Post Processing Monochrome images. What is your process to get your "looks"?

[Cayenne]

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Hello all,

Ok, I have a M10M.  I LOVE this thing. I love black and white.

But, I'm not quite as happy with my post processed results as I'd like.

Currently, I'm using Capture One as my RAW tool.  I have switched the profile to "Leica Monochrome Neutral" with the curve being "Linear Response".

I'm doing this to start at the basic RAW image...I found letting C1 do too much brining it in, cut into my dynamic range and actually seemed to reduce the options I had to do work on my images.

I'm finding, that the primary tool I use is raise my shadows in the HDR area....as that I'm always trying to shoot to avoid blowing out highlights.  I do work with layers a lot, to try to highlight faces and try to shape light to make people in my images "pop" a bit out of the background.....

But I see what others do and I just don't seem to be able to get those "looks" others get, especially in landscapes, etc.  I can't imaging everyone is using paid for styles....?

 

So, what tools do you use? C1?  LR ?  One1 RAW?

 

And within those tools....what controls or combo of controls do you use in your monochrome workflow?  Do you try to emulate old film looks? 

I love to look on YouTube for hints and learn how others do things, but there seems to be precious little out there on a pure monochrome workflow....all of the existing videos are with color images converted to B&W....and using the color controls to change the image.

 

I do tend to keep at least a yellow filter on my M10M at all times, sometimes switching to orange.

 

Anyway, looking forward to seeing your fav. images and looks along with suggestions of your workflow and what controls you use.

Thank you in advance,

cayenne

[rmueller]

Hi Cayenne,

don't have a M10M, still on the good old MM1. I'm using ACR (Adobe Camera Raw) out of Bridge and really don't do much with the MM files

• Apply a crop in ACR if needed and remove dust 
• Partial increase of Clarity with the brush in ACR in areas where I want a bit more sharpness
• Partial increase of shadows / decrease of highlights with a brush in ACR
• I then open the file in Photoshop (using Smart Objects, so you can go back to ACR for any additional adjustments)
• In PS, pretty much the only other adjustment I'm doing is to add a curve layer with blend mode 'Soft Light' and an opacity to my taste. This gives the image an additional punch, it is like a dodge&burn in one tool. Every color lighter than 50% grey will get lighter and every color darker than 50% grey will get darker but not entirely black. Sometimes I just play with the different blend modes but almost always end up with 'Soft Light'. Sometimes I slightly modify the (default linear) curve into a flat 'S' shaped curve to even further add contrast, something to play with.

To all the ACR and PS experts here, please excuse my basic-level knowledge. The MM files are really good but come a bit flat out of camera, so all I do is give them a bit of punch with the tools mentioned above. Will add some images when I'm back home.

 

Regards,

Ralf

[Olaf_ZG]

My workflow is rather simple: I have an own preset based on curve adjustments to add some more contrast which I apply at import.

Then, when processing I crop, straight the image and adjust exposure (all if needed ofcourse). Some quick dodging and burning and that’s it.

Unless I really want to play, I don’t spend more than 1 minute on a photo and I try to get it as good as possible in camera.

Having shot hundreds of weddings taught me efficiency. But then, if I play with an image it can take me hours…

I used c1, but recently started with LR and though c1 has more layer options, LR is really fast for masking which is great for dodging/burning…

[robsonj]

12 minutes ago, Olaf_ZG said:

My workflow is rather simple: I have an own preset based on curve adjustments to add some more contrast which I apply at import.

Then, when processing I crop, straight the image and adjust exposure (all if needed ofcourse). Some quick dodging and burning and that’s it.

Unless I really want to play, I don’t spend more than 1 minute on a photo and I try to get it as good as possible in camera.

Having shot hundreds of weddings taught me efficiency. But then, if I play with an image it can take me hours…

I used c1, but recently started with LR and though c1 has more layer options, LR is really fast for masking which is great for dodging/burning…

I don't know about C1, but the dodging and burning, people recognition etc etc is a game changer for the mono cameras and post processing in LR

[Olaf_ZG]

Just now, robsonj said:

I don't know about C1, but the dodging and burning, people recognition etc etc is a game changer for the mono cameras and post processing in LR

Yes, indeed it is and one of the reasons I am considering switching despite c1 being better in color management.

