ckchen72 Posted October 7, 2007 Share #1 Posted October 7, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) Over the past weekend helped out with a wedding. The church and reception were fairly low light. I was shooting 1250 and wide open at f2. The problem was shooting wide open still needed more light and the lack of depth of field made some photos awkward. Before the event I tried the Viviatar offshoe like Sean had mentioned, but I thougtht it was so hard to focus and shoot with just one hand. I used the sf24d with a diffuser but that didn't work with the flash straight on. Then I used it off shoe with a bracket and a tilt to bounce it, but it didn't give me a lot of flash. I am not a fan of flash, and I like the ease of the ttl, but I'm not sure what to do, any advice would be greatly appreciates. also using a a bracket with the m8 also was very awkard focusing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted October 7, 2007 Posted October 7, 2007 Hi ckchen72, Take a look here Wedding advice. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
sean_reid Posted October 7, 2007 Share #2 Posted October 7, 2007 It takes some practice to be able to work with your camera in your right hand and your flash in your left. Having a wrist strap on the flash is important, you let it hang while you focus or set aperture and then swing it up and catch it in your hand so that you can aim it as needed for your exposure. Otherwise, your question is really a broader one of how to use flash to get the lighting you want. And mastering that, in fact, takes a lot of practice. I think I'm going to write an article about the ways in which I approach this but that's only one perspective, of course. What sort of ceiling were you dealing with? How far away were the walls and what color(s) were they? I don't think the SF24 has enough power to be a great bounce unit at weddings. When you bounce, you diffuse the light and that diffusion also lessens the light's intensity. So, to get enough light bouncing to the subject one often has to send "a lot" of light towards the wall, ceiling, etc. Cheers, Sean Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisC Posted October 7, 2007 Share #3 Posted October 7, 2007 Over the past weekend helped out with a wedding........ Calvin - 'Helped out' could mean a number of things. Sounds to me like you needed an extra hand to hold a flash with low output being radio triggered from the M8. Or you could have the flash on a stand, either moving it in the general direction of your subject, or possibly raise the stand to bounce the flash off a white ceiling. Personally I would opt for Nikon and it's amazing remote flash system to do this sort of photography though. With flash, remember to balance the flash colour to the ambient light with colour 'gels' over the flash head - gel is sold in sheets and/or rolls. No doubt someone will suggest the solution which feels right for you. There is no 'one' right way. .............. Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean_reid Posted October 7, 2007 Share #4 Posted October 7, 2007 There is no 'one' right way. .............. Chris Very true. Cheers, Sean Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ckchen72 Posted October 8, 2007 Author Share #5 Posted October 8, 2007 Thanks for the advice. Sean I subscribe to your site and would love an article on flash. I do hate the look of it, but would love to be able to use it as needed. I'm returning the sf24d. Other advice even books people recommend would be much appreciated! Calvin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
erl Posted October 8, 2007 Share #6 Posted October 8, 2007 Calvin, reading and such is a good start, but there is nothing that equals experience. Plenty of it! In addition to other things you may do, I reccommend practicing frequently in a variety of situations/locations and study the good and bad results. Remember what produced them and employ the one's you like. The M8 is a superb camera both for practicing and shooting weddings, and many other subjects as well! As for using flash in the church, that is a personal decision, taking in many factors. I (almost) never do, for a variety of reasons. I have never got myself into a situation where flash became mandatory, but sometimes desirable (when permitted). For many years I shot 400ISO film in churches, sometimes using a tripod(ugh!). Currently the M8, for me, blitzes everything and 1250ISO or 640ISO can be made to work in most situations with good and careful post processing. You say you don't like the look of 'flash.' Well probably nobody does, but the trick is to make it look like 'natural.' Hence bounce in many situations, or well diffused. This automatically implies more power than say the SF20 or whatever. It also implies getting the flash 'off camera' as Sean discusses. Then there is multiple flash which when expertly used is fantastic. All of these techniques require experience and practice, which is not difficult, just time consuming. Get a girlfriend (or two) to cooperate as models while you practice! The bonus comes afterwards. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisC Posted October 8, 2007 Share #7 Posted October 8, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) .....I do hate the look of it...... Calvin - I suspect you believe that flash is harsh and sometimes a necessary evil. If so, a shift in thinking might be needed more than a tutorial. Flash is just a light input to be controlled by the photographer; it can be harsh, it can also be delicate. I prefer the latter, and in the situation you described I would have been metering normally and just giving the subject a gentle 'lift' with low level flash most probably shot through a diffusing umbrella on a stand. As Sean intimated it's a subject that requires the confidence of experience, and after a while the uncertainties you currently have will be gone. I'd suggest starting with a suitably powerful gun 'off' camera, and experiment starting with small increments of added flash. Perhaps, if you use the flash on an auto setting [until you get confident to use manual settings]; set the auto flash setting to 2 or 3 aperture stops smaller than your camera's working aperture Be mindful of the voltage warnings on this site so you don't fry your M8 if directly connecting the flash to it, and maybe have a good look at this site: Strobist .................. Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ckchen72 Posted October 9, 2007 Author Share #8 Posted October 9, 2007 Thanks for all the advice. I honestly love this forum because I feel Iike I have learned so much from everyone and everyone has been so generous. Thanks again, Calvin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
afineman Posted October 9, 2007 Share #9 Posted October 9, 2007 I don't mind hand holding a flash provided it is small enough. But the M8 poses other issues with using strobes with wide angle lenses. I had Michael Bass customize a Voigtlander Double Shoe Adapter for me and it is amazing. Check out the links: http://michaelbass.blogspot.com/2007/01/misc-custom-connections.html http://bp3.blogger.com/_CRxbBKkoqIY/Rv9Gm2IrWHI/AAAAAAAAAao/yrIcliGf3Ts/s1600-h/CustomHotShoe+Web.jpg - aaron http://www.aaronleefineman.com Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fourfa Posted October 9, 2007 Share #10 Posted October 9, 2007 Run through the tutorials at strobist.com. What he does may not look exactly like a wedding, but if you can reliably pull off the shots he demonstrates, won't be hard to make the leap to the more dynamic setting of a wedding. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
canlogic Posted October 10, 2007 Share #11 Posted October 10, 2007 I did 2 weddings this summer and don't pretend to know anything about wedding photography. I did them for friends. I shot with both my M8 and my 5D. I found that about 80% of the M8 shots were with the Elmarit 28mm. I shot with a Metz 54 on camera with a diffuser and basically set the lens at 5.6 or 8 and zone focused and then just aimed and shot. I only had to change focus for a few of the shots and the majority were keepers. I have since bought an off camera cord etc for the Metz but don't plan on doing more weddings. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolo Posted October 10, 2007 Share #12 Posted October 10, 2007 I try hard to stay away from flash at weddings, but it's not always possible and it's especially difficult when the dark nights start drawing in. I probably shoud use it a little more than I do. Flash in church here is absolutely not allowed and caused me to replace my M lenses with Summilux versions. f1.4 at 15th second on 400 ISO film without flash enables images in the most difficult locations. I rarely would go to 800 ISO film. My Metz flashgun is almost permanently set on 1/16 power (I have to admit to frequently using a DSLR nowadays) and I always bounce it for my desired effect. The recycle time and battery life are both improved. Here's a sequence from 10 shots in 90 seconds where flash, with a Stofen fitted, was bounced into the low ceiling. Rolo Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/35230-wedding-advice/?do=findComment&comment=373443'>More sharing options...
ckchen72 Posted October 11, 2007 Author Share #13 Posted October 11, 2007 Thanks Rolo, Could I ask which Metz you used and were these shot with the M8? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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