M6 - Do I need a CLA?

[Huss]

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22 minutes ago, Anbaric said:

I'm actually quite curious about when my 1936 IIIa was last serviced. Certainly not by me since I bought it in the 2000s. It has the smoothest mechanism of any camera I own, and the rangefinder is spot on, though it could do with a clean.

The instructions for watches usually suggest a service every few years, probably because they may be running for 24 hours a day between pit stops in less than ideal conditions for precision mechanisms with tiny parts. The various Leica manuals I've seen are silent on the subject of preventative maintenance.

Speaking of watches, I was gifted a Cartier automatic mechanism watch a few years ago.  A very nice gesture, and I would never buy something like that for myself.  From day one it was terrible at keeping time.  Would always be a few minutes slow at the end of the day.  I eventually had it serviced, and you can only get that done at an official shop as Cartier only gives parts to those shops.  $800 and it still is terrible at keeping time!  And they recommend a service every two years!  Nope, not gonna happen.  I’m just going to live with this pretty thing that is terrible as a watch…

[DenverSteve]

No one told the OP he/she had to do anything. They asked for advice and as a life-long professional photographer my advice is not to wait until you're in the middle of a shoot and have a problem.  Your home heater, air conditioning- anything that operates mechanically, should be inspected and adjusted periodically to hopefully prevent a major repair.  If you purchase a camera for 7-10 thousand dollars/pounds/euros, and can't afford to plan for 30-40 dollars a year for a periodic check to make sure you don't have any internal screws loose or mechanical wear, that's your prerogative.  If you don't work in hot, cold, dusty, rainy, humid, leave your equipment in a hot vehicle at times, never shoot... you might not need a CLA ever. However, you won't know unless you get an inspection.  

[DenverSteve]

18 hours ago, Anbaric said:

If they do have any advice, it doesn't seem to have been important enough to put in the M6 user manual.

Maybe they just expect someone buying a $5000 piece of equipment to be intelligent enough to ask.  Every owner will choose for themselves. 

[DenverSteve]

5 hours ago, 250swb said:

You have a sticky shutter button, what else needs replacing while the top is off, everything? 

What you don't know is whether the sticky shutter button is because you ate your lunch over your camera or whether there's a shutter problem, causing a sticky button, that be an impending crisis if not attended to.  That's what a periodic inspection, for all things mechanical, is for. Or, you can wait until mid-winter to have your furnace fixed when a cleaning and inspection in July would have prevented the problem.  Your equipment, your call. 

Edited November 7, 2022 by DenverSteve

[Anbaric]

1 hour ago, DenverSteve said:

Maybe they just expect someone buying a $5000 piece of equipment to be intelligent enough to ask.

Think it through, Steve. We are people who might spend $5000 on a film camera. Surely the people at Leica realise we may need all the help we can get?

[DenverSteve]

4 minutes ago, Anbaric said:

Think it through, Steve. We are people who might spend $5000 on a film camera. Surely the people at Leica realise we may need all the help we can get?

Touche'

[Huss]

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1 hour ago, DenverSteve said:

Maybe they just expect someone buying a $5000 piece of equipment to be intelligent enough to ask.  Every owner will choose for themselves. 

 My Fuji film cameras do have shot counters on them (TX-2, GW690III) so I guess Fuji thinks that is important for service.  Does that mean that Fuji thinks its owners are dumb and can't figure out to just ask the dealer so they include that feature?  If I go to a Leica dealer and ask when will my camera need servicing, what do you think they'll say?  First question will be 'is there anything wrong?" which will lead to the "nothing wrong?  then you are ok"

The owner's manual just says that if you do not use the camera, work through all the shutter speeds every 3 months.

[Huss]

2 hours ago, DenverSteve said:

What you don't know is whether the sticky shutter button is because you ate your lunch over your camera or whether there's a shutter problem, causing a sticky button, that be an impending crisis if not attended to.  That's what a periodic inspection, for all things mechanical, is for. Or, you can wait until mid-winter to have your furnace fixed when a cleaning and inspection in July would have prevented the problem.  Your equipment, your call. 

