Charging while backpacking

[bencoyote]

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The T has an advantage over many other cameras (and the M) because it can charge batteries internally from USB. I personally find that this is the way that I charge the camera all of the time when I'm at home. I simply toss it on to charge all night. However, this charge mechanism is rather slow and is challenging when you need to charge multiple devices from limited USB ports as well as is often the case when backpacking. Also there is the problem that you might want to use the camera rather than using the body as a charger.

 

Unlike the M whose charger has a 12v input, the Leica T external charger only works off of AC.

It doesn't look like Leica makes an external charger which either takes 12v or USB. I wish that they would.

 

The three ideas that I have are:

1) Use a PIXO C-USB to charge the battery. Has anyone tried this?

2) Bring a tiny inverter that runs off of 12v and bring the actual charger.

3) Buy a spare charger and hack it to bypass the AC-DC rectifier to provide whatever the DC charge circuit it is expecting.

 

Has anyone else overcome this problem for a multi-day backpacking trip?

 

[AndreasAM]

I take normally 2 or 3 extra batteries and the mini USB-cable with me when I go hiking for multiple days. Along with the smallest charger for my IPhone. Same weight, more convenience. Gives me a lot more than 1500 RAW-files on the go and the ability to charge when I am staying overnight at a hut or hostel, that is enough for me

Edited May 28, 2015 by AndrewAM

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[bencoyote]

I take normally 2 or 3 extra batteries and the mini USB-cable with me when I go hiking for multiple days. Along with the smallest charger for my IPhone. Same weight, more convenience. Gives me a lot more than 1500 RAW-files on the go and the ability to charge when I am staying overnight at a hut or hostel, that is enough for me

 

So you do all your charging in the camera body?

 

i guess the only downsides of this are:

1) you can't use the camera while charging

2) if you use more than one battery in a day you have to watch for when the battery is charged to top off the next one. I was hoping to take two batteries and charge one inside my backpack from a bigger battery that is kept charged from solar while using the other.

3) charge time is long

 

The upside is:

1) USB is simple to arrange in the field

2) no extra equipment needed except for a micro use cable

[AndreasAM]

When I am in the field I want batteries to be ready, so the spares come in handy. On langer hiketrips I charge whenever is possible, so during lunch/ breakfast in a cabin/restaurant, at night etc. In my experience, my hikes never last more than 5 or 6 nights on a row without good powersources, then a hostel/ hotel is NEXT. During hiking holidays, I charge always in camera this way, weight is premium!

Never been a problem.

[pico]

To be blunt, if we can carry a sandwich or two while hiking, we can carry several spare batteries.

.

[AndreasAM]

Who says I eat when I am hiking, I take pictures!

[pico]

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Who says I eat when I am hiking, I take pictures!

 

Well, when you find yourself hungry, just go back. The battery will last.

[AndreasAM]

I never go back and as a last resort I can always eat the Red Dot!

[bencoyote]

For the trip I bought one of those

• PIXO C4. http://www.amazon.com/Pixo-DPX304-UNIVERSAL-QUICK-CHARGER/dp/B00FWZAM6A/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1433207994&sr=8-1&keywords=pixo+c4 which I'll use with my
• GoalZero Sherpa 50. http://www.goalzero.com/p/151/sherpa-50-power-pack
• and cycle through two batteries

I'll see how it works and post here.

 

The minimal additional weight is worth it for me for the shots around camp which end up being an important part of documenting the trip.

[AndreasAM]

Ben,

 

A T-battery comes in at 50 grams, the Leica-charger at 90 grams (my iPhone-charger is 40 grams)

 

The PIXO C4 is more than half a kilo. that equals more than 10 batteries e,g, more than 4000 shots?

How long is your trip going to last without a possibility to charge, or how much do you shoot in a day?

 

I am as much a gearhead as you as it seems, in some days. But when I go hiking I have learned (the hard way) over the years to keep all additional weight as low as possible. For multiple day hikes priority is saving weight, use the capacity for extra water (when it is warm) and (quality) food.

 

Makes the days so more enjoyable and keeps you safe.

Don't worry, you can shoot when you want to, when you have 2 or 3 spare batteries.

 

Only my experience, like to hear yours when you get back!

Edited June 2, 2015 by AndrewAM

[bencoyote]

Ben,

 

A T-battery comes in at 50 grams, the Leica-charger at 90 grams (my iPhone-charger is 40 grams)

 

The PIXO C4 is more than half a kilo. that equals more than 10 batteries e,g, more than 4000 shots?

