Capture One v. 4

[DavidStone]

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Is anyone using C1 v.4, the upgrade to LE?

 

For me, there seems to be, so far, not much advantage over the LE version, since its big selling point is productivity, and I'm not pushing through lots of images. The controls are very small on the screen, and there seems to be no help file, and it doesn't want to read my JFI profiles, which I use all the time, and the claimed extra highlight and shadow detail doesn't seem to do any more than the same functions in PSE. Or am I just being an old Luddite?

 

David

[wparsonsgisnet]

David, I am using the V.4 beta and find the controls very effective and convenient. I can now do a lot of stuff in C1 that I used to have to do in PS. Since I print with Image Print, and that uses a tiff or jpeg file, I don't use PS very much anymore.

 

I haven't loaded any profiles yet -- but the ones that come with the beta are terrific.

 

There is a manual you can download.

 

After some frustration (old dog syndrome, in my case) at another damn new piece of software (it is different) I found I like the new interface.

[scott kirkpatrick]

Is anyone using C1 v.4, the upgrade to LE?

 

...

 

... it doesn't want to read my JFI profiles, which I use all the time,

 

I've used b4 a bit, but am waiting for the next update, promised sometime soon. The problem with profiles is that they seem to have moved to a naming convention in which all profiles relevant to a given camera have a filename starting with that camera. So if you want the JFI profiles to work in 4.0, you much copy them to the right directory (it has changed, and I am not sure where they went, but that's not the problem) and rename each of them to start with the camera you want to use them with. For generic profiles like JFI, that's not what you really want to have to do.

 

So complain. On the Phase One forum, or by using the online pulldown that allows submitting a bug report.

 

scott

 

scott

[ardbeg]

I tried last night to move the JFI profiles into the input profile directory embedded in the Capture One application bundle in Mac OS X as well as changing the names to begin with Leica. Still no go.

[grduprey]

David, I am using the V.4 beta and find the controls very effective and convenient. I can now do a lot of stuff in C1 that I used to have to do in PS. Since I print with Image Print, and that uses a tiff or jpeg file, I don't use PS very much anymore.

 

I haven't loaded any profiles yet -- but the ones that come with the beta are terrific.

 

There is a manual you can download.

 

After some frustration (old dog syndrome, in my case) at another damn new piece of software (it is different) I found I like the new interface.

 

Where did you find the manual? I looked but could not find it. I find the interface more confusing and find the sharpening tool to be less effective. Also cannot figure out how to process more than one image at a time.

 

Gene

[etrigan63]

The current beta will flat-out not run on my system (Vista 64-bit). Phase One's workaround is to load 32-bit Vista instead. Talk about lame. They also have the nerve to call this release "Vista Ready". Apparently, they didn't read the specs necessary to earn that title. MS requires that "Vista Ready" 32-bit apps must be able to run unaltered in 64-bit Vista.

[erl]

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Well guys, as the package says "it is beta!" If you have problems, which clearly some have, report it to Phase One. They are the ones to fix it. Posters here can only agree or disagree with your complaints.

 

My experience/observation with Beta 4 is that when complete it will be significantly better than C1LE (a good package anyway). The new` ability to scale the output has to be a major step forward for speedy output. There are glitches to be fixed. All that I am aware of have been reported to Phase One. I expect they will ultimately be addressed. I for one am impatient for it to happen but realize much work is involved. Roll on the next iteration.

[rosuna]

Capure One 3 generates .review files that duplicate the original RAWs. For each DNG file of 10M Capure One creates a 13MB .preview file. My question is if Capture One 4 has changed this.

[Paul_S]

I have been using the Mac version of Capture One 4 beta (build 10282) since its release and made the following summary of my experiences.

 

Features

Capture One 4 (beta) has a nice set of (new) features. Some new features already existed in the Pro version. However, since these features have become common to raw converters in the market, Phase One incorporated them now in the basic version. Examples are scaling of output, free rotation, grid, output levels, multi level rating and sorting of thumbnails in the Browser. Completely new (to Capture One) features like Variants and multi images in the viewer improve workflow and flexibility. Different tools have undergone revisions resulting in High Dynamic Range and Brightness sliders to master exposure, both presets and reset options for all tools or tool subsets and QuickTool tab with the most used tools. A Reset to Default completely removes all adjustments of the selected image(s). The Web Contact Sheet is much improved and very useful for a web based index of a CD/DVD. Capture One has always been famous for its ability to select ICC profiles for input, i.e. the camera. This has been maintained and is adjustable per image (as in current Mac Pro version).