Your furnace will have maintenance instructions.  Leica cameras do not.

[DenverSteve]

3 minutes ago, Huss said:

 My Fuji film cameras do have shot counters on them (TX-2, GW690III) so I guess Fuji thinks that is important for service.  Does that mean that Fuji thinks its owners are dumb and can't figure out to just ask the dealer so they include that feature?  If I go to a Leica dealer and ask when will my camera need servicing, what do you think they'll say?  First question will be 'is there anything wrong?" which will lead to the "nothing wrong?  then you are ok"

The owner's manual just says that if you do not use the camera, work through all the shutter speeds every 3 months.

Again, no one is telling you what to do with your equipment.  Carry on. 

[madNbad]

I bought a M6 TTL Millennium from KEH in the spring of 2012 then sent it to Leica Solms in the fall of 2013. In addition to upgrading the viewfinder they did a number of other small upgrades like changing the shutter seals from felt to the current polyester. Was it worth it? I ended up selling the camera in 2018 but it was smoother to use and never had any finder flare making the experience more enjoyable.

[Huss]

1 minute ago, DenverSteve said:

Again, no one is telling you what to do with your equipment.  Carry on. 

I think Fuji is.

[Anbaric]

2 hours ago, Huss said:

Speaking of watches, I was gifted a Cartier automatic mechanism watch a few years ago.  A very nice gesture, and I would never buy something like that for myself.  From day one it was terrible at keeping time.  Would always be a few minutes slow at the end of the day.  I eventually had it serviced, and you can only get that done at an official shop as Cartier only gives parts to those shops.  $800 and it still is terrible at keeping time!  And they recommend a service every two years!  Nope, not gonna happen.  I’m just going to live with this pretty thing that is terrible as a watch…

Recently I bought a super-cheap Invicta automatic on Amazon, a watch brand notorious for their garish 'luxury' designs and their largely fictional recommended prices (they are invariably sold at deep 'discounts'). This one cost me £65 and is one of their more restrained models, but only because it rips off the cosmetics of a Rolex, except for the bezel they borrowed from Omega (I think someone at Invicta had been watching Goldeneye and wanted the same style of twisty thing that James Bond uses to detonate his explosives). I was astonished at how good it is at keeping time, which is after all quite important for a watch. It manages to gain only about a second or two per day (if this thing were Swiss, they could probably get it certified as a chronometer). It turns out that the mechanism is something that Seiko designed and sells to third parties as an OEM movement, and this one is actually a step up from the version in the cheapest Seiko automatics (it's hackable and can be wound by hand). So here, for around 1% of the price of the watches it is 'inspired' by, is a perfectly decent mechanical timepiece of similar accuracy. I wonder what the price would be if the Chinese companies that manufacture these things decided to make a rangefinder camera? Meanwhile, I've just bought an old Omega on ebay (not of the James Bond variety). Supposedly it has just been serviced, but I'll be pretty surprised if it's as accurate as the modern Invicta.

[Huss]

How I tell time.  I look at my Cartier watch.  Then check on my iphone pretending I am reading email.

[250swb]

4 hours ago, DenverSteve said:

That's what a periodic inspection, for all things mechanical, is for. Or, you can wait until mid-winter to have your furnace fixed when a cleaning and inspection in July would have prevented the problem.  Your equipment, your call. 

I appreciate you are floundering to answer a simple question, but you don’t know what Leica’s recommended schedule for a periodic inspection is do you? You continue to evade the question. Things you conjure out of the air don’t count, bullshit doesn’t count, comparing it with a wrist watch doesn’t count, and fear and trepidation of the unknown don’t count because people are more sensible than to fall for that. My take is you’ve probably bought a Leica and with it you also bought into all the myths and untruths that can accompany it and made them a part of your own unique owner experience. You should ignore all the philistines, many with decades of experience but who think of a Leica as just another camera and keep it special for you.

