mwilliamsphotography Posted September 11, 2016 Share #61 Posted September 11, 2016 Advertisement (gone after registration) Forgot to say: "Keeping the OVF and ignoring the EVF because it's "superior" is exactly the mistake Kodak made with film." Not exactly what happened to Kodak, although the story is often perceived that way. There are a lot of business school studies regarding the failure of Kodak that show that the description above is more of an urban legend or an oversimplification of what actually led to kodak's downfall. The real lesson of Kodak wasn't merely clinging to nostalgia (although that's part of it) or dismissing a new technology (after all, Kodak essentially invented the (commercial/consumer) digital camera); rather, the real lesson is Kodak's failure to recognize digital photography as a truly disruptive innovation. Because it failed to recognize that, it failed to capitalize on its own invention. Alternatively, some of the studies would say that the problem Kodak had wasn't its failure to recognize digital as a disruptive innovation, but it's failure to do anything during the interim period between the invention and the eventual full manifestation of disruption to prepare itself to thrive *either* in spite of or because of the disruption. Nothing I have experienced with EVF cameras - and I own one (the RX1) and have used many others - convinces me that the EVF is a disruptive innovation. Popular? Sure. Useful? Yes. But has it/will it change the fundamental nature of how photography is carried out and make possible the previously impossible? Doubtful. The 35mm portable film camera was a disruptive innovation because it made it possible to capture images in places and circumstances previously impossible (photojournalism/unobtrusive mobile street shooting). Digital was a disruptive innovation because, among other reasons, it put high volume photography capture within everyone's reach, made photo editing accessible to the masses rather than reserved to the high priesthood of professional retouchers, and gave you a way to determine if you got the shot before leaving the shoot, which was previously impossible even with Polaroid backs. I don't see EVFs wreaking that kind of disruptive change. They make it marginally easier to take pictures in dark locations and they're generally smaller: other than that, every other critical benefit you've listed of EVFs can still be achieved with optical viewfinders. A Leica M or DSLR with a good silent mode is functionally just as quiet. My D800 and Phase One XF have first curtain electronic shutter. Etc. As much as I hate to admit it, you know what's a truly disruptive camera technology innovation? The iPhone. It has all of the benefits of an EVF camera, and in spades: it's smaller (thereby capturing the size benefits); its customizeable via apps in ways that are light years ahead of actual cameras; its cheaper; the image quality gap is closing fast; transmittal of photos is infinitely easier than with any "real" camera in existence; and - here's the really disruptive kicker, aside from the price/quality ratio - it's always with you. "The best camera you have is the one you have with you" because the pictures you take with it are better than the non-existent pictures not taken by the camera you either don't own because it's too expensive or that you left at home because it's too large to put in your pocket. It's the high quality camera phone that is the long-term problem for camera manufacturers, not the EVF versus OVF debate. Very interesting insight and opinion. One thing to keep in mind about "disruptive technologies" is that the benefit need not always be a consumer benefit. EVF not only allows the camera to be smaller, the mechanical stuff it eliminates is expensive to make. $$$$$ is a big motivator of ultra hype to the consumer. Further thoughts about your cell phone theory as the disruptive force: Actually the disruptive photographic technologies are often a secondary effect from an even bigger change in media vehicles. What drove the advent of digital photography was the virtually over-night transformation of print media to digital. Digital backs with Phillips, Kodak and Dalsa sensors helped photographers eliminate the tedious, time consuming, and costly film protocols. Likewise, what drove consumer digital was cell phones as media, a direct result of the rise of social site outlets for "instantly transmittable electronic photos". That combination has prove lethal to photography as we once knew it. The democratization of photography focusing on content rather than aesthetics has given rise to devaluation of images as a commodity. One would hope that those with a greater purpose would then stand out, yet the opposite seems true ... the cacophony of imagery makes it harder to find anything of value, and the masses tend to not know it when they see it anyway. Basically, there was a bit of magic to photography, but now the audience knows how every illusion is accomplished ... even though the result is fabulous, the observer thinks they know how is is done and that they could also do it. - Marc Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted September 11, 2016 Posted September 11, 2016 Hi mwilliamsphotography, Take a look here New stuff for Leica S at Photokinia. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
xiaubauu2009 Posted September 12, 2016 Share #62 Posted September 12, 2016 Titanium edition of the M240p is more likely... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
albertknappmd Posted September 17, 2016 Share #63 Posted September 17, 2016 Only three days to go... The speculation is frenzied and ferocious! Albert Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest chipcarterdc Posted September 19, 2016 Share #64 Posted September 19, 2016 Is this the much-bally-hoo'ed "new stuff for Leica S"? http://leicarumors.com/2016/09/19/leica-launches-professional-business-unit.aspx/ I certainly hope not, because there's no "there" there... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted September 19, 2016 Share #65 Posted September 19, 2016 Even worse if it means that only certain photographers, at an additional cost, get the benefit of faster repairs/replacements for issues that arguably warranted a recall in the first place. I'll remain optimistic that Leica will do better than that. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