[robsonj]

Just now, Olaf_ZG said:

Yes, indeed it is and one of the reasons I am considering switching despite c1 being better in color management.

it was the reason I reacquired a Q2m after selling my first one. Also leads me to using less colour filters

[jimmielx]

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I have only recently got a Monochrom - the 246, so I'm still figuring things out. I use Lightroom Classic as I do with my M9. Initially I found images, shot in good light particularly, to be very grey (I guess what I mean is flat and heavy in the midtones) and although I was able to give them the kind of punchier vibe I was after I found I was leaning too heavily on clarity and dehaze to do it, and wasn't enjoying the results. Having enjoyed watching Jeff Ascough's processing videos I decided to give his SilverChrome profiles and presets a go and find that the profiles in particular provide a base from which I can get results I find much more pleasing - more vibrant without feeling over processed. As I understand it they are based on the tones of HP5, Tri-X and T-Max, all basically result in a more contrasty look, but feel less processed that I could achieve. So that's where I am for now - daylight shots I start with a SilverChrome profile, lower light shots (where I already tend to find I have enough contrast) I start with the default Adobe Monochrome profile and go from there. Usually raise shadows, decrease highlights, increase exposure, balancing these, and decrease the blacks for some more depth. Always referring back to the original and checking I haven't lost anything in the processing. If local areas need attention then I'll look at those next, then vignette or noise reduction if needed. I don't think I'm chasing a particular film look, just trying to get to whatever feels the best for each image. 

[Anakronox]

I use my own import presets in LR and am trying to develop a similar setup in C1 as I’m migrating to it.  I prefer a contrasty monochrome image with deep blacks and bright whites.  I start by specifically limiting the dynamic range using the tone curve.  I personally can’t stand a flat, gray photo like HP5 without pushing. For me, and these are purely my preferences, using the curvesI raise the midtones a little while dropping highlights and shadows.  This is my base.  I can then open up shadows and raise whites to the clipping point if I wish. I usually end up with slightly crushed shadows and very low highlights, but raise the whites to compensate.  

[Camaro5]

I do some basic adjustments in LR then a levels adjustment in PS and add some micro-contrast with an unsharp mask in luminosity mode and Blend-if.  Adjust opacity.  I use a few sliders in Silver Efex Pro and then back to LR for the final adjustments.  It sounds complicated but it really isn't once you do it a few times.  

[Keith (M)]

(a) Import the .dng into LR Classic using the default Adobe profile, which subtly changes the tone curve from the normal straight line.  

(b) Click the Auto button in the tone control panel. (See first example below).

(c) Then adjust sliders to suit your desired outcome.  (See second example)

That is about it for me except for a quick import into PS to run an action that downsizes the image to suit the forum whilst adding a frame and drop shadow, then saves as a .jpg.  Back into LR to export for upload to wherever.

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[Cayenne]

Thank you!!

 

Very interesting so far.

I dropped all Adobe like a hot rock when they went to the rental only mode....so, trying to avoid them.

But great ideas here...I'm reading through all these and noting ideas to translate into the tools I'm using.  I'm trying to stay as much as possible in a RAW workflow.

But I may take special images out of C1 and move into Affinity Photo...or just experiment in AP using their RAW engine and then move to pixel mode to finish.

 

Again, thank you everyone for the input...and please keep any new suggestions coming.

 

If possible, I would be quite interested if ya'll could pick a couple images you like...and post them before and after you adjustments to see the changes you made and see what areas you like to enhance.

