered very early in 1925.
 

Another very specific question relates to a 1914 prototype that may have had to remain in the patent office for the socalled Gebrauchsmuster application.
This is off-topic for this thread (I may start a new posting for this), but on topic for the preparation of our October 2023 visit to the Leitz achive.
According to Ulf Richter (2014) Ernst Leitz was asked by the German patent office to hand in a physical prototype as part of the application procedure.
If so, then that is crucial information, since we may have to look out for a missing prototype!
Now the patent law of 1891, which still applied in 1914, does not explicitly state that a sample ‘Gebrauchsmuster’ model had to be handed over to the patent office.

So my very specific question is:

  • Does the Leitz archive have information on the 1914 Gebrauchsmuster application?

Roland

 

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Gentlemen,

 I would very much like to be included, I did not register for the October event but I am now looking into attending. I did visit Solms in 1988. Can someone advise is Frankfurt airport the best airport to fly to and from there the best way to Leitz Park.

Regarding the Helmut Lagler books, I have already purchased all available volumes, a lot of information to digest, especially for someone who doesn’t speak German!!!

It might be an idea (if possible) for someone to ask if the loose delivery pages could be photographed in advance of a visit as on the day it might be a lot of information to digest on the day, especially with a major event happening.

regards

Alan

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You would think that to save them the bother of having to answer all these questions from Leica nerds they would scan the early record cards and books and put them on a website where anyone could view them. Much better for long term conservation than having people thumb through the cards/books.

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Alan,

Reading German is much easier than speaking or writing German.
Reading printed German is much easier than reading Oskar Barnack's handwriting!
I recently acquired Swedish photomagazines from the 1920s -1940s and I just started reading!
[50% I can guess already since Swedish is closely related to Dutch, German and English.]
One 1925 magazine has a very interesting Leica review!
Once you are really interested, language is not a barrier anymore.

I would like to know more about these Helmut Lagler books.
Do they contain or comment upon primary sources?

It would be nice to see you in Wetzlar!

Roland

 

 

 

 

 

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On 7/5/2023 at 5:49 AM, alan mcfall said:

A great topic. I appreciate the "stock/flow" chart and realize how much effort goes into such a creation. I allows some possible timing of two of my cameras. #226 may have been scheduled for producton in Aug.-Nov. 1924, engraved in Nov., assembeled in early 1925. I note that in post 15, that camera 225 was delivered to London in late Jan. 1925. If anyone has the delivery information for 226, I would appreciate it. If "regular" production started at 126, than maybe this is the 100/101st of the series. (I know deliveries can be out of order with serials). My camera 656 was assigned for production in Mar. 1925, engraved in june/july and finished later that year. Again, any specific information as to the delivery would be interesting.

As to the early wood enlargers with the fixed 64mm lens. I have 3, one with no serial, #483 and #2566. I do not know if they were serialized from the beginning, starting with 100?  They were sold for several years, up to 1929 or so. As noted, those early model A owners would have been logical customers. I believe mine are all FILAR code. The metal FILES variable enlarger was available in 1926, but mine are not serialized, so the ratio of sales of wood fixed vs. metal variable enlargers seems unknown. Any factory data of 64mm enlarger lens production would be of interest.

Alan,

A technical observation as to the 64mm enlarger lens.
Leitz produced a 1:4,5 64mm Mikro Summar.
Since this lens was corrected for very close-up work, it would have suited perfectly for enlargements as well.
But for small enlargements (6x9 or 9x14cm) this would have been a very expensive solution.

So I suspect that Leitz ordered cheaper 1:7 f=64mm enlargement lenses from a third party.
By 1923 the original Cooke triplet patent had expired.
So many lens makers in Germany could produce three element anastigmatic lenses without having to pay a license.
And in a very competitive market Leitz could select a competitive supplier. 

3-element triplets were not so perfectly corrected as 4-element Tessar type lenses.
But at a low aperture (1:7 instead of 1:4,5 or 1:3,5) a very good correction was still possible.
The relatively long focal lenght (64mm instead of 50mm) also helped to make the best of a 3-element design.

All in all I infer that Leitz didn't produce these simple enlargerer lenses itself.
It was much more economical to select a competitive supplier.

Roland

 

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Pyrogallol said:

You would think that to save them the bother of having to answer all these questions from Leica nerds they would scan the early record cards and books and put them on a website where anyone could view them. Much better for long term conservation than having people thumb through the cards/books.

