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Your favorite Leica screw mount lens.

albertwang

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pilot

pilot

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My LTM 35mm Summicron was made in 1959 in Wetzlar and has an E39 filter thread. Some of those early lenses appeared with a special bayonet adapter (which you could remove after loosening a screw) but I don't think mine was one of them. Can't find anything in the history books regarding which ones though.

 

Bryan

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doubice

doubice

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Some of those early lenses appeared with a special bayonet adapter (which you could remove after loosening a screw) but I don't think mine was one of them. Can't find anything in the history books regarding which ones though.

 

Bryan

 

Bryan,

 

If your lens' closest focusing distance is 1 meter, you have a genuine screw mount lens. However - if the closest distance is 70 cm, the lens would have been converted from and M mount.

 

Those converted lenses often also have a red M mount index or a small depression where the index used to be.

 

The main tell-tale sign though, is the difference in the closest focusing distance. This applies to the 2/35mm Summicron, as well as the 2.8/35mm Summaron.

 

All the best,

 

Jan

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doubice

doubice

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Robert,

 

I am sure that something is amiss with the filter threads on the lens or on the filter itself.

 

Did you try mounting other 39mm filters on the lens? When you say that the filter is "loose", what exactly do you mean? Does the filter spin freely in the lens? Does is catch into the threads at all?

 

Cheers,

 

Jan

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Tedlius

Tedlius

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My favourite has to be my 50mm f3.5 Elmar, coated but just a tad earlier than the Red Scale version. I even use it sometimes on my M2, but it seems perfect with my Leica III.

 

Second favourite in my 50mm Summar. It's uncoated, scratch-free and magical.

 

Ted.

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luigi bertolotti

luigi bertolotti

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Damn, JC, You are driving me crazy with these Summicrons... ,65 and ,7 meter IN SCREW MOUNT ? You are by sure an honest guy... can I have some pictures of these lenses ? Have you ever tried to contact someone of the "Famed Historicians" (H in capital...) like Lager/Laney/Van Hasbroek, or directly the Solms Museum ? All the "official" texts say :

 

SM = 1m

BM = 0,65 (M3) or 0,7 (M2)

BM = 1m ----> SM with screw-fixed BM adapter

 

Of course, an expert mechanical can rework a BM lens on a lathe, turning it to a SM, but I cannot imagine the reason... fakes of Leitz lenses do exist, typical from Russia, but not Summicron related, and a fake based onto an original I think nonsense: is true that a Cron 35 SM is worth much more than a BM, but for the 1st type (8 elem.) Wetzlar the gap is not, I think, so significant to justify a well done / costly rework just to increase market value.... I hope this kind of dirty business is limited to the bodies ("gold" leicas based on originals, Leicas 250 based on IIIa... they unsdoubtly are not rare on the market... in this forum one of us posted his story about an incredible offer of a IIIg "Swedish 3 Crown" offered via Internet from Romania at about 200$, seem to remember...)

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wizard

wizard

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Luigi,

 

Leitz produced the first series of the 8-element Summicron 35 in screw mount, but fitted adapter rings to those versions intended to be used with the M3 and M2. I have seen a goggled M3 version of this lens where you could remove the goggles and it had an adapter ring from SM to BM.

 

Thus, I am sure that every lens that has 0.65m or 0.7m as minimal focussing distance was not intended as a SM, but had an adapter ring fitted to be used with either the M3 (0.65m version) or the M2 (0.7m version).

 

Original SM lenses have 1m as the minimal fosussing distance.

 

Regards,

 

Andy

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luigi bertolotti

luigi bertolotti

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Luigi,

 

Leitz produced the first series of the 8-element Summicron 35 in screw mount, but fitted adapter rings to those versions intended to be used with the M3 and M2. I have seen a goggled M3 version of this lens where you could remove the goggles and it had an adapter ring from SM to BM.

 

Thus, I am sure that every lens that has 0.65m or 0.7m as minimal focussing distance was not intended as a SM, but had an adapter ring fitted to be used with either the M3 (0.65m version) or the M2 (0.7m version).

 

Original SM lenses have 1m as the minimal fosussing distance.

 

Regards,

 

Andy

 

Yes, that is right, Andy, but I think that, following logic, the "factory converted" SM lenses ought to be ALL "real" SM, i.e., focus to 1m : the 0,7 - 0,65 focus mounts were DEVELOPED and BUILT for BMs, so I think they all would be "original BMs": JC says his lenses are SM: OK, they could be "converted" from BMs removing the factory mounted adapter (I have a Summaron 35 of this kind), but why they ought to be with 0,7/0,65 focus?

It is in my opinion a nonsense in industrial terms:

- E.Leitz lens dep. has developed the 1m/SM unit

- They have a reserve of parts, tools and so for this unit (times of just-intime manufacturing were far away to come....)

- E. Leitz camera dep. starts to see growing demand of BM bodies and lenses

- Lens dep. answers to this demand with a temporary solution (adapter, 1 small hole to be milled, 1 screw) ) to follow demand and make use of existing parts; in the meantime

- Lens dep. develops a new mount (a pair of, really) for the same lens group, with BM and an extended focusing mount: when ready, tooling done etc, they start to deliver.

- Why hell developing an "half-way" mount with extended focusing but no BM?

