I like film...(open thread)

[Doc Henry]

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Gary , enjoyable heat and sun in the South of France isn't ? 

 

Les Calanques and the Provence coast

the open sea ,  we have 1000 meters deep in some places

 

 

Kodak Portra 160

M7-28 Summicron Asph

 

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Best

Henry

[Bill Livingston]

Michael Hiles:

 

I don't have a sense that this thread denigrates digital photography - rather, it celebrates the unique qualities of film. There are many other threads that welcome, so it seems, a row about film vs. digital. If Doc Henry likes his film and his film Leicas better than his digital cameras, I'm with him. That others may feel differently is excellent to fuel discussion (perhaps more in other threads), and is clearly a damn good thing for Leica Camera AG.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I think almost all of you have completely missed my point.

 

I was simply saying that I think this thread would be better if there was no discussion at all regarding digital or film... I think it detracts from the photographs to have some snide remarks posted at the same time... and suggesting this thread 'doesn't denigrate digital' simply isn't borne out by the many examples of the posts from that one particular member mentioned in my original post.

 

And BTW... I don't feel differently... again, a misread of my post. 

Edited January 17, 2016 by Bill Livingston

[Doc Henry]

This light mist that appears in the late afternoon is beautiful and well rendered by the film

again for Gary who loves the "Midi" ie "la Provence"

He is right

 

... a bit of sunset in film

 

 

Kodak Portra 160

M7-Summicron 28 Asph

 

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Best

Henry

[Trev]

M6ttl  I think with 35mm Zeiss 2.8ZM

Agfa Vista 200

 

Hungry ? by Trevor, on Flickr

[Doc Henry]

For this day of hiking (during four days) , we have to climb up to the pass in front at 2300 m 

Believe me it's very hard but the fresh mountain air encourages us to climb ... 

 

Aravis mountain 3200m

 

Kodak Gold 100

MP-50 Cron

 

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Best

Henry

[Doc Henry]

M6ttl  I think with 35mm Zeiss 2.8ZM

Agfa Vista 200

 

Hungry ? by Trevor, on Flickr

Trev it smells good 

I prefer eat cheese with a organic "baguette à la française" (at left) and a good glass of Saint Emilion

 

Nice picture and color

Best

Henry

Edited January 17, 2016 by Doc Henry

[wattsy]

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The sun stays low in the sky in December, even around midday.

T-max 100.

 

[lleo]

Yeah, James's pic really good. And others too.

Doc, if you were with me this morning, lol. Little OT, or not?! I went to the bar for a coffee and I had the camera with me. I left it on a table and was waiting for the coffee when a guy came in, went to have a seat and saw the bag. Asked "who's the owner of this piece of art?" Lmao.

Then we started talking. It's curious the fact he took several pics of balloons a few time ago, but with digital.

Anyway the first thing was about the camera and the cameras he has. Second thing was, sorry Bill, how better the analog is over digital. Lol again.

Anyways I think it's normal. It's comparing, not wanting to put anything down. It's in the human nature: you see two things and in the end you compare them, there's nothing wrong. Expecially on the fact that probably everybody here has both "analog" and digital cameras.

Yes, maybe being "politically correct" (which I'm usually not) saying "I prefer film over file", but it'd be wanting to supply reality under a different dress.

So to me, just enjoy the thread and, last but not least, get a M... what model you wanted to buy? So you can compare them both and make us all enjoy your thoughts.

Cheers

[Doc Henry]

The sun stays low in the sky in December, even around midday.

T-max 100.

 

Yes Ian nice shot as I love

Nice "contre-jour" as said Adam

Best

Henry

Edited January 17, 2016 by Doc Henry

[Doc Henry]

Yeah, James's pic really good. And others too.

Doc, if you were with me this morning, lol. Little OT, or not?! I went to the bar for a coffee and I had the camera with me. I left it on a table and was waiting for the coffee when a guy came in, went to have a seat and saw the bag. Asked "who's the owner of this piece of art?" Lmao.

Then we started talking. It's curious the fact he took several pics of balloons a few time ago, but with digital.

Anyway the first thing was about the camera and the cameras he has. Second thing was, sorry Bill, how better the analog is over digital. Lol again.

Anyways I think it's normal. It's comparing, not wanting to put anything down. It's in the human nature: you see two things and in the end you compare them, there's nothing wrong. Expecially on the fact that probably everybody here has both "analog" and digital cameras.

Yes, maybe being "politically correct" (which I'm usually not) saying "I prefer film over file", but it'd be wanting to supply reality under a different dress.

So to me, just enjoy the thread and, last but not least, get a M... what model you wanted to buy? So you can compare them both and make us all enjoy your thoughts.

Cheers

Ileo thank you, words of wisdom 

Between you and I , we know that film is better 

but the future is video and images taken with a smartphone

It's unfortunate but it is like that.Everything must be do quickly !

People have not even  time to live  !

 

Best

Henry

[Guest JMF]

Now and then !

 

Dissecting a M3 by JM__, on Flickr

 

Dissecting a M3 by JM__, on Flickr

 

Dissecting a M3 by JM__, on Flickr

 

Shot on Portra 160 , M6 0.85 + 35 FLE

[wattsy]

Nice looking M3.   Is it original back paint?

[Doc Henry]

Hi Adam, Ektar 100 seems also good for chruch

not only for NYC building and sunset 

look at this picture

 

 

Eglise Sainte Geneviève

Paris

 

M7-28 Cron A.

 

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Best

Henry

[Doc Henry]

Now and then !

