k-hawinkler Posted February 12, 2013 Share #1 Posted February 12, 2013 Advertisement (gone after registration) I am having trouble with the bluebirds. They look rather inconspicuous when I look at them directly with my eyes. However, as soon as I look through a live view EVF, the blue color of the birds flashes up. That is also reflected in their images, for example here: Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! In the last image the birds were partially obscured at the lower left corner. Here are my questions: What is causing this effect? How can I correct for it in post processing? Thanks for your help. Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! In the last image the birds were partially obscured at the lower left corner. Here are my questions: What is causing this effect? How can I correct for it in post processing? Thanks for your help. ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/198133-bluebird-blues/?do=findComment&comment=2240885'>More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted February 12, 2013 Posted February 12, 2013 Hi k-hawinkler, Take a look here Bluebird Blues. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
kdriceman Posted February 13, 2013 Share #2 Posted February 13, 2013 Hi KH, Not sure what's causing it. I suppose the profile you are using in the raw convertor is struggling to accurately replicate the bluebird blue. I know I'm not always happy with the initial color the Nex 7 default profile in LR delivers. I assume you're using LR. I am not a digital post processing expert, but I manage to get around LR and PS well enough to get by. Have you tried adjusting the blue luminance and saturation sliders in LR? It seems to me that would help take the edge off the blues here. KR Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
k-hawinkler Posted February 13, 2013 Author Share #3 Posted February 13, 2013 Hi KH, Not sure what's causing it. I suppose the profile you are using in the raw convertor is struggling to accurately replicate the bluebird blue. I know I'm not always happy with the initial color the Nex 7 default profile in LR delivers. I assume you're using LR. I am not a digital post processing expert, but I manage to get around LR and PS well enough to get by. Have you tried adjusting the blue luminance and saturation sliders in LR? It seems to me that would help take the edge off the blues here. KR Hi KR, Many thanks for the feedback. The OOC JPGs are already affected. No LR involved. I first noticed it when looking at the birds with the naked eye and then through the EVF. In the EVF there suddenly was this shockingly vivid blue. My first reaction was my camera must be broken! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdriceman Posted February 13, 2013 Share #4 Posted February 13, 2013 Hi KR, Many thanks for the feedback. The OOC JPGs are already affected. No LR involved. I first noticed it when looking at the birds with the naked eye and then through the EVF. In the EVF there suddenly was this shockingly vivid blue. My first reaction was my camera must be broken! I see. It must be in the way the Nex is processing the jpeg. Are you using one of the scene modes on the Nex? What does a raw file look like when imported into LR? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your Old Dog Posted February 13, 2013 Share #5 Posted February 13, 2013 I presume you know they are iridescent? They are a bit like humming birds to me. In bright sunlight they damn near glow royal blue! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
k-hawinkler Posted February 13, 2013 Author Share #6 Posted February 13, 2013 I presume you know they are iridescent? They are a bit like humming birds to me. In bright sunlight they damn near glow royal blue! Hi Ray, Many thanks. They really glow in the EVF, but didn't to my naked eye. That's what puzzles me. I have taken pictures of quite a few hummingbirds, never had a problem though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeTexas Posted February 13, 2013 Share #7 Posted February 13, 2013 Advertisement (gone after registration) I had quite a problem with Blue Jays when shooting with the M8 and the 135mm Elmarit. Blue Jays at sunrise by ffacker, on Flickr Some of my problem was sun reflection, but the blue was also very strange. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
k-hawinkler Posted February 14, 2013 Author Share #8 Posted February 14, 2013 Thanks. Around here Blue Jays look a bit different, like this. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Sony NEX-7 + Novoflex NEX/LER Adapter + Leica Vario-Elmar-R 1:4/80-200 I didn't quite manage to get the focus on the eye, but the blue colors seem fine to me. So far the Bluebird images are the only ones that have the problem. Just a thought, in the Bluebird images can the blue channel get overwhelmed? Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Sony NEX-7 + Novoflex NEX/LER Adapter + Leica Vario-Elmar-R 1:4/80-200 I didn't quite manage to get the focus on the eye, but the blue colors seem fine to me. So far the Bluebird images are the only ones that have the problem. Just a thought, in the Bluebird images can the blue channel get overwhelmed? ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/198133-bluebird-blues/?do=findComment&comment=2242736'>More sharing options...
