barjohn Posted May 30, 2007 Share #1 Posted May 30, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) I see that some of the longer Leica lenses have eyes. Are these needed on the M8? What do they do for you? Are they strictly an older style and not used on more modern Leica lenses? Would you select one with eyes or without and why? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted May 30, 2007 Posted May 30, 2007 Hi barjohn, Take a look here Leica longer lenses with eyes Question. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
barjohn Posted May 30, 2007 Author Share #2 Posted May 30, 2007 No one knows the answer to these questions? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted May 30, 2007 Share #3 Posted May 30, 2007 For what I know, the only Leica lens of long focus and with eyes ("Goggles") is the Tele Elmarit 135 2,8 (old "goggled" 35s are another story) : effectively this is the only 135 that Leica says is "officially" supported on M8, and , seem to remember, can even be coded: I have not yet tested mine on my brand new M8, and do not think I'll get it coded, but suppose that it can work rightly, with the 90 frame that becomes a 135 frame thanks to the eyes: 135 2,8 is a good lens, but other 135s are generally more appreciated (old Tele Elmar and current Apo Telyt) both for results and for use : the 135 2,8 is a little too heavy and not easy to carry & store owing to the goggles: it was in Leica price list for lot of years, but my impression is that it has never become a "classic" in the usual Leicaphile world Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
doubice Posted May 30, 2007 Share #4 Posted May 30, 2007 John, The eyes were only available on one Leica telephoto lens - the Elmarit f:2.8/135mm. They magnify the viewfinder image by a factor of 1.5, thus increasing the rangefinder accuracy. To explain it simply, if you have an M8 with its 0.68 magnification, the camera's finder will become a 1.02 magnification finder. The result is a much greater focusing accuracy. Since the M8 does not have a 135mm frame, another advantage is that the 'eyes' will magnify the M8's 90mm finder frame and you will be able to focus and frame the 'eyed' lens accurately (90mm x 1.5 = 135mm). You can of course use any other 135mm lens on your M8, but will either have to guess the framing (the M8 does not have a 135mm frame) or, use an accessory finder. This could be a bit of an issue, since the 135mm lens affectively becomes a 180mm telephoto on the M8 and there were not many 180mm accessory finders made. When I found out that the 'eyed' 135mm Elmarit was going to be the only 135mm lens fully supported by the M8, I bought one immediately (before the feeding frenzy on M8 compatible lenses that has gripped the Leica world lately). There would be of course nothing wrong with using a 135mm Tele-Elmar or the latest Apo Telyt, for instance. They are both probably better lenses than the f:2.8 Elmarit (the Apo Telyt definitely...), but you would have to adapt some sighting technique to compensate for the M8's lack of an appropriate 135mm frame. There - I hope I did not confuse you too much..... Best, Jan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
adan Posted May 30, 2007 Share #5 Posted May 30, 2007 Well, technically the 90 Macro is a 'long' lens, and uses goggles as well in macro mode. John G. There are two kinds of goggles. The simpler kind just adjusts the RF optics for closer focusing, as with the current 90 "macro", or the older 50 DR (dual range). There's a prism in them to change the trigonometry of the rangefinder, so that it will measure distances shorter than the nominal limit of .7 meters (1 meter with the 90). The second kind of goggle changes the field of view - on the 135 f/2.8 it magnifies the view to fill the 90mm frame with the subject matter of a 135 (coincidentally, also magnifying the RF image to increase focusing accutance for the longer lens). There are also 35mm lenses with goggles that SHRINK the view through the finder to cram 35mm's worth of subject matter into the framelines for a 50mm lens (a necessity on the M3, which had no 35mm framelines). Available used in f/1.4, f/2, and f/2.8 versions. On the whole, the goggled lenses will work on any M body (including the 8). The 135s sometimes need adjusting though, because the focus can be off after so many years. The main drawback to the goggles is just that they are bulky and heavy compared to ungoggled lenses. I've never been interested in them for that reason. However, also for that same reason, they are occasionally less expensive than the compact, ungoggled equivalents. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lars_bergquist Posted May 30, 2007 Share #6 Posted May 30, 2007 My own experiments show that focusing accuracy is not an issue when using the Tele-Elmarit on the M8. Framing is, of course. The 135 mm Elmar is not a bad 135, especially not the later version, but I have been campaigning for a goggled Apo-Telyt for some time now. Mr. Lee has said that more new lenses should have been introduced with the M8 – a supported Apo-Telyt would be a quick solution, as no optical change is necessary! The old man from the Age of 135 mm Lenses Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skippy Sanchez Posted May 30, 2007 Share #7 Posted May 30, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) I have the Tele Elmarit 135/2.8 with goggles & it works very well on the M8. It's not a lens that I use very often, but when I need something long -- a 180mm effective focal length on the M8 -- it is a handy and relatively inexpensive lens & easy to find. and while not a macro in any sense of the word, it focuses pretty close. (see attatched pic during a freak april snowfall) I agree, however, that it is heavy & the goggles make it bulky to pack in a bag or vest pocket. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