It is all about cost, time and personnel.  They have no staff whatsoever in the archive and rely totally on staff who have other full time jobs to do. A scanning job was done on certain records at some stage and the staff can look up that information. Establishing, running and maintaining an archive website would not be a small job. We have established an online archive of Leica material at LSI which has required considerable unpaid effort by volunteers. So, we have some idea of what would be involved. I have shown what we have done at LSI to the staff in Wetzlar and they have all been very impressed with what we have. I think that the conference in Wetzlar in October with people like Jim Lager in attendance will offer the possibility to explore what might be done in the future. The information which Leica has is proprietary and belongs to the company, but a lot of it is ‘historical’ at this stage. There are other factors to be considered in addition to the factory records, such as a lot of historical literature and the camera collection. I’ll leave it at that. 
 

William

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2 hours ago, Roland Zwiers said:

Alan,

It would be nice to see you in Wetzlar!

Roland

 

 

 

 

 

Hello Roland,

I have now registered for LSI October, so please include me in any research at the Archives.

I will also have a closer look at at the Lagler books for any missing pieces to the story.

The breadth and depth of this topic so far is probably the best “Null Series” history (that I know of) and hopefully more to follow.

As Bill said earlier “Let’s get it done “

Regards 

Alan

 

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2 hours ago, beoon said:

Frankfurt airport the best airpor

We always use Frankfurt and it is an easy train journey via Frankfurt main station. There was/is talk of LSI organising some transport for the event but not yet confirmed.

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2 hours ago, Roland Zwiers said:

Does the Leitz archive have information on the 1914 Gebrauchsmuster application?

Good question. The earliest patent listed and shown by Ulf Richter is from 1922. I believe that the archive should contain copies of all patent applications which are still around. Richter showed some of them in his book. As regards the first 1914 application Richter mentions ( page 59 of his book) that a bombing raid on Giessen in December 1944 caused the destruction of a lot of Leica archive material and only a file card still exists in respect of the original rejected 1914 application. However, it does seem that Leitz obtained prototype protection for six years and sought and obtained a further 3 year extension which would take us up to 1923, by which stage the 1922 patent would have kicked in. The source of Richter's information is not clear to me, but Ulf seems to be the source of most of the information about patents. 

Jim Lager is of the view that there are no undiscovered prototypes are still around, but it is worthwhile asking questions. You will have an opportunity to discuss this with him in Wetzlar in October.

William 

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The long and winding road: from the Ur-leica to the Handmuster of 1920 

At this stage I basically finished what I wanted to tell about 100 years Null-Serie.
I already expanded the discussion to the series production of the Leica I in 1925 (the stock/flow chart)
and to the likelyhood that Dr Paul Wolff made use of a test series Leica in 1923 and/or 1924.
In the last part of our discussion I referred to the patent/ Gebrauchsmuster application of 1914.

This brings me in Ur-Leica territory and to the long and winding road from the Ur-Leica to the Handmuster of 1920.
As said before, I can not exclude the possibility that this Handmuster (that will be discussed later on) was honoured with Nr. 100 in the delivery book 'Kamera' of 1923.   

It is not so easy to figure out via what route Oskar Barnack finally arrived at his Ur-Leica of 1914.
The available evidence suggests that he arrived at this intermediary stage in a roundabout way.
In my analysis there are four sources of inspiration.
I realise that this may not always correspond with received wisdom:

  • The heavy plate camera that he carried in 1905
  • The miniature cameras available in 1912, especially the British Vestpocket Ensignette and the very similar VP Kodak
  • The 1912 exposure tester as a complement to his movie camera; one thing leads to another
  • Strategic guidance by Ernst Leitz I and II

 

The heavy plate camera of 1905: a desire to create a lighter and more portable alternative

The story of the heavy plate camera is mentioned in Barnack (1931) and repeated several times by Dr Paul Wolff.
One need not doubt Barnack’s desire for a lighter and more portable alternative.
But this cannot be the whole story.
In 1912 his inspiration to create something new must have been related to the problems and solutions that were present in 1912.

In 1931 Oskar Barnack was invited by Curt Emmermann to write a contribution for the first issue of Die Leica.
One can sense that Curt Emmermann needed a lot of convincing before Oskar Barnack agreed.
So when Barnack included his anecdote and implied that this was the reason for creating the Leica, editor Emmermann could not be too critical.

A good journalist should have asked the question: why carry a heavy 13x18 plate camera in 1905 in the first place?
In 1905 there were good quality folding Kodaks on the market.
Even with German lenses and high quality shutters.
And why still embark on a Leica project in 1912 in the middle of a miniature revolution?

