Film recomendations [long, poss boring post]

[plasticman]

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Tack Hans!

 

Tänkt prova Odenlab på Birger Jarlsagatan eftersom jag bor och jobbar i närheten. Kan inte klaga på Crimsom egentligen - priset innebär ju att de inte anpassar framkallning och kopiering efter varje enskild kunds önskemål, utan bara kör automatiskt. Men ändå tyckte jag att speciellt färgbilderna (och även de svartvita) inte alls var i närheten av den standard som jag minns från tidigare.

Men kanske det inte alls var 'bättre förr'... ;-)

 

Tack igen!

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[StS]

Manni I am sure that you can spare an hour or so to develop your own B&W negs every couple of weeks.................... as for colour or even B&W the film/digital and maybe is a sweet combination

 

 

...plus the 30-60 mins for every single print. At least this is the time it takes for me until I get exposure and grade more or less right. Then one discovers some part of the image could need more exposure than the rest and starts to rip it's form in black paper to mask the rest

 

Another day lost in u-boat illumination

[StS]

Tack Hans!

 

Tänkt prova Odenlab på Birger Jarlsagatan eftersom jag bor och jobbar i närheten. Kan inte klaga på Crimsom egentligen - priset innebär ju att de inte anpassar framkallning och kopiering efter varje enskild kunds önskemål, utan bara kör automatiskt. Men ändå tyckte jag att speciellt färgbilderna (och även de svartvita) inte alls var i närheten av den standard som jag minns från tidigare.

Men kanske det inte alls var 'bättre förr'... ;-)

 

Tack igen!

 

Jag först°ar inte allt

[rob_x2004]

30-60 mins for every single print. At least this is the time it takes for me until I get exposure and grade more or less right.

 

:eek: :eek:

[plasticman]

Jag först°ar inte allt

 

Yep - sorry to slip into swedy there :-)

Essentially a recommendation for a Stockholm lab, so maybe of limited interest to non-swedes, but the discussion remains open on how labs operate nowadays, and in particular i'm interested to know if any of the labs that process film nowadays, print anything other than laser-prints?

 

The irony, as i see it, is that if i delivered a digital file to the lab (as the majority of people probably do now) i could desaturate the file before delivery, and thereby improve my control over the end-result. So actually delivering FILM to a FILM-processing lab gives an inferior result.

 

As far as doing my own processing - yup, in an ideal world this would happen, and i wouldn't be at all stressed by the million other things that need doing or shopping or fixing or feeding...

But i don't live in an ideal world (yet). I'll let you know when i do.

[PeterD]

Try Kodak BW400CN for B&W, it's chromogenic so can be developed by a Pro or a corner dev shop; results are very good and it has a special affinity for polished surfaces, particularly metal. Also Ilford XP2, which produces a deeper black and Fuji's Superia which I haven't used enough times to be definitive about, but which is simialr in characteristics in my limited experience to XP2. I heard a story that it was actaully produced for FUji by Ilford, but have no way of checking.

 

I don't shoot colour except digital so can't offer any more advice except to say that I have seen very good results from Fuji, but colour is VERY MUCH a question of taste as far as film goes. I always used Ektachrome personally.

[plasticman]

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but colour is VERY MUCH a question of taste as far as film goes.

 

Thanks Peter for the film recommendations!

 

As far as color fidelity being a matter of taste - i continue to dispute that contention, in fact. Unlike b&w - which i expect to have it's own character, and to be a unique interpretation' of 'reality', my expectation is that color film should approximate as nearly as possible to 'natural' colors, and not try to artificially boost up the level of saturation that my eye sees, in order to pander to some sort of consumer lust after 'brighter', jollier snaps.

 

Especially so as in this case, where i went to Stockholm's probably foremost professional developing lab.

 

The problem that i was trying to lift in my original posts, was that in addition, the scans of the negatives showed that there was quite a bit more detail and to an extent more color fidelity in the negatives - and that the color settings of the prints were EVEN MORE overdone, thereby negating any purpose in using film instead of digital for detail, color-fidelity and dynamic range.

 

I'm gonna persist in any case - as soon as the torrential rain lets up, i'm gonna take the roll of Portra 160NC to Odenlab (as suggested above by Hans). I'll keep y'all up-to-date with progress...

[plasticman]

OK - the rain let up, so i made it over to Odenlab.

 

Gave them my Portra 160NC; asked them to keep the saturation down as much as possible (the assistant said the machine output was pretty 'color-strong' to translate directly from the Swedish); and they're gonna be medium-sized prints (not even A5) with a low-res web version scan on CD.

Ready on wednesday late afternoon.

 

Just one extra detail so that you guys over in the US can have an embolism about how much everything costs over here in what must be one of the world's most ridiculously expensive countries (remember we're talking totally automated C41 now) - total cost around $53 usd.

 

Yep. Oh well - looks like i AM gonna have to start my own b&w developing after all.

Fifty-three g@ddam dollars to print a standard roll of snaps...

 

Now, i would drown my sorrows in a glass of whisky - but that would just cost me another $15...

[martinb]

Plasticman,

I've sent my rolls to Crimson.se and the they do an amazing job. Highly recommended! They do great scans as well!

[plasticman]

Plasticman,

I've sent my rolls to Crimson.se and the they do an amazing job. Highly recommended! They do great scans as well!

 

Yeah - i'm guessing you didn't see my post above (in swedy) ;-) Crimson was the lab i went to first...