Overall speed, in all functions, has clearly been improved. In general, the program is twice as fast (and betas are slow in general, so there is maybe more to come). On a MacBook Pro conversion of Leica M8 DNG to TIFF 8bit, not compressed I recorded processing times of 10.9 (CO377) and 5.8 (CO4beta) seconds.

Last but not least, both Windows and Macintosh versions now have the same feature set and Capture One 4 will support Windows Vista and OS X 10.5 Leopard.

 

Interface

The basic interface (tools, viewer, browser) of Capture One remained the same but has received the darker Lightroom/BridgeCS3/Aperture look. This might be better for indoor work, but less good for outdoor like for shooters who work tethered because of bad visibility of the notebook screen. Note that tethered operation is not supported and is expected to be (and remain) a Pro function. A lot of interface related functionality like moving sliders or using the keyboard to set values are not working properly yet. The release notes for this beta acknowledges this. Maybe there will be a release candidate before the final release to get a better look and feel experience.

A special note I like to make regarding copying adjustments. I seems that Capture One 4 strives for allowing very selective adjustments to copy (see Adjustments Tool tab), but the current beta only allows for all adjustments.

Another special note worth is the Pan tool. I found two nice applications for this cursor tool (middle of toolbar, above Viewer, Hand symbol). After using the crop or rotation tool, selecting the Pan tool only shows the current crop in the Viewer without the darkened cut-offs. And when zoomed in, after selecting the Pan tool, right click in the Viewer. It will superimpose a navigation window in the viewer with showed rectangle. Move the rectangle and the image will move. This is the same navigation window as in the Details Tool tab.

 

Wish list

• ability to set the preferred input profile per camera (as in current CO377LE/Pro): for example for a Leica M8 user this can be either ‘generic’ or ‘generic UV-IR’.
  
• allow 3rd party and self made profiles to show up and be used and preset (as in current CO377LE/Pro)
  
• pass through IPTC data that import programs (or the camera) have inserted in the RAW file into the output file (as in current CO377Pro; should be a fixed bug in LE)
  
• at least viewing of IPTC data in Meta Data tool tab (and editing in Pro version)
  
• allow preset of clipping of shadow and highlights when using Auto adjust of Levels tool (Auto Level clipping amount) (as in current CO377LE/Pro)
  
• keyboard shortcuts for all tool sliders
  
• progress bar of process queue is missing
  
• the Color Balance circle is too small to be useful now
  
• in general, all tools are too small
  

 

Bugs I reported so far (Mac version)

• IPTC meta data is not passed-through to output file (I use Photo Mechanic for importing images from card(reader) to computer and add meta data)
  
• selecting and applying adjustments: there is a maximum of 12 selected images in the Viewer; only these get the adjustments applied when more images are selected; when applying with Viewer hidden, more than 12 images get adjustments applied; however, I once encountered that a number of images did not have adjustments applied (ramdomly); these were regarded as non-raw images by CO4b
  
• when changing the Output Naming from ‘Capture Name only’ to ‘Capture and Job name’, the Sample below the job name does not refresh or adapt automatically (it does when I select another image); it only shows the job name
  
• RGB values above Viewer window: values vary from 0-1 in Mac version (LAB values?) and from 0-255 in Windows version; I would prefer the 0-255 scale or scale selectable
  
• sharpening preset does not work; same for de-noise
  
• changing the scaling option (%) crashes the application
  

[Paul_S]

For each DNG file of 10M Capure One creates a 13MB .preview file. My question is if Capture One 4 has changed this.

 

The preview files of CO4 of M8 DNG files are between 1 and 2 MB in size. That is much smaller than the 13MB (fixed size) of CO3.x. Generation of these preview files is also faster in CO4 beta than in CO3.x.

[erl]

Paul, that is a pretty thorough assessment and I applaud you for taking the time and effort to make it. Soemething I don't seem to be good at! I hope you have passed this on to Phase One. As an eventual beneficiary when it it all comes to pass, I thank you most sincerely.

[Paul_S]

(...) Also cannot figure out how to process more than one image at a time.

 

Gene

 

Gene, were you able to select multiple images? You can do this buy using Shift or Cmd (Mac) / Shift or Ctrl (Win) respectively. Also you can select by rating in the Browser. All selected images will appear in the Viewer (if set to multi image on top of it). When you select Process, all selected images will start processing from the queue.