The miniature cameras available in 1912, including the British Vestpocket Ensignette and the VP Kodak

This brings me to the second source of inspiration.
In 1912 Oskar Barnack was in the middle of a miniature revolution. 
One can say this revolution already started in 1898 with the introduction of Kodak rollfilm cameras.
One can also point at the 6x4,5cm Gaumont Blocknote (a miniature plate camera) of circa 1906.

In the period after 1906 one good miniature camera after the other came on the market.
Some even had miniature focal plane shutters.
Some used miniature plates.
Some used roll films.

In 1909 a crucial British innovation was the Vestpocket Ensignette, a roll film miniature camera with a miniature size roll film.
In 1912 this miniature gets a very enthusiastic review in a German photo magazine.
All the advantages of a miniature camera are already explained in detail.
The appeal of this camera gets an enormous boost when Ensign provides a complementary enlarger for 9x14cm postcard size prints.

Eastman Kodak is not happy with this British innovation.
It counters with the 1912 Vestpocket Kodak, which uses the slightly bigger 127-film.
still the proportions of the VP Kodak negative are about the same as those of the VP Ensignette.
The complementary Kodak enlarger also prints on 9x14cm paper.

Now I would be very surprised if Oskar Barnack (or Ernst Leitz I and II) was unware of this miniature revolution that was taking place between 1898 and 1912.
One can see that several features of the Ur-Leica are derived from the VP Kodak.
I will give some graphic examples in a follow-up posting. 
One interesting clue is the negative size of the Ur-Leica, which is not 24x36mm.
The negatives of the Ur-Leica are 38mm wide.
Why would this be so?
I infer because negatives of 38mm wide were more suitable for printing on 9x14cm paper.


The 1912 exposure tester as a complement to his movie camera; one thing leads to another

A third source of inspiration for the Ur-Leica must have been the M875 exposure tester as described in 1992 by Georg Mann.
I already made a contribution on this subject in another posting.
[Mutter der Ur-Leica]

 

Strategic guidance by Ernst Leitz I and II

A fourth source of inspiration deserves more attention:
active encouragement if not strategic guidance from Ernst Leitz I and II from the very beginning.
Leica literature stresses the encouragement by Ernst Leitz II after his return from the USA.
Back in Germany he would have remarked that the Ur-Leica was a promising project for the future,
something to keep in mind  (‘Im Augen behalten’).

The case for emphasizing much earlier encouragement on the part of Ernst Leitz I and II rests on several observations.
In 1906-1914 Ernst Leitz senior and junior must have observed the increasing availability of good quality miniature cameras.
The VP Ensignette, the Goerz VP Tenax and the VP Kodak were proven designs that combined not too small negatives with superior optics,
orthochromatic emulsions,  day-light loading systems, and complementray enlargers.
The advanced versions of these cameras were expensive to buy and expensive in use.
But Ernst Leitz 
II did not have to economize on the costs of a hand camera.
Why then would he have preferred to use an experimental Ur-Leica on his June 1914 visit to the USA?

Ernst Leitz II’s decision to bring the Ur-Leica with him shows that he took Oskar Barnack’s Liliput project deadly serious even before his journey to the USA.
This brings us to the cooperation between Oskar Barnack, the inventor, and Ernst Leitz I and II, the entrepreneurs.

Dr Paul Wolff (1941) sketches a picture in which Oskar Barnack had been wasting precious time with tinkering on a not so realistic project.
But suppose all this early tinkering had the explicit encouragement by Ernst Leitz I and II from the very beginning.
Suppose that Ernst Leitz I and II really liked to employ Oskar Barnack (even with his poor health) because of his innovative ideas for 35mm photography and cinematography.
Suppose that they foresaw that the chemistry between Mechau and Barnack might result in complementary innovations around 35mm cine film?
Innovations that might lead to a welcome diversification of the product range.

