Newly purchased refurbished M8 with (?) old problems

[garygsandhu]

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My newly purchased factory refurbished Leica M8 has the following problems:

 

1. a thin vertical line of dead pixels.

2. green banding/streaking/ghosting in flare prone conditions

3. half of the picture green

4. the shutter stopped firing until I removed and replaced the battery.

 

Weren't these problems solved with later M8's and after the recall? Is my M8 actually refurbished, or did this one just slip through quality control?

 

Thanks.

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[RMF]

The thin vertical line of dead pixels is still present in new cameras (I have have them in my 3 month old M8). There is debate if they are actually dead pixels though. The line typically happens in one of either two same places on all affected cameras.

[ho_co]

Gary--

I haven't heard of "factory refurbished" M8's. Does it have a Leica warranty stating that it's refurbished? I was unaware of Leica selling 'refurbished' equipment.

 

Without knowing more about what you describe, I can't say for sure whether these are the same problems as addressed in the upgrade.

 

Half of picture green? I don't think I've heard of that at all.

 

Electrical problem clearing up with removal and reinsertion of battery? Still an occasional occurrence so far as I know. How often has this happened?

 

Green ghosts and banding? Very possibly the same as the problem eliminated by the recall, judging from your description. But also possibly the exposed-edge-pixel banding problem Leica is still looking into.

 

In short:

1) You definitely may have an early camera that didn't go thru the recall.

2) More information on all the issues described would be helpful for diagnosis.

3) To me, the term 'refurbished M8' raises suspicions. Again, more info necessary IMHO.

 

I would call Solms and ask if the camera is an early one, and if so, whether it was upgraded by them. If not, just send it off to them for the upgrade. If so, the situation sounds quite peculiar. Either way, Leica is the only authoritative source I know of (though we sure try on the forum as well! ).

 

Good luck. And keep us posted.

 

--HC

[Shootist]

How do you know it was factory refurbished? Was there a sticker on it that said factory refurbished?

If it has a line in the images and half of the image is green and at some point the shutter stops firing until you remove & replace the battery I'd say someone sold you a bill of goods or the factory is in china.

 

If you bouight this M8 from a authorized Leica dealer take it back and get your money back.

 

I've had 3 M8's and none of them had any of the problems you are asking about.

EDIT:

Yes I have had the green banding when there is a bright light just on the edge of the image. All M8's suffer from this.

END EDIT:

The only time I have had a camera freeze is when I am setting the camera to Clean Sensor. I have had all of them become non-responsive and the only way to fix it was to remove the battery. This happen very inferquently.

[garygsandhu]

The camera box has a sticker that says:

Ausstellungsware: Funktionssicherheit lt. Leica-Garantie wird gewahrleistet. Leica Camera AG.

 

 

Which Babel fish translates literally as:

 

"Exhibition commodity: Insurance of operation as per Leica warranty is aware of-carried out. Leica Camera AG"

 

And the warranty card says:

 

"Used Equipment Limited Warranty"

(limited by not including cosmetic defects, and otherwise 1 year).

 

I got it from Popflash Photo, Tony Rose, so I think it's legitimate. In order to return back to him, I would have had to pay an 8 percent restocking/visa surcharge, or else wait for him to get another used Leica M8 from Leica, or else he was willing to give me a rebate on a brand new M8 -- all fair enough, and I opted to just get it repaired under warranty.

 

I'll post example pictures later, but it seems that it was not upgraded. Also, it had old firmware in it.

[finkaudio]

The camera box has a sticker that says:

Ausstellungsware: Funktionssicherheit lt. Leica-Garantie wird gewahrleistet. Leica Camera AG.

 

 

Which Babel fish translates literally as:

 

"Exhibition commodity: Insurance of operation as per Leica warranty is aware of-carried out. Leica Camera AG"

 

And the warranty card says:

 

"Used Equipment Limited Warranty"

(limited by not including cosmetic defects, and otherwise 1 year).

 

I got it from Popflash Photo, Tony Rose, so I think it's legitimate. In order to return back to him, I would have had to pay an 8 percent restocking/visa surcharge, or else wait for him to get another used Leica M8 from Leica, or else he was willing to give me a rebate on a brand new M8 -- all fair enough, and I opted to just get it repaired under warranty.

 

I'll post example pictures later, but it seems that it was not upgraded. Also, it had old firmware in it.

 

 

Hi,

 

the sticker says that you have a Ex-DEMO unit with full warranty. For example, LEICA gave M8 to dealers in Germany for customers to play with at the very beginning. Your sticker does not say anything about refurbished and from what you found out, I would say it's a very early M8 that was sold now.

 

Best regards

 

Karl-Heinz

[ho_co]

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Gary--

I think Karl-Heinz' conclusion is correct.

 

As I recall, the cameras returned from the upgrade with software 1.092. (Someone correct me if I'm in error.)

 

You said yours was older firmware--was it earlier than 1.092? If so, it definitely did not undergo the recall.

 

Sounds as if the camera will need to go to Solms.

 

Congratulations! It sounds as if you got a bargain, and I think you made the right choice to have it repaired instead of replacing it.

 

--HC

[Shootist]

They returned with 1.09. Then came a mistakenly leaked version, 1.091, and was quickly pulled from the Leica site. A week or so later they released 1.092. Then what we are now using 1.102.