How long is your trip going to last without a possibility to charge, or how much do you shoot in a day?

 

I think that the half a kilo either is the shipping weight or includes all the normal accessories like the transformer and 12v cable. If it really is that heavy, it is going back.

 

Plan A: I'm going to make my own 12v barrel plug from the Sherpa to whatever the PIXO C4 takes - likely another barrel plug. 

Plan B: if the PIXO C4 is too heavy. Disassemble and hack the AC charger to accept DC power. Somewhere in the circuit there is going to be the output of a rectifier converting AC to DC. All I will have to do is solder some additional wires onto that and match the voltage. This might blow the rectifier but it would allow me to feed DC directly into the Lithium Battery charge controller chip. I hope that the chip suppliers haven't merged the AC rectifier and the battery charge circuit into one chip. I'm not against voiding the warranty and soldering but I can't edit silicon. ;-)

 

The plan barring emergencies is to be out 7 full days and my estimation using the T is that I'll go through about 1-1.5 batteries worth of charge a day. So yeah about 2000 shots for a week's trip. We will have solar power but no access to AC. If they had only done like they did on the M and made a 12v port on the charger, things would be much simpler.

 

Really these days, I wish everything would go to USB-C (like the new MacBook) which can provide up to 100W. This removes the argument that 5V is not enough to charge a 7.4v battery in acceptable time but that is probably the a couple of generations down the road for accessories like storage batteries like the Sherpa 50.

[johnmoeleker]

Look at waka-waka.com

[bencoyote]

Look at waka-waka.com

 

Too small, and doesn't charge fast enough. The battery in the T is 7.2v 985mAh = 7092mWh = 25531 Joules

Solar radiance is about 1000W/m^2 but solar panels are only about 17% efficient so 170W/m^2 is more realistic.

Chargers are at best about 85% efficient and so if I need closer to 30036J 

So if I had a solar panel a meter squared it would take about 177s to gather the energy to charge the T's battery. 3 min isn't bad if it were possible given battery chemistry but there is no chance I'm carrying a meter squared of solar panels.

The waka-waka and its ilk have about a 100cm^2 at most of solar power. Which would make the time needed to collect the 30,036 J on the order of 17668s or 5 hrs (realistically much more). Plus like most products on the market it only does USB output. 

 

The problem is not a solar charged battery. Those are common and cheap and we have storage batteries that can be solar charged. The problem is that we can only charge batteries with AC or in the body. We need a charger with hopefully a USB input that can charge the camera's batteries. Current common USB go up to 12W for the standard USB and USB-C goes up to 100W both have plenty of power to charge a camera battery. If they must they can do like they did on the M and have a 12v port.

 

I asked Leica for a new accessory and but in the mean time I'll try out the Pixo C4 before I go. If it doesn't work or is too big and heavy I'll probably hack my current AC charger into a DC one.

[Trivette]

For an extended wilderness backpacking trip I would use a manual film camera.

[johnmoeleker]

okee

[pico]

I asked Leica for a new accessory and but in the mean time I'll try out the Pixo C4 before I go. If it doesn't work or is too big and heavy I'll probably hack my current AC charger into a DC one.

I have learned quite a bit reading your posts, thank you. It should be easy to make as proper DC USB charger, but it is telling that Leica chose not to provide one. Question: is not the battery controller chip in the battery? I would hope so.

 

I use 12V for anything I can, but I no longer rough it. Roughing it means sleeping in the truck now. To that end I have a modest AC converter built into the console, but frankly I'm afraid to rely upon it.

 

Good luck, and please share your solution with the rest of us.

[bencoyote]

For an extended wilderness backpacking trip I would use a manual film camera.