This hypothesis assumes that the sequence of events was not a coincidence, but to a large extent the result of strategic guidance by visionary entrepreneurs:

  • The employment of Mechau in 1910 followed by that of Barnack in 1911
  • The cooperation between Mechau and Barnack on the movie projector in 1911 and 1912
  • Barnack’s design of a complementary movie camera in 1912 and 1913 with follow-up accessories in the form of a tripod and a panorama head
  • Barnack’s design of a 35mm panorama camera in 1912 with complementary enlarger and projection units
  • Barnack’s design of an exposure tester in 1912
  • Barnack’s design of a heating table, possibly for film development on location in 1913-1914
  • Barnack’s work on the combination of a microscope with cinematography by means of a stable set-up, strong ‘liliput’ arc-light,
    and a devise for viewing the image while filming (‘ein Apparat zur Betrachtung des Bildes bei kinematographischen Aufnahmen‘.)
  • Barnack’s stepwise design of a Liliput camera in 1913 and 1914, as a dual-use camera and exposure meter
  • The patent application of May 1914, even before Ernst Leitz II departure for the USA
  • The improved pre-production model of June 1914 (Mustermodell für Fabrikation (Verbesserung)) while Ernst Leitz II was still in the USA.

In addition to the sequence of events one can look at the timing.
By April 1914 most items on this list were either production ripe or in an advanced prototype stage.
This timing may not have been a coincidence as well.
In this way Ernst Leitz II could better prepare for his 1914 visit to the USA.
He even made sure that there was time left so that Oskar Barnack could explain to him the workings his latest prototype.

A fascinating clue in this respect is an April 1914 article in a German film magazine.
The article must be based on an interview between the author and Emil Mechau and/ or Ernst Leitz II.
The article explains that in April 1914 the Mechau projector was ripe for market introduction.
Mechau had already solved the technical problems at the time of the December 1912 cinematography exhibition in Berlin.
The projector was then produced by Ernst Leitz, but the novelty was not disclosed.
Instead the new projector was 
being tested in the Kaisertheater in Wetzlar for 1¼ years.
The editor assumes that as soon as this projector comes on the market, it will cause a revolution in cinematography
as even America would want to import the new projector.

 

The sequence and timing of the events mentioned above does not suggest that during 1911-1914 Oskar Barnack had been acting on his own.
Ernst Leitz I and II gave Barnack a free hand to act on his curiosity and intrinsic motivation.
But one can feel that their strategic guidance made sure that Mechau and Barnack were making sufficient progress up to April 1914.


At the same time Ernst Leitz I and II must have taken great care that Oskar Barnack would not overwork himself again, as had happened in 1912.
Barnack’s worknotes of August 1913 show a health-related holiday in ‘Bad Ems’.
This must have been a welcome time-out.
In 1917 Ernst Leitz I would also invite Barnack to holidays in the Black Forest.   

Between April and June 1914, possibly after having tested the Ur-Leica, Ernst Leitz II could make up his mind.
He decided to apply for a patent even before his departure for the USA.
And he asked Oskar Barnack to immediately prepare a pre-production model in his absence.
This entrepreneurial drive must have been directed at market introduction in 1915.
The start of war in August 1914 prevented this outcome.
After August 1914 Max Berek had to enlist in the German army and was not available for calculating a better lens until the end of hostilities in November 1918.

To be continued.

Roland

 

.

 

 

[i] The exposition was held from 14 to 20 December 1912. Interestingly, Ernemann won a medal for its Imperator cine projector.  

.

 

 

 

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This is my first attempt to provide input on this Forum.  My personal interest in the Leica Serie "O" is that of the 16 known to exit (Source: Lars Netopil) I have photographed three (3) of them . No. 114 here in Oxford a the Miami University Art Museum Charles Messer Leica Collection, No 119 owned by Leica Camera AG and photographed in Wetzlar and No. 105 which was auctioned off in June 2022 I photographed in Wetzlar and LA at the Leica Store-LA.  To the best of my knowledge No. 114 is the only one on public display of the 16. While I have been trying for the past 4 years to get the University to place No. 114 in a bank vault and display one of the replicates I purchased for them made in 2000 (like Leica AG does) but so far no luck.  If you are interested I can post several photos of No. 105, 119 and a number of 114.. The Messer Leica Collection was lovingly put together by Charles Messer, owner with his brother Fred, of Messer Construction of Cincinnati.  They were and still are a large general contractor and probably responsible for 60% of the buildings on the Miami's campus. My personal opinion is that Mr. Messer gave the collection to Miami as a "thank you" for all of the business the University gave his firm.  He built the art museum building in the mid 1970's that houses the Collection and included a special room for his Collection.  Since its housing in a special room, the Collection has moved several times and now just a small part of it is on public display including No. 114. I will include photos of the original room and the current display later.  One of Mr. Messer's advisors while building the collection was our own Jim Lager. Jim visited Oxford last September for a week and did a video oral history about the Collection and his contribution.  Several of his books are on display with the current pieces on display. I will post photos later.  Again, this is my first post, so if it goes off into space and no one sees is, I will attempt again.  

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