 

Sorry for length, as I often say, I like too much to discuss these questions... it remembers me when J Lager answered to my question on why my Telyt 40cm f5 with a s/n of 1941 has a well done coating , that was a process introduced in the '50s...

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jc_braconi

jc_braconi

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Damn, JC, You are driving me crazy with these Summicrons... ,65 and ,7 meter IN SCREW MOUNT ? You are by sure an honest guy... can I have some pictures of these lenses ? Have you ever tried to contact someone of the "Famed Historicians" (H in capital...) like Lager/Laney/Van Hasbroek, or directly the Solms Museum ? All the "official" texts say :

 

SM = 1m

BM = 0,65 (M3) or 0,7 (M2)

BM = 1m ----> SM with screw-fixed BM adapter

 

Of course, an expert mechanical can rework a BM lens on a lathe, turning it to a SM, but I cannot imagine the reason... fakes of Leitz lenses do exist, typical from Russia, but not Summicron related, and a fake based onto an original I think nonsense: is true that a Cron 35 SM is worth much more than a BM, but for the 1st type (8 elem.) Wetzlar the gap is not, I think, so significant to justify a well done / costly rework just to increase market value.... I hope this kind of dirty business is limited to the bodies ("gold" leicas based on originals, Leicas 250 based on IIIa... they unsdoubtly are not rare on the market... in this forum one of us posted his story about an incredible offer of a IIIg "Swedish 3 Crown" offered via Internet from Romania at about 200$, seem to remember...)

Here they are

Summicrons 35 Screw mount

Cheers

JC

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luigi bertolotti

luigi bertolotti

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Here they are

Summicrons 35 Screw mount

Cheers

JC

 

Ouch !!! touchè !!! I do not know if You are a collector but seem to me, having seen often Your name here, that you really know something about Leitz history... If I were You, I'd try to contact someone of the above guys of the "Official Philology Leitz Society" and inform them about these items...

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wizard

wizard

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JC, nice photos, but they are showing the lenses from the wrong side :), at least if we are to determine if these are "genuine" SM lenses.

 

Luigi, I agree with what you said (that it is nonsense to produce the lens in SM, but to use a different lens mount), but this is what they did back then. The goggled M3 8-element Summicron I saw was exactly like this: Goggles (removable), 0.65m minimum focusing distance AND an adapter ring from SM to BM!

 

Actually it may not have needed much to change the mount from 1m to 0.7m and 0.65m, respectively, as they only need to be engraved differently, the part itself is the same and the helicoil can easily accomodate for the relatively small amount of extra rotation it takes to go from 1m to 0.7m/0.65m.

 

Cheers,

 

Andy

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freusen

freusen

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Summaron f2.8/35mm SM from 1960:

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luigi bertolotti

luigi bertolotti

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JC, nice photos, but they are showing the lenses from the wrong side :), at least if we are to determine if these are "genuine" SM lenses.

 

Luigi, I agree with what you said (that it is nonsense to produce the lens in SM, but to use a different lens mount), but this is what they did back then. The goggled M3 8-element Summicron I saw was exactly like this: Goggles (removable), 0.65m minimum focusing distance AND an adapter ring from SM to BM!

 

Actually it may not have needed much to change the mount from 1m to 0.7m and 0.65m, respectively, as they only need to be engraved differently, the part itself is the same and the helicoil can easily accomodate for the relatively small amount of extra rotation it takes to go from 1m to 0.7m/0.65m.

 

Cheers,

 

Andy

 

OK, Andy, I'm KOed : as other times, I did deep speculations that proved inconsistent in front of reality... just for kidding, years ago, when I was so happy to have found a Tele Elmarit 180 2,8 for Visoflex, I mailed to JLager a splendid speculation/hypotetis based on the fact that Leitz produced only 250-300 of those lenses, all went to U.S., and that in the same timeframe Leitz N.Y. modified exactly 275 Visoflexes for coupling them to the N.Y. motor... I envisioned some relation between these two facts... with the numbers SO matching...it seemed inconsistent ... but at least JLager clarifed me about the fact that the contemporary 180 2,8 for Leicaflex was a completely different lens design... the 180 2,8 for Viso "came out from Schneider..." he said.

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wizard

wizard

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Andy,

What side do you want to see ?

 

JC, the side where on a BM lens the red dot would be located (the SM should be visible as well).

 

Frank, very nice piece of equipment. Both the Ig and the Summaron seem to be immaculate. And while the CV 35 finder is not the "original", it fits well and is just so bright.

 

Cheers,

 

Andy

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freusen

freusen

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Frank, very nice piece of equipment. Both the Ig and the Summaron seem to be immaculate. And while the CV 35 finder is not the "original", it fits well and is just so bright.

 

Andy, I have the 35mm "SBLOO" Leitz finder AND the CV 35mm finder, but prefer the CV finder on my Ig because it's very bright and it looks much smaller than the Leitz finder. Another CV finder which I use on my Ig is the 28mm for the f2.8/28mm Ricoh GR lens in SM which came with it's own metal finder but I prefer the CV finders.

 

It's a pity that Leica discontinued the metal finders a long time ago, it would be nice if Leica decides to manufacture the metal finders again. The plastic finders were not bad but using plastic wasn’t a success, as was the (Japanese made) Vario-finder not a success. For wide-angle lenses I prefer accessory finders and have one for every occasion. Frank

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