 

Dissecting a M3 by JM__, on Flickr

 

Dissecting a M3 by JM__, on Flickr

 

Dissecting a M3 by JM__, on Flickr

 

Shot on Portra 160 , M6 0.85 + 35 FLE

Really impressive pictures

a piece of jewellery

Very nice JM

Best

Henry

These pictures must inspire RP

Edited January 17, 2016 by Doc Henry

[A miller]

 

btw: I was curious about the claim that a digital M's rangefinder would be more prone to needing adjustment after a minor drop than a film M. I can't see how that's possible ... the rangefinder mechanism is just about identical between them. Perhaps the out of adjustment behavior is just a wee bit more noticeable with a digital capture than with a film capture, rather than actually being greater or less? No matter, however. As you can see from the above photo, ultimate sharpness isn't always my highest priority ... 

 

 

I am no Leica engineer.  However, I am passing along information that I learned FIRST HAND from the head of the Leica USA service, on one of my almost monthly early morning visits there to have my Monochrom RF adjusted during my one-year ownership period of the camera in 2014.   Bill Weiser (the head of Leica USA service) explained to me that the reason for this is that the pixelated 2D nature of the highly sensitive digital sensor allows for VERY little room for RF misalignment in order to maintain tolerable shifts in focusing point. I can't remember the exact amount of tolerance but it was something crazy like 1/500 of a millimeter.  This is particularly noticeable when shooting a lens wide open.  With a digital sensor, the DOF will much more abruptly fall off compared to film, which has a much smoother transition of in focus to out of focus due to the 3D nature of the film (this s why the rangefinder scale on the Leica lenses is not accurate for use on digital cameras and is at least one stop off, maybe more depending on the aperture used).    This effect is particularly acute with the Monochroms, which are by definition extra sharp and clinical due to their only black and white pixels.  This sensitivity really plagued me with my Monochrom.  I wasn't really rough with it, but I did use it on a daily basis quite heavily, and it did get shuffled around in my car quite a bit and come in contact with things in a relatively mild fashion.  As a monthly ritual, I would affirm my RF alignment by shooting my 75mm summilux wide open (which has essentially the same DOF as the noctilux wide open).  And about every other month, I would find that focus point was not in tack sharp focus, and off I would go at 6am to Leica USA for a complimentary adjustment.  With a film Ms treated in the same manner (shuffled in the car, kissing each people on the street while swinging from a shoulder strap, etc), the RF mechanism may indeed suffer from the same degree of minimal misalignment, but the user may not ever notice it due to the special properties of film.  

 

I haven't taken any of my film Ms to be adjusted at all and if anything I have treated them in a more rugged fashion.

 

What I have said above is a fact and is not mere conjecture.  I found it quite enlightening and it was one of the reasons why I sold all my digital cameras and switched only to film.

 

Note to Bill Livingston - I find the above remarks highly relevant to this thread and the way it ebbs and flows.  This type of topic will inevitably come up as part of the overall discussion.  Trying to censure a discussion or commentary on digital vs film is really going overboard.  The topic is not political, not a personal offense on any person and not otherwise of a type that is prohibited according to the laws of this discussion forum.  And you are not even an active contributor to this thread.  So you are really coming from nowhere (and that wasn't a crack at being from Cambridge) and trying to control the content of this thread, which Henry after all started and really treats as a baby.  That is pretty pompous in my view, and that is coming from a New Yorker who is Trump supporter.    Once you get around to finally getting the needed impulse from this thread and/or others to get yourself a film camera and get shareable images, I'm sure we'd all be happy to welcome you with open arms to this thread.  

Edited January 17, 2016 by A miller

[Keith (M)]

On the boardwalk.  1957 IIIg, 1951 5cm Summicron Collapsible, Acros 100, Rodinal.

 

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[wattsy]

I can't remember the exact amount of tolerance but it was something crazy like 500 millimeters.

 

 

Now that would be crazy. 500mm, even in NYC, is nearly 2ft!

[Guest JMF]

Nice looking M3.   Is it original back paint?

 

 

Thx, a repainted one !

[A miller]

Now that would be crazy. 500mm, even in NYC, is nearly 2ft!

 

yes, ha ha, I meant 1/500th of a MM.  

Too early in the morning to be talking numbers, I guess... 

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[ramarren]

... Bill Weiser (the head of Leica USA service) explained to me that the reason for this is that the pixelated 2D nature of the highly sensitive digital sensor allows for VERY little room for RF misalignment in order to maintain tolerable shifts in focusing point. I can't remember the exact amount of tolerance but it was something crazy like 1/500 of a millimeter.  This is particularly noticeable when shooting a lens wide open.  ...   As a monthly ritual, I would affirm my RF alignment by shooting my 75mm summilux wide open (which has essentially the same DOF as the noctilux wide open).  And about every other month, I would find that focus point was not in tack sharp focus, and off I would go at 6am to Leica USA for a complimentary adjustment.  ...  

 

 

So it is exactly as I suspected. "Perhaps the out of adjustment behavior is just a wee bit more noticeable with a digital capture than with a film capture, rather than actually being greater or less?"  It comes down to what you consider to be "tolerable shifts in focus point", a judgement call. 

 

I'm sure that if I measured them, side by side, I'd see the same shifts in focus on both film and digital versions of the cameras. Unlike some, I guess I tolerate a bit of non-critical focus. I don't test my cameras every month—I just make photographs. And when I see something get out of whack to the point where I am not getting what I want, I have it taken care of. 

 

My film cameras (because they are old) have required much more service than my digital cameras (because they are young) and the film cameras don't produce results that are as critically sharp or as consistent. However, I'm very happy with what both produce and wouldn't give up either: Each medium has its own look and feel, which is something to exploit in making expressive photographs. And, as I said, "ultimate sharpness isn't always my highest priority."