 

Again, thank you!

cayenne

[sometimesmaybe]

On 2/28/2023 at 3:42 AM, Cayenne said:

Do you try to emulate old film looks? 

i use DxO's FilmPack 6. i mainly stick to its Tri X 400 and T Max 400 simulations.

it's pretty easy to use and i think there is a 30 day free trial

it lets you mix and match the colour processing from a film stock with the grain from another - i've created some true abominations... kodak colours with fuji grain  😅

[ramarren]

With the M10-M, I switch between using a deep green filter, an orange filter, or no filter. I want the deep green when I want to expand more subtle color contrasts, the orange when I'm looking to push up contrasts in flat circumstances, and no filter when I'm either using a lens which does not take filters or when "it doesn't matter" ... it's mostly dim, artificial light which all by itself has a limited spectrum compared to sunlight outdoors. Filter use thus far seems to be about G=60%, O=25%, and 15% the rest. 

If I'm not sure what the proper exposure for a particular scene might be, I bracket. I usually find that +.3 EV nets what I like in a raw file, but sometimes I need +.7 or +1.3 EV, and other times -.3 to -1.0. 

The raw files go into LR Classic. Probably about half of them need little other than minor finishing work. For the rest, I find it easier to replace the LR Classic default of the Monochrom tone curve with a simple linear tone curve; I then process from there with a couple of presets I created as a starting point. (I've never bought anyone else's presets or "film simulation" packages. To me, that's a waste of time .. LR Classic can do any of that all by itself, and I'd rather develop MY eye and rendering skills than just pay for someone else's.)

G

[shanefking]

On 2/27/2023 at 12:06 PM, robsonj said:

I don't know about C1, but the dodging and burning, people recognition etc etc is a game changer for the mono cameras and post processing in LR

 I recently shot some low-light night portraits, but the background was much lighter than I wanted, and LR’s background detection did a flawless job masking it out so I could darken it by one stop.  I did like 20 pictures, and it took me less than an hour total.

[shanefking]

5 hours ago, ramarren said:

With the M10-M, I switch between using a deep green filter, an orange filter, or no filter. I want the deep green when I want to expand more subtle color contrasts, the orange when I'm looking to push up contrasts in flat circumstances, and no filter when I'm either using a lens which does not take filters or when "it doesn't matter" ...

G

I’d love to see some examples of what that green filter does, if you don’t mind sharing

[ramarren]

3 hours ago, shanefking said:

I’d love to see some examples of what that green filter does, if you don’t mind sharing

Basic example is to look at what happens to an Xrite Color Checker when exposed with no filter, Orange filter, and Green filter. Here's the Color Checker (photo made with Leica CL) for reference:

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And now the comparison made with M10-M as labeled:

For photo examples made with the M10-M and a green filter, here's a "Green Filter Set" of my photos posted to Flickr you can peruse. I don't normally shoot comparison photos, so I can't show you what they'd look like without a filter or with an Orange filter. 

G

Edited March 2, 2023 by ramarren

[jaapv]

M9M.
To begin with I use the appropriate filter,  Green Yellow  Orange or Red, depending on the light, subject and result I am looking for

Open in ACR, do basic (often Auto) corrections and use the the sliders to adjust. I normally don't. use Clarity as it can produce a nasty halo effect. The Dehaze slider is very effective at setting an initial tonal value scale. 

Basic workflow:
Open in PS, use Levels to set the Black Point - very important, that and sometimes a white point. I go into Curves to adjust Contrast again, fromm a basic Linear Contrast preset to a custom curve. I very often lift the midtones to get a more film-like result. Then convert to RGB to apply Toning.  Sharpen as desired (print or web) (I like to use Topaz Photo AI) on a layer.
If I need serious sharpening Topaz Sharpen AI. Adjust the opacity of the layer by eye and flatten. 

This sounds more work than it is, it normally takes only a few minutes.

[Jeff S]

14 minutes ago, jaapv said:

M9M.
To begin with I use the appropriate filter,  Green Yellow  Orange or Red, depending on the light, subject and result I am looking for

Open in ACR, do basic (often Auto) corrections and use the the sliders to adjust. I normally don't. use Clarity as it can produce a nasty halo effect. The Dehaze slider is very effective at setting an initial tonal value scale. 

Basic workflow:
Open in PS, use Levels to set the Black Point - very important, that and sometimes a white point. I go into Curves to adjust Contrast again, fromm a basic Linear Contrast preset to a custom curve. I very often lift the midtones to get a more film-like result. Then convert to RGB to apply Toning.  Sharpen as desired (print or web) (I like to use Topaz Photo AI) on a layer.
If I need serious sharpening Topaz Sharpen AI. Adjust the opacity of the layer by eye and flatten. 