 

Carrying the film presents its own challenges. I have considered that though. A friend of mine did 3 weeks down the grand canyon years ago and she carried __a__ spare battery for her camera. It was still in her bag a few years later when she cleaned it it out for the next trip, a tiny button cell. On a raft with approximately infinite weight and space her 40-50 rolls of film took up less space and volume than the group's daily beer ration. Backpacking is a bit different. I do think that as my collection of Leica gear fills out, I'll probably carry a digital and a film Leica but that is a few years down the road.(1) 

 

She did the grand canyon again a couple of years ago with digital and asked me, her personal electronics expert, to engineer a solution for her. It was that process that kind of got me thinking about this problem in a serious way. Luckily, she's been shooting weddings for years and was almost paranoid about the flashes dying and so she literally had hundreds of partially used AA batteries. I rigged up a battery pack that she could plug those half used cells into and which provided the 12v source for a charger which had a 12v input (that is the key). That along with a 7W solar panel that charged some rechargeable AA's and provided USB, kept her electronics running the whole trip. The off the shelf stuff was a GoalZero Nomad7 and Guide 10. The rest came from radioshack. Part of the challenge for the GC trip was that other people going down the river reported that solar didn't work very well due to the narrowness of the canyon.

 

Backpacking with its space and weight limitations poses a different set of problems for charging. Plus I don't have 30lbs of half used AA batteries that I don't know what to do with. With current USB providing 12W, there is no reason why Leica can't build a charger that charges off of the practically ubiquitous high powered USB. The camera body does it. 12v is a bit harder but that readily available as well.

 

The PIXO C4 arrived yesterday, it is much bigger than I expected but it is very light. It does charge the T's battery. I don't have timing for how long it takes to charge because my battery nowhere near empty. Based upon the specs. I expect it will be about 1.5hrs. This looks like the solution for this trip. I could be happy with something similar which didn't have the AA/AAA charger built in, that would reduce the size. The two higher power USB ports will likely be handy. 

 

Pixo C4 for charging Leica T batteries and for spare USB ports and for my companion's ham radio battery which can't charge off of 12v.

Goal Zero Sherpa 50 as a battery and buffer because solar panels have trouble charging things directly.

Solar panel - Even two Nomad 7's chained together don't seem to be able to charge the Sherpa 50. This is unfortunate because I happen to have access to two Nomad 7 solar panels. I'm now trying to decide whether to get a Nomad13 or pay the weight and space penalty and get the Nomad20.

 

 

 

(1) I have an M240 but the only lens that I have is a 50mm lens. by itself, isn't quite as flexible as I need. For an expedition, I'd want 2 bodies and a 28mm, a 50mm, and a 90mm with the macro adapter.

[Trivette]

Carrying the film presents its own challenges. I have considered that though. A friend of mine did 3 weeks down the grand canyon years ago and she carried __a__ spare battery for her camera. It was still in her bag a few years later when she cleaned it it out for the next trip, a tiny button cell. On a raft with approximately infinite weight and space her 40-50 rolls of film took up less space and volume than the group's daily beer ration. Backpacking is a bit different. I do think that as my collection of Leica gear fills out, I'll probably carry a digital and a film Leica but that is a few years down the road.(1)......

 

That's a lot of film for three weeks! When I suggested using film for backpacking, I wasn't thinking of the legendary National Geographic philosophy: Shoot everything you see and sort out the keepers later. I am very conservative about taking pictures, and on my last week-long backpacking trip, I used only two 36-exposure rolls. Thus for me, a manual mechanical camera makes perfectly good sense as the appropriate tool for the task. No batteries required except possibly for a meter.

[bencoyote]

... on my last week-long backpacking trip, I used only two 36-exposure rolls. Thus for me, a manual mechanical camera makes perfectly good sense as the appropriate tool for the task. No batteries required except possibly for a meter.

If I were only planning on shooting 72 shots, I wouldn't be bothering with charging at all. My expectation is somewhere on the order of 200/day. There are vistas and landscape shots, there are social shots around the camp and while we are hiking, there are macro shots of all the flora. There are the wide angle star shots and I have to have at least one of those glowing tent shots. There are so many places in the world to see, I may only go here once.

 

This guy has some examples of where I'm going to be: http://daryl-hunter.net/grand-teton-photography-and-field-guide/ He has coverage of the area and being local he has the opportunity to go back time and time again to pick the light and be lucky enough to find moments to capture. However while his guide gives me ideas about locations his style does not reflect my sensibilities. I'm not sure if it is the camera he uses or the post processing or just the way it appears on my iPad but I find it difficult to look at. I know that we all have a desire to record moments and we all bring our own artistic sensibilities into that. However, I recognize that one thing motivating me to shoot heavily on this trip is to replace the images in his book with ones of my own. I used his book to plan the route of the trip and consequently his images were inflicted upon me and linger in my brain. It is like a song stuck in your head, you NEED to get it out. 

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Hallo,

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