jankap Posted February 14, 2013 Share #9 Posted February 14, 2013 Could it be a problem with the color space? If the sensor delivers a color, that does not fit into the chosen color space, something must be done. Jan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
k-hawinkler Posted February 14, 2013 Author Share #10 Posted February 14, 2013 Could it be a problem with the color space?If the sensor delivers a color, that does not fit into the chosen color space, something must be done. Jan Hi Jan, Thanks. What do you have in mind? How would I go about that? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jankap Posted February 14, 2013 Share #11 Posted February 14, 2013 The used camera was your Sony and the color space sRGB. My Ricoh also has the possibility AdobeRGB. There is another one still, ProPhoto. Please ask the Blubirds to pose another time in front of the Sony. Perhaps you compare with your M9. The 3 colors of the señor (R, 2G, must fit into the color space This is done by the camera software. I think, there is a kind of a database (color lookup table) to move the colors into the space. All colors must be treated in some way, not only the ones, that do not fit. Jan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdriceman Posted February 14, 2013 Share #12 Posted February 14, 2013 KH, Do you have the raw file? If so, you can change the color space, modify the color channels, etc... And perhaps get to the bottom of it and fix the color. KR Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
adan Posted February 15, 2013 Share #13 Posted February 15, 2013 I've found it is common for "canned" camera profiles (as created by Adobe/Apple/etc. for raw pictures, and by the camera makers for jpegs) to overcook the blue/yellow saturation. In building my own raw camera profiles, I always end up dialing down the blue-primary saturation by 35-50 units over what Adobe or the camera makers provide as a default. Of course, that only works for raw images. For jpegs: Photoshop's Hue/Saturation/Lightness dialogue allows reducing, for example, "radioactive" blues, if one selects for blues and then reduces both saturation and brightness. Personally I prefer the PS tool called "Selective Color" - in which one can add "ink" of the subtractive primary colors (cyan, magenta, yellow, black) to certain colors selectively. It has the advantage (IMHO) over the HSL dialogue of also allowing adjustment of grays, blacks and whites, as well as allowing "subtractive" desaturation with one slider (darker and less saturated - just add black "ink" to the blues alone), which takes two adjustments in HSL. In both, one can also shift hues selectively to, for example, make blues more magenta or more cyan, if appropriate. I don't know if the simpler Lightroom/Aperture programs have analogous controls. I reworked one of these images in about 10 seconds using Photoshop's HSL controls to reduce lightness and saturation of only the bluebird "blues" - I can't guess if this "accurate" or what you are looking for. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/198133-bluebird-blues/?do=findComment&comment=2243491'>More sharing options...
tobey bilek Posted February 15, 2013 Share #14 Posted February 15, 2013 Blue Jays and Blues bird are two different species. Jays are mean and would never share water. If the colors are off, desaturate the particular color in photoshop or ACR . All colors do not reproduce perfectly with any camera. Leica seems to "jack up" blues asd greens for a distinctive look. I would rather they left it alone like Nikon. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jankap Posted February 17, 2013 Share #15 Posted February 17, 2013 I've found it is common for "canned" camera profiles (as created by Adobe/Apple/etc. for raw pictures, and by the camera makers for jpegs) to overcook the blue/yellow saturation. In building my own raw camera profiles, I always end up dialing down the blue-primary saturation by 35-50 units over what Adobe or the camera makers provide as a default. Of course, that only works for raw images. Could you give us an example of a self cooked camera profile? Are they lens dependent? Photoshop is my software base too. Look, afterwards and picture dependent one can correct very much. And for my pictures I seldom do something with the colors. Jan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
adan Posted February 19, 2013 Share #16 Posted February 19, 2013 Could you give us an example of a self cooked camera profile?Are they lens dependent? Here's my most recent profile (I redo them whenever anything about the camera changes - in this case upgrading to new firmware) As to "lens dependent" - a good question. I'd expect so, if one is using lenses with markedly different color transmission characterisitics. I use mostly Mandler-era 1980's lens designs, and they all seem to work well with one profile - while I've never gotten color I liked, with any profile, from some modern Solms lenses (28 Summicron/Elmarits being the ones that stick in my mind). Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/198133-bluebird-blues/?do=findComment&comment=2247067'>More sharing options...
tobey bilek Posted June 20, 2013 Share #17 Posted June 20, 2013 Second that. The profile editor is your best friend. You can preferences in raw to have certain profiles come up based on camera serial #. Make any small adjustments you want and save as new camera raw default. Processing time will go down 90% and look better. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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