This sounds more work than it is, it normally takes only a few minutes.

For both my M10 Monochrom and M(9)M, my essential philosophy/steps begin similarly, albeit using LR Classic rather than PS except as needed.  Global adjustments first… black/white point as judged, curve adjustment, selective use of sliders, often a mid-tone boost, etc.  Then local adjustments as needed using various tools.

Beyond this, I send all my worthy pics through ImagePrint and selectively apply a few adjustments, which I’ve learned through experience can bring life to my B&W prints.

But I’m not locked into a prescribed workflow or set of adjustments.  Each pic/print and rendering intent stands on its own, some requiring minimal effort, some more.  Even print size can play a meaningful role in achieving a desired outcome for any given pic.  Same as in darkroom days.

Jeff

[Cayenne]

On 3/1/2023 at 6:19 PM, ramarren said:

Basic example is to look at what happens to an Xrite Color Checker when exposed with no filter, Orange filter, and Green filter. Here's the Color Checker (photo made with Leica CL) for reference:

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

And now the comparison made with M10-M as labeled:

For photo examples made with the M10-M and a green filter, here's a "Green Filter Set" of my photos posted to Flickr you can peruse. I don't normally shoot comparison photos, so I can't show you what they'd look like without a filter or with an Orange filter. 

G

Thank you!!  Very interesting.

I've not tried green filters yet.  Briefly...what situations when you are shooting, do you find Green filters to be the most appropriate?

 

Thank you in advance,

C

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Hallo,

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[ramarren]

12 minutes ago, Cayenne said:

Thank you!!  Very interesting.

I've not tried green filters yet.  Briefly...what situations when you are shooting, do you find Green filters to be the most appropriate.

Thank you in advance,

C

You're welcome. 

If you look carefully at the Color Checker color image and compare it against the none, orange, and green filter versions in B&W, I think you can see (fairly easily) that the green filter tends to give more different grayscale values over the range of colors with none or orange filter, and that the orange filter tends to produce fewer grayscale values compared to none or green filter. This indicates that use of an orange filter will, overall, tend to make a scene more contrasty with fewer tonal steps, and a green filter will tend to make a scene a bit less contrasty with more tonal steps. No filter fits somewhere in the middle. 

A lot depends on the type of light you're shooting in, the spectral distribution of colors in the scene you're shooting, and what you deem to be important in that scene. Sunlight has the broadest color spectrum, and a clear sky, sunny day tends to be very contrasty in and of itself - the green filter will tend to broaden the number of gray tones and give you more different tones to work with effectively lowering perceptual contrast, where an orange filter will tend to do the opposite. And then there's subject matter ... if you're shooting light-skinned people mostly, the green filter will reveal skin imperfections that an orange filter will mask, the green is better when shooting darker-skinned people as it reveals more tonal variation in the skin against a typical scene's average exposure. When shooting foliage and flowers, again the green will tend to differentiate greens, and the orange will push all the greens down a notch making them more similar.

Artificial lighting (typically tungsten bulbs, fluorescents, and LEDs these days) don't produce the continuous spectrum of light that the Sun produces. Tungsten tends to be lower temperature (more shifted to the red end of the spectrum) and the other light sources are more spikey, without the smooth continuous spectrum of either tungsten light or sunlight. So with artificial lighting you have to think about that along with the fact that any of these filters is going to cost you 1-2 stops of light as well, so in many cases it's better to just leave the filter off and use a higher shutter speed for less camera motion possibilities. 

The best way to figure it all out is to keep the simple rule in your head: "Things the same color as the filter will tend to be lighter, things the complement color of the filter will tend to darken." And then go out and experiment ... a lot! At least in the age of digital photography you can experiment ad nauseam at no cost and with instant feedback compared to film photography.  

When I go on my neighborhood walks, I tend to fit a green filter most of the time, if the lens takes filters and it's not too dark out. 

G