rpo Posted July 20, 2007 Author Share #21 Posted July 20, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) To Jaapv: Absolutely correct and true! Really the problem is just in the insufficient familiarity with the Italian language because my written ends with these words: The light difference instrumentally measured demonstrates that the Leica M8 is not much noisiest like the M7 but is just the noise different frequency distribution that it "tricks" the ear. To ho_co: My M8 is a "out serie special number" body and on the plate of my black M8 is engraved my name and the special number that Leica has especially dedicated to my camera. M8 n. 3.333.333 My best regards Roberto Piero Ottavi Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted July 20, 2007 Posted July 20, 2007 Hi rpo, Take a look here M8 noise test. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
giorgio.anzi Posted July 20, 2007 Share #22 Posted July 20, 2007 I think we have just to thanks Roberto and peoples that spend their time to produce documents and accurate tests about the Leica world. You can contest the test form the technical point of view (if you are able to) not the purpose. Nobody is trying to discredit leica. Roberto works to publish the magazine LEICAPASSION (the Title is not italian) just for passion! A technical test (when accurate) is useful to anyone is interested to know, than you can like or not the experience results, you can consider it important or not , but the experience still there. So, welcome to documents like that. We have a common passion LEICA, not a common language (fortunately); we should share just that passion. Giorgio Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlancasterd Posted July 20, 2007 Share #23 Posted July 20, 2007 This is the International forum, not the English-speaking forum. If a bunch of penguins start posting here in their native language, that is just as ethical as posting in English Good on you, Mate! (as they say in Australian...) ;) ('Hear, hear!', in English...) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gareth_c Posted July 20, 2007 Share #24 Posted July 20, 2007 If a bunch of penguins start posting here in their native language, that is just as ethical as posting in English I will however be annoyed if these penguins all start posting up pictures taken with their Noctilux's Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmazzi Posted July 20, 2007 Share #25 Posted July 20, 2007 That surprise to read some comments thus acids, perhaps outside place. If memories help me well when M8 entered on the market one of the heavier critics, also on this forum, was the different noise from previous M cameras. Finally one true test made with certified instrumentation… and here the result. We try, to my modest seeming, of being friendly and to appreciate the job of who loves Leica truly. And goodness knows that a Leicapassion one day can be translating in English, he deserves it. Since I read the Italian enough well, I guarantee that on Leicapassion, nothing is sold, but is only attempted to diffuse the Passion for Leica. Thanks Mario Wedding Photographer in Venice, Italy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 20, 2007 Share #26 Posted July 20, 2007 That surprise to read some comments thus acids, perhaps outside place. If memories help me well when M8 entered on the market one of the heavier critics, also on this forum, was the different noise from previous M cameras.Finally one true test made with certified instrumentation… and here the result. We try, to my modest seeming, of being friendly and to appreciate the job of who loves Leica truly. And goodness knows that a Leicapassion one day can be translating in English, he deserves it. Since I read the Italian enough well, I guarantee that on Leicapassion, nothing is sold, but is only attempted to diffuse the Passion for Leica. Thanks Mario Wedding Photographer in Venice, Italy Welcome on the forum, Mario. I had a look at your website - and bookmarked it for future reference! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rolf Posted July 20, 2007 Share #27 Posted July 20, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) Roberto, Danke für den Hinweis und Deine gute Arbeit. Wieder mal ein interessantes Magazin. Gruß aus Köln Saluti di Cologne Rolf Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rpo Posted July 20, 2007 Author Share #28 Posted July 20, 2007 Hi Rolf! Thanks to you for your important presence also in Leicapassion Forum. Roberto Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
asfeir Posted July 21, 2007 Share #29 Posted July 21, 2007 Asfeir write:"If the difference is really 1.2 dbA then it should not be perceptible; acousticians know that a 3 dB is just perceptible, 5 dB is clearly noticeable and 10 dB is perceived as twice as loud." Not, my friend, unfortunately your preparation about the technical physics applied to the noise is rather light. The behavior of the noise is not linear but logarithmic and an increment of 3 dB is not “just perceptible”, but exactly 100% more and an increment of 9 dB correspond to multiply 8 times the acoustic pressure... (Just for information I work in the field of the judicial acoustic research.) However not problem, the important is to interpret correctly my good will because I'm a technician but also a true Leica amateur and I think to offer my technical experience also to who demonstrates not to appreciate my job. :-)) My best regards and my general "thanks" for any replay. Roberto Dear Roberto I also happen to know some about acoustics You are right about the scale being logarithmic, but in acoustics,there are several measures: Sound Level, Intensity Level, Power level, all three are simply logarithmic, i.e. doubling the intensity (measured linearly), increases the intensity level (measured logartithmically) by 3 dB. We al know that 0 dB + 0 dB equals 3 dB HOWEVER, I am talking here about Loudness, which is the perceptual feeling; this is a complex scale that is not logarithmic; it depends on level and frequency. You do not perceive the same difference in dB between 90 and 93 than between 40 and 43, etc... etc... I would be more than happy to give all references on the subject if you so wish. I decided to write this not only to respond to your message, but also to take advantage and refer to the compression that Leica uses to produce its 8 bit DNG files. It is very much related to the fact that our perception of light is logarithmic (almost), but also depends on light bandwidth. But that is another story! The compression to 8 bit works extremely well, and I love the camera Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
asfeir Posted July 21, 2007 Share #30 Posted July 21, 2007 Asfeir write:"If the difference is really 1.2 dbA then it should not be perceptible; acousticians know that a 3 dB is just perceptible, 5 dB is clearly noticeable and 10 dB is perceived as twice as loud." Not, my friend, unfortunately your preparation about the technical physics applied to the noise is rather light. The behavior of the noise is not linear but logarithmic and an increment of 3 dB is not “just perceptible”, but exactly 100% more and an increment of 9 dB correspond to multiply 8 times the acoustic pressure... (Just for information I work in the field of the judicial acoustic research.) However not problem, the important is to interpret correctly my good will because I'm a technician but also a true Leica amateur and I think to offer my technical experience also to who demonstrates not to appreciate my job. :-)) My best regards and my general "thanks" for any replay. Roberto Dear Roberto I do not know that my message indicates in any way that I do not appreciate your job. What I implied in my message is that, if the noise of the M8 is perceived as louder, it would be most likely due to its frequency contents. Now to acoustics. I know that dB is logarithmic and that 0 dB + 0 dB equals 3 dB. Any doubling of noise increases the level by 3 dB. What I was referring to is the LOUDNESS level. This is a measure of subjective hearing, and is somewhat related to the A scale in a very complex manner. I hereby reaffirm my claim that at normal noise levels (~ 60 to 80 dBA), most humans will only distinguish an increase in loudness if this is 3 dB or more. At lower levels this is no more true. I will be glad to send you many references to the subject if you so wish. This said, this site is all about photography with the M8, not about acoustics. But this discussion may be useful to clarify also the compression scheme used by Leica. This scheme is lossless (or almost so) because our vision does not distinguish equal changes in brightness in the dark and light zones. But this is another discussion. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philinflash Posted July 22, 2007 Share #31 Posted July 22, 2007 ... My M8 is a "out serie special number" body and on the plate of my black M8 is engraved my name and the special number that Leica has especially dedicated to my camera. M8 n. 3.333.333 ... Roberto, that is pretty cool! But I infer that (i) you have no intention of selling your M8 with your name on the top plate and (ii) you have no intention of going to China where the number would be viewed as super-unlucky! Let us hope that all your luck with your M8 is Good. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.