matlep Posted February 22, 2016 Share #21 Posted February 22, 2016 Advertisement (gone after registration) I would swap if it was to a reasonable cost. Otherwise no. Would really love the lower weight and the lack of EVF and video. I don't need it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted February 22, 2016 Posted February 22, 2016 Hi matlep, Take a look here Would you swap M(type 240) for M(type 262) ?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Peter H Posted February 22, 2016 Share #22 Posted February 22, 2016 Swap? No. I might have considered both cameras had I had the choice. However there would have been no reasonable point in upgrading my M9 to the M262 and the added features of the M240 were exactly what I was hoping for. As it is I really appreciate the M240 for the added features and my M9 and MM for the pure experience (whatever that may mean, probably different things to different people). No place for a 262 in my stable. It's odd, or maybe I'm odd, but there's no "purity of experience" in the M9 for me, at least not when compared with the M240. Purity doesn't come about as a result of antiquity, but as a result of being most fit for the task at hand, and I cannot think of a single type of photography that I do where the M9 is the more appropriate camera than the M240. The same would go for any other current or recent reduced version of the M, although I can just about understand the thinking of those who find the castration attractive. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Livingston Posted February 22, 2016 Share #23 Posted February 22, 2016 I would swap if it was to a reasonable cost. Otherwise no. Would really love the lower weight and the lack of EVF and video. I don't need it. Then remove it with the menu settings...!!! The lower weight is just 100 grams and that's simply because the top plate which is made of aluminium rather than brass... and I would FAR rather have a proper M brass top plate..! And anyway, your choice of lens, strap or half case, lens hood, filters etc., would make FAR more significant a change in weight than the materials change...! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
matlep Posted February 22, 2016 Share #24 Posted February 22, 2016 Then remove it with the menu settings...! The lower weight is just 100 grams because the top plate is made of aluminium rather than brass... and I would FAR rather have a proper M brass top plate..! Your choice of lens, strap or half case, lens hood, filters etc., would make FAR more significant a change in weight than the materials change...! I have removed it. But still i don't need it. No lens hood/case/filter/halfcase etc. So the only option left for a lighter camera would be to swap But as I said, only if it was at a reasonable cost. And that is not possible, so it won't happen. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmahto Posted February 22, 2016 Share #25 Posted February 22, 2016 Then remove it with the menu settings...! The lower weight is just 100 grams and that's simply because the top plate which is made of aluminium rather than brass... and I would FAR rather have a proper M brass top plate..! And anyway, your choice of lens, strap or half case, lens hood, filters etc., would make FAR more significant a change in weight than the materials change...! Highlight mine.... I am glad someone said that. My (ex) M9 with half case was slightly heavier than my naked M240. Now to OP: No. I will not. The LV advantages allow me to carry a long/zoom lens without carrying a second body. My Nex6 during M9 days is getting less and less used. It is one of those things that you will not miss it if you haven't used it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bocaburger Posted February 22, 2016 Share #26 Posted February 22, 2016 No. And if I did not own an M240 I would still buy one of them or a -P as a demo over a new M262. Compared with a new M-P the M262 is good value. Compared with a demo it's not to me. Selling an M240 for half what it cost new and then ponying up the difference toward an M262 I would need to get my head examined. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
matlep Posted February 22, 2016 Share #27 Posted February 22, 2016 Advertisement (gone after registration) Highlight mine.... I am glad someone said that. My (ex) M9 with half case was slightly heavier than my naked M240. Now to OP: No. I will not. The LV advantages allow me to carry a long/zoom lens without carrying a second body. My Nex6 during M9 days is getting less and less used. It is one of those things that you will not miss it if you haven't used it. Do people still use half cases? And filters? What year is this? Just kidding. But i do not use any accessories on my camera. Don't see the need. I only use one lens on my M. A 35mm so for me LV has no use at all, and i never, ever shoot video. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Livingston Posted February 22, 2016 Share #28 Posted February 22, 2016 No lens hood/case/filter/halfcase etc. So the only option left for a lighter camera would be to swap So you don't have a lens mounted...? Ah... missed a post! Well, just as well. When you add lenses maybe think about it all again... Selling an M240 for half what it cost new and then ponying up the difference toward an M262 I would need to get my head examined. Its kind of what I said... but you were much more direct...!!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