[Paul_S]

I hope you have passed this on to Phase One. As an eventual beneficiary when it it all comes to pass, I thank you most sincerely.

 

Thanks Erl for your kind remarks. I reported the bugs I mentioned already, will submit the wishlist as well. Have to visit the Phase One beta forum this week to drop there a few lines there too.

[stunsworth]

Does the new version support M8 files that have been pushed through the Adobe DNG convertor? The previous version didn't.

[Paul_S]

Does the new version support M8 files that have been pushed through the Adobe DNG convertor? The previous version didn't.

 

Yes, CO4 beta can, although I did not try the DNG converter but used CS3/ACR4.1 which should be the same. In fact, Capture One 4 (beta) supports both DNG import and export. This is not limited to DNG-to-DNG by the way.

 

If you use export a from CS3/ACR4.x you should set the lossless compression option (if you don't, CO4 beta can't read the exported file). An exported M8 DNG becomes approx. 6.3 to 7.6 MB (depending on JPEG preview size in DNG) and is recognised in CO4 beta. It allowed me to export a Kodak SLR /c raw file, which is not supported by CO4, to DNG and import it in CO4 beta (just testing, no debate on relevance:rolleyes: please)

 

CO4 beta can export to DNG as well. Again, this way I could export (non-DNG) raw files to DNG. Call it conversion.

[stunsworth]

Thanks Paul, I'll have a play when I get a chance.

[DavidStone]

Many thanks folks, and especially to Paul, for all the useful replies.

 

Paul writes: "Capture One has always been famous for its ability to select ICC profiles for input, i.e. the camera. This has been maintained and is adjustable per image (as in current Mac Pro version)."

 

Does this mean that it is in fact possible to access the JFI profiles from the beta version, or have I misunderstood?

 

David

[Paul_S]

Paul writes: "Capture One has always been famous for its ability to select ICC profiles for input, i.e. the camera. This has been maintained and is adjustable per image (as in current Mac Pro version)."

 

Does this mean that it is in fact possible to access the JFI profiles from the beta version, or have I misunderstood?

 

David

 

David, you misunderstood but I understand the confusion. What I wanted to emphasize is that selecting profiles has now become possible per image (this is new for LE, even new for Pro on Windows where it was a program wide setting in CO3.x). However, the current beta does not show non-Phase One profiles. This might have been done on purpose to test the product in this stage of development. In a beta you might want to rule out 3rd party influences.

Also note that a lot of menus and interface related components need polishing after this beta, so expect development here.

 

I have 3 sets of LoSat/HiSat profiles from Magne Nilsen for different Canon DSLRs. Only the 5D profiles I could manage to get recognised in this beta release with some file renaming.

[wparsonsgisnet]

Where did you find the manual? I looked but could not find it. I find the interface more confusing and find the sharpening tool to be less effective. Also cannot figure out how to process more than one image at a time.

 

Gene

 

Gene, I'm sorry, I wasn't thinking clearly. In another thread someone posted the link to Phase One's user manual downloads. I had gone thru the manual for the 3.7.x version, and didn't remember that I just started using v.4 cold.

 

It's very intuitive. I have been playing with it a lot and am considering upgrading to PRO when v.4 comes out. The problem for our wallets is that Phase One gives one (I think) upgrade with a purchase of sw, so it may be more cost effective for me to get the free upgrade to LE v.4 and then upgrade to PRO at a later release. I'm looking at the features.

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[papimuzo]

Thanks Paul for your detailed assessment and feed-back to PO.

I myself encounter some problem:

- C1 v.4 couldn't be run on my desktop (PC Windows XP/SP2) and fault report tool was also buggy so couldn't be useful to PO (C1 beta forum showed that I'm not alone in this case.

- exactly same beta build 10283 installed Ok on my laptop (PC Windows XP/SP2 !).

As also "old dog" syndrome makes that I am not impressed by the menu plethoric UI but found that the speed is much better than C1 v 377 (previews and raw treatment).

The new UI is too dark and icones are too small this is my view but YMMV.

I don't like at all that C1 v.4 beta creates directories (sometimes very big according to the previews and work you did) everywhere your DNG are situated! This is very space consuming!

And cleaning is boring.

Custom profiles: you can use any ICC profiles you used in v.377: as Jamie said:

you must rename the xxx.icc profile into LeicaM8-xxx.icc and put this into the directory:

Capture one 4\Color profiles\DSLR\

This is valid for Windows systems. It works well in particular for the JFI BW profiles.

Hope this help.

All the best.