Summicron 35mm 8 elements serial numbers

[Ivar B]

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I have just bought a Summicron 2/35 8-element in black chrome. Mine has a serial number 2313496, interestingly only 4 numbers apart from the black chrome # 2313492 shown on page 158 in Lager.

 

There seems to be some confusion with respect to serial numbers of the early 35mm Summicrons. In Puts Chronicle, page 134, he lists serial numbers of the first Version (8-element) from 1.630.501 - 2.286.450.

 

This is clearly incorrect as my lens and the one shown in Lager have serial numbers in the 2313xxx region.

 

Puts and also Laney (2nd ed) page 217, reports that the 2nd version 6-element started with serial number 2.316.001, on page 145 in Puts Chronicle (8th ed) the 2nd Version is said to start with serial number 2 307 451. In this publication, the final serial number of Version 1 is given as N/A.

 

Does anybody know the serial number range of the 2/35 first Version?

Edited August 18, 2013 by Ivar B

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[UliWer]

In the "Kleines Fabrikationshandbuch Leica Objektive" 3rd edit 2007 by Thiele you find the following remarks:

 

2.285.351 to 2.286.350 as the last batch for the 8-lens version in chrome from 1968

 

Then:

2.307.001 to 2.307.600 - 7 Lenses (!) from 1968.

 

2.312751 to 2.314.750 - no indication for number of lenses, chrome with and without goggles, 1969

 

2.316.601 to 2.318.500 - no indication for number of lenses, black, 1969

 

2.328.801 to 2.330.800 - same as above

 

The Summicron with 6 lenses starts according to Thiele's list from 2.393.501 in 1970.

 

I don't think Thiele's numbers or his indication of a 7-lens (intermediate?) version, just built for a year or so, is right.

 

On the other hand: Lager's naming several lenses shown at p. 158 (Volume II) as "11307" is strange as well, since the first version had no. 11308 and the 6-lenses version 11309.

 

Looking at the photo and description of 2313492 on p. 158 ("yellow numerals") I see no difference to the 6-lens version.

 

So, Ivar, are you really sure that your example has 8 lenses?

[Ivar B]

The lens in Lager p. 158 looks quite different to the 6-element version. See for example that the focusing handle is not plain as on the 6-element, but it has engravings. Also the aperture ring looks quite different. Furthermore, as I understand Lager, the 2nd Version has no infinity lock, like the first one has. I also have an 8-element in chrome, so I know the lens.

 

My lens looks exactly like Lagers, no surprise since the serial number is only 4 numbers apart so there should be no doubt they are both 8-element (unless we are talking about a 6-element lens in an 8-element "body").

 

Leica Wiki gives this information:

 

2312751 - 2314750 Summicron 3.5 cm 1:2 (M-chrom+black.ELW) 1969 2000

 

So it appears that some black ones were made in 1969 and the serial numbers listed match this.

 

Many thanks, by the way.

Edited August 18, 2013 by Ivar B

[sabears]

I think these 35 summicrons were a sort of a la carte variant.

There were also black paint Summicron 50mm back in the 70's.

Leica 50mm Summicron Black Paint, super rare 1970 '11817' special order lens, serial in the 24xx range.

These were a Very Rare Lenses. Many collectors have never seen or heard of this version.

I believe only a couple dozen were made. Only as a factory Special Order item to go with a Leica M4 Black Paint camera in 1970, someone say for Us-Navy (but I have no evidence of it).

I've only seen two in 35 years and read one article about them in the now out of print Japanese Photographic Magazine 'Camera Style' #15.

 

best wishes.

[Ivar B]

Many thanks for the info, sabears.

 

You may very well be right. I just checked eBay and there were a few black paint lenses with exorbitant prices in the $15 000+ range. For some reason, no black chrome lenses are offered at this point of time, but in general I believe the black paint lenses are more rare.

[ph.]

The Lager numbers (in illustrated guide III 1979) opens up further inconsistencies ad the 35s, On page 16 it is claimed that from 24 61 001 the 6element was issued with a traditional aperture control ring.

 

My 35\2 number 24 61 937 had the aperture ring protruding tab, AND had no filter threads at all.

 

p.