barjohn Posted May 30, 2007 Author Share #8 Posted May 30, 2007 Thank you all for the education. I had seen several on eBay and noted that the prices were low and wondered why. Now I think I understand the pros and cons. Great information for other new Leica M8 owners. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shootist Posted May 30, 2007 Share #9 Posted May 30, 2007 Thank you all for the education. I had seen several on eBay and noted that the prices were low and wondered why. Now I think I understand the pros and cons. Great information for other new Leica M8 owners. The one thing you have to watch out for is focusing on the 135 W/Eyes. Both the focusing cam and the eyes have to be adjusted correctly. I had 2 copies of this lens, still have one that is back for coding, and one of them didn't focus at all, tremendous front focus. The second one front focused slightly. I switched the eyes between the 2 and the focus problems changed with the eye change. IE the one that had tremendous front focus then only had a slight FF and the one the originally had slight FF then was way off. Needless to say I kept the better of the 2 and sold the other. While it is back at Leica NJ for coding I asked them to check the focusing. Also the second version of this lens seems to be the better of the 2. The second version has a full knurled focusing ring and the first version has a segmented focusing ring. My copy is the first version. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hankg Posted May 30, 2007 Share #10 Posted May 30, 2007 I tryed the 135/2.8 (latest version), no problem focusing with the goggles if they are properly claibrated. But the lens doesn't balance well on the M8 the size and weight of the lens + goggles makes the whole package unweildy and the performance is not up to the 135/4 or the Apo-Telyt. The 135/4 tele-elmar is an outstanding lens and is much more manageable on the M. But I'll be selling my copy of that as well as framing and focusing is bit sketchy on the M8. The Apo is even better and 100 grams lighter then the 135/4 so I imagine it would be one of Leica's best but it's lousy resale value (rarely fetches much over $1,000 on ebay) even in the midst of Leica mania is an indication of the difficulty of using the lens on lower mag M's like the M8. I agree with Lars, from my experience with the 135/2.8 the goggles make framing and focusing a snap. The lighter and smaller modern Apo-Telyt with goggles would be a very attractive lens. Making one of Leica's best and it's longest optic usable with the M8. I think they would sell like hotcakes. For me as things are now a 90 with a 1.35 magnifier on the finder is the longest I can use with confidence on the M8. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Hatcher Posted May 30, 2007 Share #11 Posted May 30, 2007 In my opinion, the 135/2.8 Elmarit is a must-have lens for a non-DSLR-owner's M8 kit, because it is cheap to buy and works so well. Sure it is large, heavy, and does nothing for the handling of an M camera (it does have a tripod mount). But it is arguably the longest easy-to-use 'M' lens (or should that be easiest to use long 'M' lens). Easy focusing, easy framing, and respectable performance. I really like it. But then, I also like Visoflexes, and just bought a Telyt 400/5, which I haven't tried yet. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
boilerdoc Posted May 30, 2007 Share #12 Posted May 30, 2007 Don't tell anyone but the goggled 135/2.8 is an undervalued gem. I'm packing it to take to Europe next month. Somewhat bulky? Sure, but it works fabulously well on M7 and M8. I paid <$500 for mine. I have no intentions of selling it unless Leica goggles the Apo-Telyt. That would be a dream lens if Mr Lee makes it happen! Please! Steve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted May 30, 2007 Share #13 Posted May 30, 2007 In my opinion, the 135/2.8 Elmarit is a must-have lens for a non-DSLR-owner's M8 kit, because it is cheap to buy and works so well. Sure it is large, heavy, and does nothing for the handling of an M camera (it does have a tripod mount). But it is arguably the longest easy-to-use 'M' lens (or should that be easiest to use long 'M' lens). Easy focusing, easy framing, and respectable performance. I really like it. But then, I also like Visoflexes, and just bought a Telyt 400/5, which I haven't tried yet. Wow ! I also have a 400/5 and plan to test it with M8 this weekend ! My one is of the 1st type ("big cone", weight is terrible), coated : is it also yours like this or of the 2nd type? If so let us post our results: seem to remember that also the lens shema was different from 1st to 2nd version Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Hatcher Posted May 30, 2007 Share #14 Posted May 30, 2007 Wow ! I also have a 400/5 and plan to test it with M8 this weekend ! My one is of the 1st type ("big cone", weight is terrible), coated : is it also yours like this or of the 2nd type? If so let us post our results: seem to remember that also the lens shema was different from 1st to 2nd version I bought the 2nd type. I don't know what to expect from it but will be happy to compare notes. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodyspedden Posted May 30, 2007 Share #15 Posted May 30, 2007 I have no experience with the 135 with goggles but I just got a mint 135 APO Telyt and it works wonders on the M8. So from the 15CV to the 135 3.4 and most focal lengths in between I am set for my 25 day trip to Europe. And it all fits in the Artisans and Artists Oscar Smith bag. Neato! Woody Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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