 

If the camera had 1.06 on it then it is for sure a unit that has not gone back for the upgrades.

[ho_co]

They returned with 1.09. ... If the camera had 1.06 on it then it is for sure a unit that has not gone back for the upgrades.

Thanks for the correction, Ed!

 

--HC

[garygsandhu]

Yes, it had 1.06 on it.

Thanks for the clarification everyone. Attached are some pictures showing the problems:

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[wlaidlaw]

I think I too have a refurbished camera. The problem I have is that mine was sold to me as a new camera. It has a very early serial number of 3100302, even though it was bought at the end of January. Leica confirmed at a later point, it had the upgraded sensor and it arrived with 1.09 firmware in it. I now however, discover that the warranty card serial number does not match the camera nor does the serial number on the box, which are much later numbers. The Leica dealer has enquiries ongoing with Leica Spain and Solms to ask what went on here but is not getting any answers. The dealer says the box arrived sealed from Leica Spain and he only opened the box to stamp the guarantee card (BTW I believe him - he seems a totally straight guy and is an official Leica dealer). Guy has very kindly used his contacts at the factory to ask them to elucidate - maybe it's a difficult question, as I am still waiting. I bought a new not refurbished camera at new camera price, so that is what I want. If I felt I had had a good deal from Leica on other matters over the last few months, I might let it slide but their general incompetence has cost me time, a considerable amount of money and endless frustration. I have had quite a few minor niggles with my body, recoverable lock-ups plus all the other little features we all know and don't love. I had to do a battery out recovery and firmware reload just last night.

 

Wilson

[ho_co]

Gary--

Ugh!

 

Sorry to say, all the pictures illustrate exactly what you described, and indicate that it's a non-upgraded camera. The repair process should be faster now, though, than when everyone was returning them a few months back. Small consolation, though.

 

 

Wilson--

I'm not defending Leica here, but that could be just a very minor mixup.

 

Not a demonstrator because it didn't have a demonstrator warranty card, right?

 

Possibly simply an early-batch camera that went back for upgrade and then got put into the wrong box before shipment (see next paragraph). To me, that's still a new camera, identical to the ones shipping now, except that it was upgraded while the current batch was built with the modification from day one. (I believe my own camera probably fits the same category as well.)

 

As for putting it into the wrong box with the wrong warranty card, that should not have happened. Leica will need to see to it that they have entered the serial number of your camera, not of your warranty cards. And in all likelihood, someone else got the other half of the problem, i.e. your box and cards but with the camera showing the serial number on your packaging.

 

It's an error, but merely clerical.

 

I agree, it's unlikely to be the dealer's fault. If it were, it would mean that he was demonstrating two M8's at the same time and got them back into the wrong boxes. That scenario would almost never occur.

 

I think your situation will get straightened out quickly.

 

--HC

[wlaidlaw]

 

It's an error, but merely clerical.

 

I agree, it's unlikely to be the dealer's fault. If it were, it would mean that he was demonstrating two M8's at the same time and got them back into the wrong boxes. That scenario would almost never occur.

 

I think your situation will get straightened out quickly.

 

--HC

 

Howard,

 

I do hope you are right but my camera keeps getting those irritating electronic niggles, which are one of the trade marks of the early cameras. I suspect mine is the early electronics with the later sensor - again not what I bought. I deliberately waited until the upgraded model came out before I bought. I had had my lenses ready and waiting on the shelf since November. I nearly went and bought an old M4-P film body just to play with them.

 

The fact that the dealer has been trying for nearly a month to get an answer from Leica Spain, without success, is indicative to me that there actually is some sort of problem/funny business here.

 

Wilson

[Shootist]

Not to hijack this thread but.

Wilson you are in the UK, or so it is listed in your profile, just why are you dealing with a dealer that is dealing with the distributor in Spain?

 

To the OP:

That is a first run camera and has many problems. you need to send that camera back for either a replacement or to be fixed.

[wlaidlaw]

Not to hijack this thread but.

Wilson you are in the UK, or so it is listed in your profile, just why are you dealing with a dealer that is dealing with the distributor in Spain?

 

To the OP:

That is a first run camera and has many problems. you need to send that camera back for either a replacement or to be fixed.

 

Ed,

 

I had ordered an M8 in UK mid-December. The delivery date kept getting put back by a whole month each time, so already having bought my lenses, I was getting pretty fed up. A Spanish friend of mine who lives in Grenada told me that his local Leica Dealer had got an M8 in, where the customer's cheque had bounced (the camera had not been released to the customer). He highly recommended the dealer and I have to say my dealings with him have been impeccable. I was on the phone in seconds and I was a case of first come, first served and we did the deal on the spot.

 

Your second paragraph rather sums up my feelings but I will wait to see what Stefan Daniels at Solms has to say. It was when all this came up about refurbished cameras having a sticker on the warranty booklet, that I checked and the whole mess of non-matching serial numbers surfaced. The minor niggles I had been having with the camera since "new" then began to make more sense.

 

Wilson

 

PS: did the zipped file with Ilford data in it arrive chez-vous?

[garygsandhu]

Finally got around to sending the camera to Leica NJ for repair. Using film hexar rf and M3 and my D200 now. Geez, the D200 is big.