a.noctilux Posted February 22, 2016 Author Share #29 Posted February 22, 2016 If I understand well, M 262 would only be sold to (small number ) "new to M 2xx users" and zero to user who already own M 240. So the 2 types don't have same customers. Two types and two lines of customers: bravo Leica. Regards, Arnaud Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted February 22, 2016 Share #30 Posted February 22, 2016 I only use one lens on my M. A 35mm so for me LV has no use at all, and i never, ever shoot video. Could ease focus calibration checks with your one lens. Not suggesting this is reason to own, but a benefit for those who have the option. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranma13 Posted February 22, 2016 Share #31 Posted February 22, 2016 I just sent a M262 rental back and will not be replacing my M240. From what I saw, there are quite a few hot pixels that show up in the shadows when you push the exposures more than +1.5 to +2 in Lightroom. I saw this behavior in multiple shots around ISO 400-800. There's also significant banding as well, almost like they took the algorithm from the Leica Q and Leica SL and applied it to the M262. On top of that, reds seem to be over-saturated. To my eyes, it seems that the M262 is not just a M240 with an aluminum top plate and live view removed, but rather a modified sensor processing algorithm. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted February 22, 2016 Share #32 Posted February 22, 2016 I just sent a M262 rental back and will not be replacing my M240. From what I saw, there are quite a few hot pixels that show up in the shadows when you push the exposures more than +1.5 to +2 in Lightroom. I saw this behavior in multiple shots around ISO 400-800. There's also significant banding as well, almost like they took the algorithm from the Leica Q and Leica SL and applied it to the M262. On top of that, reds seem to be over-saturated. To my eyes, it seems that the M262 is not just a M240 with an aluminum top plate and live view removed, but rather a modified sensor processing algorithm. The sensor is 'technologically different' from the M240... http://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/254414-m-262-sensor-is-technically-different-to-m-240/ Don't know if there's any relationship with your issues. It's also possible that the rental unit had problems. Did you also use a LR profile (and/or one of your own) specific to the M262? Colors can be corrected to a new default setting. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
marchyman Posted February 22, 2016 Share #33 Posted February 22, 2016 If I understand well, M 262 would only be sold to (small number ) "new to M 2xx users" and zero to user who already own M 240. That describes me. When I went looking for an M I decided the 262 is fine for my wants. The "small number" may describe how many Leica made... It's been a month since I ordered mine. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranma13 Posted February 22, 2016 Share #34 Posted February 22, 2016 The sensor is 'technologically different' from the M240... http://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/254414-m-262-sensor-is-technically-different-to-m-240/ Don't know if there's any relationship with your issues. It's also possible that the rental unit had problems. Did you also use a LR profile (and/or one of your own) specific to the M262? Colors can be corrected to a new default setting. Jeff The term used was "technically different" or "technologically different", which can mean anything from a firmware tweak to a completely different sensor. It's possible that the rental unit had problems, but the issue I had was hot pixels, which I doubt would be specific to only the rental camera considering that it's controlled by the firmware. I just did a default import for LR, no custom profile. It could be that Lightroom is not processing the hot pixel mapping from the RAW file, but there's no way to tell if it is or not. I can post some photos tonight highlighting the issue. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted February 23, 2016 Share #35 Posted February 23, 2016 Are you using an up to date version of LR that includes support for the M262? Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tailwagger Posted February 23, 2016 Share #36 Posted February 23, 2016 Swap? No. Buy as a second body? Perhaps. Like others, while it is rarely used, I find the availability of LV important in some circumstances. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
insf Posted February 23, 2016 Share #37 Posted February 23, 2016 I'd do it in a heartbeat if I didn't have so much sentimental attachment to my current body. It improved upon many things I'm concerned about (e.g., weight and shutter noise) and removed all the things that I just considered deadweight (video, live view, EVF, etc.). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranma13 Posted February 23, 2016 Share #38 Posted February 23, 2016 Are you using an up to date version of LR that includes support for the M262? Jeff Aha, that seems to have been it. I read the patch notes and support for the M262 was added in 6.4, and I was on 6.3. I updated to 6.4 and the hot pixel and banding issue have gone away. Thanks! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CheshireCat Posted February 23, 2016 Share #39 Posted February 23, 2016 No, I would never downgrade my M240 to an inferior camera. Besides, LV allows me to: - Use interesting lenses not coupled with the RF. - Perfectly frame and compose with ultra wides. - Shoot in very low light where the RF is difficult to use. - Evaluate DoF. - Achieve critical focus when I need it. - Evaluate used lenses correctly, and see if they are out of calibration with respect to the RF, so I don't get a lemon. But I have nothing against people with a masochistic attitude Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
elmars Posted February 23, 2016 Share #40 Posted February 23, 2016 Sometimes it is like this: If You want all (or too much), You get nothing. A simple camera with one or two lenses can improve the ability to see and take really good photos - more good photos as one misses because there ist no EVF or LV. This said: In comparison to a DSLR the M240 is a simple camera too. To choose a M262 or M240 is a matter of taste, Elmar Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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