 

I guess everyone's mileage varies in these things - i have no big complaints with Crimson (other than they're a bit random customer-service-wise), but i guess i'd somehow have to take a digital photograph of the prints that i got from them to convince people that the quality wasn't optimal.

 

Now the point i'll re-iterate here is that there doesn't seem to be so much wrong with the negatives - this i can see even from the low-res scan that's done as part of the package from Crimson.

 

So i guess my plan will have to be something like this: just negative processing, and no prints.

 

But the sad thing is, i planned to cut-out all the printing hassle by going back to film.

 

I think this is sad sad sad.

[martinb]

Sorry, I missed that. Prints are usually not very good with too much saturation and contrast.

Try raw copies (råkopior) from Crimson because they are supposed not to be adjusted in any way and that's usually what pro's use for evaluation.

[boilerdoc]

$53!!!!!!!! OMG! invest in a small darkroom setup. You'll save thousands. And the more you print the faster you'll get. That's for B&W of course. Scan your own. Film scanners are CHEAP! Maintain control; that's what it's all about.

Steve

[plasticman]

$53!!!!!!!! OMG! invest in a small darkroom setup. You'll save thousands. And the more you print the faster you'll get. That's for B&W of course. Scan your own. Film scanners are CHEAP! Maintain control; that's what it's all about.

Steve

 

Yep i know - i've been depressed about this all afternoon now, and not really sure what to do about it. I have quite a few photographer acquaintances through work, and i'm considering asking if i can possibly make use of their darkrooms occassionally for b&w (i doubt that'll be wildly popular). I really wish the M6 wasn't such an amazingly beautiful camera to use.

 

Of course i'll find some solution, and someone'll lecture me to make lemonade out of lemons and all that stuff - but the truth is, color film at least just isn't worth shooting anymore. Quite honestly, at this price i could buy an Epson RD-1 after just about 45 rolls of film.

100 rolls (about one year's worth of enthusiastic picture-taking) would get me a you-know-what...

[StS]

I don't shoot colour except digital so can't offer any more advice except to say that I have seen very good results from Fuji, but colour is VERY MUCH a question of taste as far as film goes. I always used Ektachrome personally.

 

I liked Kodachrome until one had to send them to Anchorage, Alaska to get them developed. Very nice black, though.

[StS]

Yep - sorry to slip into swedy there :-)

 

Sorry for showing off the very little Swedish I know

 

I've been taught some by a nice lady selling ice cream in Stockholm. Well, her English was good enough to work for the BBC...

 

Tre kuller glass, tack

[StS]

:eek:

 

Using Multigrade one can even have different grades in one print

 

I guess the effort is smaller to use the zone system...

 

I had to delete one 'eek' - I just learned I'm only allowed to use four smileys max....

[plasticman]

Tre kuller glass, tack

close enough i guess!!

 

Actually - just a last reflection on the film situation for today - i AM actually gonna have to focus on what i want to do with a film camera: film is really b&w.

B&W is what film undoubtedly still (and maybe always) does best - and i should concentrate on that for my M6 use.

 

I'll test some Ektachrome (or whatever else is available these days in transparency film) and have those scanned when necessary.

 

And then otherwise i'll look at the RD-1 or sometime maybe the M8 again.

 

Comments (and more low-saturation) transparency recommendations gratefully received...

[StS]

close enough i guess!!

 

Actually - just a last reflection on the film situation for today - i AM actually gonna have to focus on what i want to do with a film camera: film is really b&w.

B&W is what film undoubtedly still (and maybe always) does best - and i should concentrate on that for my M6 use.

 

I'll test some Ektachrome (or whatever else is available these days in transparency film) and have those scanned when necessary.

 

And then otherwise i'll look at the RD-1 or sometime maybe the M8 again.

 

Comments (and more low-saturation) transparency recommendations gratefully received...

 

Sorry - Kulor

 

It seems to come and go in waves - there was a time when everything I took was black and white. The remainders of the next phase are hundreds of boxes full of slides (admittedly, one can't beat the storage compression of digital images). At the moment I prefer colour prints on film but have discovered b&w for digital.

 

I guess the best is just to do what feels right at that moment...

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[plasticman]

Well - i guess this story has a happy ending!

The good news is that the images and files that i got back from Odenlab were way better than the ones from the first color roll.

The bad news was the price (which i mentioned above).

 

In any case, a combination of Kodak Portra 160NC and also asking the lab to go easy on the saturation gave some really beautiful prints.

 

I think i'll be sticking mainly with B&W for a while in any case - and i've also started looking around for a darkroom that i can maybe hire once a month or so. But it's great to see that the M6 ca produce beautiful color as well as b&w. This, together with the thread on "the death of film" has actually re-inspired me to stick to film for a while longer!

 

Here's one low-res scan of a difficult lighting situation that turned-out well (i thought). The save-for-web colors are obviously a bit off, but then so is everyone's monitor probably.

 

Have a good weekend - we're off to the countryside for the short holiday here in Swedy!

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[Sandokan]

Hi Plasticman

 

I had the same problems as you. I was unhappy with Fuji films and the local processing. Since I moved to Kodak VC (NC in summer), I am happier, but not perfectly happy. I now am happiest with Ektachrome (I will run several more films through before trying kodachrome). I always have the original and I get a CD of the scans from the shop (wiating for the go-ahead from Her, before ordering my own). For B&W I like Kodak 400CN, but my last roll was scanned very dissapointingly.