Edited November 7, 2022 by 250swb

[Huss]

A few years ago I took my Nikon F - the original model - that I had just bought to a reputable shop.  I asked them to service it.  They asked what was wrong with it.  I said nothing but I would like it done anyway.  They said no.

Now Leica, bless their German/Canadian/Portuguese hearts, have zero qualms in taking your money.  It’s why they charge $80 for a little plastic lens cap.  It would behoof them, financially, to have a little paragraph in the owner’s manual under care and maintenance to recommend a service at an authorized Leica dealer every two years.  Or 500 rolls.  Whichever comes first.

But no, they just say if you don’t use the camera work through the shutter speeds a few times every three months. 

[DenverSteve]

3 hours ago, 250swb said:

I appreciate you are floundering to answer a simple question, but you don’t know what Leica’s recommended schedule for a periodic inspection is do you? You continue to evade the question. Things you conjure out of the air don’t count, bullshit doesn’t count, comparing it with a wrist watch doesn’t count, and fear and trepidation of the unknown don’t count because people are more sensible than to fall for that. My take is you’ve probably bought a Leica and with it you also bought into all the myths and untruths that can accompany it and made them a part of your own unique owner experience. You should ignore all the philistines, many with decades of experience but who think of a Leica as just another camera and keep it special for you.

Not floundering. Just not responding to an ignorant rant.  I'm also waiting for you to read my first sentence.  I appreciate your attempt at baiting me but, I've come to learn, over many years, that people with 10.9k posts on a forum, are far more adept at sitting on their arse, challenging others, than actually doing what it is they are opening about.  So, while I admire your attempt, type less, shoot more. 😜

If you had read my first post you will see that my very first sentence, and advice to, the OP was - "Actually, you should follow Leica's advice." Try reading what you are responding to, prior to responding to it.  I apologize if you are not a native English reader/speaker, from the UK, and don't understand the written word. Maybe you should go back and actually read the thread... slowly.  If you have an issue with "follow Leica's advice", then all hope is lost. 

Edited November 8, 2022 by DenverSteve

[logan2z]

2 hours ago, Huss said:

A few years ago I took my Nikon F - the original model - that I had just bought to a reputable shop.  I asked them to service it.  They asked what was wrong with it.  I said nothing but I would like it done anyway.  They said no.

Just say 'the shutter speeds seem off'.  They all seem to fall for that  

When I bought my M4 a few years ago it was in nice cosmetic condition but had no known service history.  I figured I'd get it serviced before I started to shoot with it since I'd hate to spend time shooting some rolls only to find out it had a light leak or some other fault - this was before I was developing my own film so I was also spending money on processing and shipping.  Now, when I buy a used camera, I just shoot a quick roll and develop it at home to determine if the camera needs service or not.  If all is well I hold off on servicing it until it needs it. 

If someone wants to ensure that their camera is running like a clock - a good one, not a Cartier  - before they invest time and potentially money in using it, why not?  In the grand scheme of Leica, a standard CLA isn't over-the-top expensive.  I now follow the 'If it ain't broke" philosophy, but that might not be for everyone.

[DenverSteve]

On 11/6/2022 at 10:47 PM, 250swb said:

So, what exactly is Leica's advice? Or is this a parameter you've just invented?

 

You would have to ask them as it pertains to your equipment and/or situation. I didn't invent, or mention, any perimeter. I merely said, "Actually, you should follow Leica's advice." Anyone reading more into it than that.... well, shouldn't respond in writing, in public, and show their ignorance. My statement stands for everything from cameras, cars.... and yes... watches.  😊  You really should put that keyboard down until you've read through what you're responding to.  

[pippy]

37 minutes ago, DenverSteve said:

..my very first sentence, and advice to, the OP was - "Actually, you should follow Leica's advice."...

Which is?...

Philip.

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Hallo,

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[DenverSteve]

7 minutes ago, pippy said:

Which is?...

Philip.

Please read my response just above your post.  Post #39.

Edited November 8, 2022 by DenverSteve