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Q2 face detection

brickftl
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Leica Guy

Leica Guy

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2 hours ago, brickftl said:

Is there any update on the inadequate face detection of the Q2, and whether Leica is aware of and working on a firmware fix?

No update that I’m aware of. Pretty sure Leica knows about it. The V2.0 firmware is an improvement. Still no where nearly as good as my iPhone 11 Pro. I’ve heard Sony is also great. It’s a weakness so far with Leica at least as far as the Q series. I cannot say for other models. 

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brickftl

brickftl

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2 hours ago, Leica Guy said:

No update that I’m aware of. Pretty sure Leica knows about it. The V2.0 firmware is an improvement. Still no where nearly as good as my iPhone 11 Pro. I’ve heard Sony is also great. It’s a weakness so far with Leica at least as far as the Q series. I cannot say for other models. 

I have the Sony A7iii and the way it latches on to eyes and faces is beyond remarkable. I wish my Q2 could do half as well.

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Guest

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I have an olympus pen ep-5 from 2013 and the face detection is superb and a useful tool  so its a shame that people say the Q face detect is unreliable.

Ps my main camera is an M262 but i find the Q/Q2 interesting.

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  • 1 month later...
vedivv

vedivv

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Both Canon R and Nikon Z improved eye tracking by a large margin in the firmware update.  I really hope Leica can do the same with the next firmware update. 

Leica has really good reputation supporting its products.  So if that's something they can copy from SL2, it would really awesome (although SL2 is still at least a generation behind Sony A7III on eye tracking AF when I tried it in the Leica store). 

in practice, even at F1.7, there is usually enough DOF to get eyes in focus, unless you get really close.  That being said, I had plenty missed focus with both single spot focus and face detection to wish for better AF on my Q2.

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nicci78

nicci78

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Latest firmware fixed it in a great way. 
Q2 now adopt SL2 face detect style : when no face is detected, it reverts back to 1-point AF. Where we can freely adjust AF point with D-Pad or touch. Double tap on the screen to centre it again. 
Even better screen can act like a touchpad to adjust AF point when using EVF. 
I really love that. And of course face detect is more reliable. Not CL face detect accuracy. But it is way better than before. 


I used Q2 only in face detect mode now. 
 

Please not that in any crop mode 35-50-75. Q2 will only detect faces within the frame lines selected. It is very handy. Combined with the fact that it will only meter light within the crop lines too. Q2 is as close to a quad lenses camera as possible. 
 

Only issue. Latest firmware broke manual focus mode. You will not be able to use right wheel function button anymore, when MF is engaged. Still no firmware correction. What a shame. 

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Leica Guy

Leica Guy

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15 hours ago, nicci78 said:

Latest firmware fixed it in a great way. 
Q2 now adopt SL2 face detect style : when no face is detected, it reverts back to 1-point AF. Where we can freely adjust AF point with D-Pad or touch. Double tap on the screen to centre it again. 
Even better screen can act like a touchpad to adjust AF point when using EVF. 
I really love that. And of course face detect is more reliable. Not CL face detect accuracy. But it is way better than before. 


I used Q2 only in face detect mode now. 
 

Please not that in any crop mode 35-50-75. Q2 will only detect faces within the frame lines selected. It is very handy. Combined with the fact that it will only meter light within the crop lines too. Q2 is as close to a quad lenses camera as possible. 
 

Only issue. Latest firmware broke manual focus mode. You will not be able to use right wheel function button anymore, when MF is engaged. Still no firmware correction. What a shame. 

Nicci78, I disagree that MF is now broken. MF works fine. Leica chose to use the Thumb Button to control magnification while in MF. I think it’s a poor implementation and I too miss access to the custom functions while in MF mode. Hopefully, they will return the normal Thumb Button custom functions while in MF. I definitely want some way to keep the magnification sticky (magnified) when in MF. It’s critical for macro photography. 

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nicci78

nicci78

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It’s broken because you have to get to back to AF (ruining your manually focus point by the way) to use this function button. 
Magnification with this function button is useless, because it is already automatic when we turn the focus ring, even so slightly. 
Macro mode maybe. But such a tuny gain cause such great pain in 99.99% of usage. 

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  • 4 months later...
vedivv

vedivv

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Q2 face detection is  very inconsistent.  28mm has pretty big DOF, so it "which part of the face" only becomes a problem when you fill the frame with pretty much just the face.   For me, it has never been consistent which part of the face, as 3/4 shots often gets the eye that is further away in focus.  And it fails to lock when the subject is just a few yards away.

In summary, face detection is is among the worst among the newer cameras, probably as good as a Sony FF release 7 years ago.  Really hope Leica would release a firmware update to improve this and the wobbling continuous AF mode.  It should both provide eye detection in closer range and provide longer range.  Panasonic's new AF algorithm, as released in S5 and updated its other bodies, is such a big improvement that I wish Leica can take advantage of. 

On the other hand,  the AF in Q2 is actually very fast.  If I pressed the shutter down quickly (almost in one motion) in single mode (AF point set correctly), I can generally get the shot.

 

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dml84_L

dml84_L

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It would be absolutely awesome if they would implement the new algorithm for the Q2. I don't know if it uses or needs specific hardware or ISA but maybe it's "just"

software. Even if it takes some time, do you think it is realistic that they do that? I am still dreaming about real eye AF or even animal eye AF (S1/S5 have it) but I am not sure

if the hardware is fast enough? It has a "Maestro II" processor - whatever that actually is? I read (not sure if true) that the S1R and Q2 seem to share some hardware. The original "Maestro II" was released in 2014 - if they haven't add some hardware/made changes, I would simple guess - it might be indeed a bit old..

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dml84_L

dml84_L

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vor 13 Stunden schrieb nicci78:

Q2 is only Maestro II just like previous Q. 
It is not fast enough for reliable face detect. I gave up on this AF mode. Not fast nor accurate enough. Sad. 

Sad indeed. Maybe it's just me, but I think it would be better not having it as an option in the menu then...

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nicci78

nicci78

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The real problem is the algorithm is dumb. 
First version : it did recognise a face facing forward to the camera. But then if it turns slightly, the Q2 will lost it. Then revert back to multi field (selecting the closest subject) 

Second and current version : it did recognise a face facing forward to the camera. But then if it turns slightly, the Q2 will lost it. Then it revert back to one point AF. At least you can move the point wherever you want. But Q2 is really stupid. Instead of giving you the last face position point. It will give you the last memorised point for 1 point AF. Which can be anywhere else. 
Very very stupid. 
 

So now I just use targe AF. It just stick to the face that I had selected manually. It works good enough. But it will drain the battery faster and it can be quite noisy. 

Edited by nicci78
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evanthomas

evanthomas

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Just got my Q2. The face detect is very, very disappointing, it's worse than cameras 10 years ago and feature I really love on my Sonys. Another problem is that the manual states quite clearly that if it can't detect a face (which is most of the time) it will fall back to multi-field but it actually reverts to single field. 

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Simone_DF

Simone_DF

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On 9/28/2020 at 9:45 PM, nicci78 said:

Q2 is only Maestro II just like previous Q. 
It is not fast enough for reliable face detect. I gave up on this AF mode. Not fast nor accurate enough. Sad. 

AFAIK the processor in some Panasonic is less powerful than then one in the SL2, so the Maestro II may be enough.

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nicci78

nicci78

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I guess that the new Venus engine of S1/S1R/S1H is more or at least as powerful as Maestro III. So it should beats the old Maestro II. 

Depth of defocus needs lots of processing and the fastest I/O possible to works reliably.

 

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