skimmel Posted September 19, 2016 Share #66 Posted September 19, 2016 My favorite line in the press release: that the new service will provides benefits "such as an even faster worldwide repair and replacement service." Wow, even faster? Sounds like Leica may break the previously unheard of barrier of faster than 4 month turnaround on basic repairs! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted September 20, 2016 Share #67 Posted September 20, 2016 Advertisement (gone after registration) Had another call today from Leica as a followup to my previous question regarding the S180mm lens. I was told that there will be a package released at Photokina just for the S users..............I won't elaborate on it, but I think it will make a lot of S shooters very happy and potentially bring a bunch more professional photographers into the S system Happy I made the move to the S007 when I did :) So, Neil, is this new Business Unit concept the 'package' that made you happy to move to the S007? How does it affect you and others with service/repair issues? Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest NEIL-D-WILLIAMS Posted September 20, 2016 Share #68 Posted September 20, 2016 So, Neil, is this new Business Unit concept the 'package' that made you happy to move to the S007? How does it affect you and others with service/repair issues? Jeff Yes that is what I was told about last month.............. unfortunately, it doesn't work, I dropped my 30mm lens off at Leica Kuala Lumpur on the 30th August to be sent to Berlin for a new AF motor, it attired in Singapore on the 16th of September. Its now on the way to Germany but I also sent the weathering cable with my 30mm lens to get fixed as well but for what ever reason Leica Singapore held onto that and as far as I can make out its still in Singapore............what a FUC#UP. to Answer your question I am glad I upgraded to the S007 as there is nothing that I have touched can out perform the IQ of the camera and lenses Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted September 20, 2016 Share #69 Posted September 20, 2016 to Answer your question I am glad I upgraded to the S007 as there is nothing that I have touched can out perform the IQ of the camera and lenses Sure, Neil, but that wasn't the basis for your happiness in the original post to this thread. You've always been happy with IQ, but almost bailed several times due to other issues....then this thread. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest NEIL-D-WILLIAMS Posted September 20, 2016 Share #70 Posted September 20, 2016 Sure, Neil, but that wasn't the basis for your happiness in the original post to this thread. You've always been happy with IQ, but almost bailed several times due to other issues....then this thread. Jeff Unfortunately I'm now or soon to be in the camp where all my lenses have been fixed, therefore I'm being selfish by saying "I'm okay jack" but in reality this new program isn't worth the paper its written on............well let me back track. Sven did call me and say that he could have a replacement 30mm with me in 48 hours, but as I was getting ready to return to Nigeria I told him I was not interested in a loaner, I just wanted my own lens back. I really get the sense of his frustrations as well with the slap happy approach of the Leica Store in Malaysia......... I think that the Leica S owners in the US and europe will get a better service in future............I hope so. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
John McMaster Posted September 20, 2016 Share #71 Posted September 20, 2016 My 45mm spent a week getting it AF fixed, add 3 or 4 days courier each way and that should be just over two weeks turnaround (I am in France). Sadly the UPS drop-off point neglected to tell me that they were about to shut for a French 3 week holiday, so my lens sat in the neighbouring village longer than to/from Germany plus repair time! john Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest NEIL-D-WILLIAMS Posted September 20, 2016 Share #72 Posted September 20, 2016 My 45mm spent a week getting it AF fixed, add 3 or 4 days courier each way and that should be just over two weeks turnaround (I am in France). Sadly the UPS drop-off point neglected to tell me that they were about to shut for a French 3 week holiday, so my lens sat in the neighbouring village longer than to/from Germany plus repair time! john I think not only will the turn around be better but the avalibillity of a loner will be so much better to.......... it doesn't help if your in the middle of a shoot but will help if not? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
John McMaster Posted September 20, 2016 Share #73 Posted September 20, 2016 We are not sure yet if it is available to the likes of us or businesses who do equipment rentals.... http://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/264707-leica-launches-professional-business-unit-merged/page-2?do=findComment&comment=3115588 john Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RVB Posted September 20, 2016 Share #74 Posted September 20, 2016 This open letter to Leica was posted on Diglloyd's site, http://diglloyd.com/blog/2016/20160920_0915-ReaderComments-LeicaS.html , I'm interested to hear any opinions on this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterv Posted September 20, 2016 Share #75 Posted September 20, 2016 Thanks for sharing this, Rob. I hadn't been to Mr. Chambers' site in over a year ... How typical of him to make space for such an 'open letter'. He likes to stir the pot and create FUD, especially with all things Leica, look at his comment. The S system certainly is not dead, nor is the M, for that matter. Clickbait, I call it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted September 20, 2016 Share #76 Posted September 20, 2016 Well, the good news is that the letter makes no mention of any issues with the writer's lenses, despite owning 8 of them. His only beef is that there aren't enough new lenses. I wouldn't be surprised if S lens reliability and service issues had influence on Leica's decision to curtail new lens rollout. Of course profit is the key, and nobody outside Leica knows how the S line has been selling, or at what return.....but certainly lower cost entrants, starting with the Pentax 645Z, followed by extensive Leica price cuts on earlier models, haven't helped. It will be interesting to see how the product line develops...or not. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
skimmel Posted September 20, 2016 Share #77 Posted September 20, 2016 I apologize for being dense, but what exactly is the new service being offered to S owners? Thanks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted September 20, 2016 Share #78 Posted September 20, 2016 I apologize for being dense, but what exactly is the new service being offered to S owners? Thanks. See post #73. Still not clear, to me at least, what if anything new applies to general consumers, for lack of better terminology. I haven't seen anything specific policy-wise.....or even any mention of lens service issues or improvements. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 20, 2016 Share #79 Posted September 20, 2016 I am so pleased to be S less ... were I to capitalize on photos of naked waifs ... edgy lighting and social media ... guaranteed fast response. Rest of us will be at the back of the queue .... Good luck with that . Not what you spend ... who ya know. I would prefer to stay a bit distant from this ethic. JMHO Bob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georges Posted September 20, 2016 Share #80 Posted September 20, 2016 Neil, I think you passed the test. I guess you are qualified to work in the Leica Communication Department : how to create excitement out of a small thing. I am not sure if this will really bring so many new "professional" users, IMHO. Got now from two independent sources that the metal replacement parts for the AF will be available as of October. Let's hope it is true. I will surely ask it again at the Photokina on Thursday. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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