Skippy Sanchez Posted February 22, 2007 Share #1 Â Posted February 22, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hi all- Did I read somewhere that one should NOT use the auto-off function? I understand that if you want to drain the battery overnight, auto-off needs to be disabled (obviously), but is there an issue otherwise to keeping it active? Â These things go through batteries pretty quickly, and sometimes I might leave one turned on inadvertantly for hours, like when switching back and forth bewtween cameras or assignments. I think battery life is a considerable weak point -- if one is using it as a daily photojournalism workhorse -- in an otherwise outstanding camera. Â just wondering- -skippy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveP Posted February 22, 2007 Share #2 Â Posted February 22, 2007 Why would anyone want to drain the battery? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted February 22, 2007 Share #3 Â Posted February 22, 2007 To do a full reset of the calibration of the battery level. I cannot think off many reasons to disable the auto-off in normal use. Unless on expects to miss a shot when waiting for the camera to switch on, or is afraid of the "beam-me-up-Scotty" effect through pressing the shutter too fast during switch-on. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveP Posted February 22, 2007 Share #4 Â Posted February 22, 2007 From what I read about LI batteries, deep discharge is to be avoided if you want to prolong battery life. No doubt the camera circuitry actually cuts out above that level to prevent killing the cell. All the same, it seems the best way to keep LI batteries happy is keep them cool and partly charged. And remember - they have a finite life whether used or not. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammam Posted February 22, 2007 Share #5  Posted February 22, 2007 From what I read about LI batteries, deep discharge is to be avoided if you want to prolong battery life. No doubt the camera circuitry actually cuts out above that level to prevent killing the cell. All the same, it seems the best way to keep LI batteries happy is keep them cool and partly charged. And remember - they have a finite life whether used or not.  I don't know if you can refer to this as «deep discharge» but the manual says (p. 82):  « A new battery only reaches its full capacity after it has been fully charged and – by use in the camera – discharged 2 or 3 times. This discharge procedure should be repeated every 25 cycles...»  I guess leaving the camera on all night with the auto-off function off can be considered «by use in the camera.» Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveP Posted February 23, 2007 Share #6 Â Posted February 23, 2007 Most of the websites regarding the care of LI batteries say something to the effect of "If you see a sticker or warning that it will take several charge/discharge cycles to reach full capacity, it is probably a holdover from a previous battery type. " (and wrong) Allegedly, LI batteries achieve their full charge (depending on charger, of course) on their first-ever charge and inexorably deteriorate from there on in. But old habits die hard. Â I have two batteries for my M8, and my intent is to charge 'em early and often, never discharge them more than I have to and keep them cool. In a year or so, I will buy new batteries. Hopefully by that time third party sources will be tooled up. Why is it that third party batteries (and chargers) are almost always better than camera manufacturers' solutions? (I know, I know...) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammam Posted February 23, 2007 Share #7 Â Posted February 23, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) For some unexplainable reason, I tend to trust the manual Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
barjohn Posted February 23, 2007 Share #8 Â Posted February 23, 2007 I'm not sure I would trust the manual on LiOn batteries as it is counter to what every battery manufacturer says. I think I have found another software bug. The AUTO OFF FUNCTION DOES NOT WORK. If you leave your camera on with the auto off set to 5 minutes, and you leave it on over night the battery will be dead. So much for AUTO OFF. DONOT depend on this feature. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted February 23, 2007 Share #9 Â Posted February 23, 2007 This is really quite understandable, as it goes into stand-by in order to enable a faster start-up. That will always cause a trickle drain, as opposed to complete switch-off.So if your battery was pretty empty, it may well drain completely overnight. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
barjohn Posted February 23, 2007 Share #10 Â Posted February 23, 2007 My battery was fully charged so it is not understandable. Standby should use minimal current, just enough to detect a button bing pushed and no more. It should power all circuits back up within milliseconds and with no hard drive to spin up and no saved state to restore it should be be ready to go. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted February 23, 2007 Share #11 Â Posted February 23, 2007 In that case - firmware 1..11? i never noticed it on my cameras though Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidmires Posted February 23, 2007 Share #12 Â Posted February 23, 2007 ..."beam-me-up-Scotty" effect... LOL Â Â My auto off function works fine. If your camera is in a bag with the switch turned on, or something else is depressing the shutter release slightly, it won't work at all... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riley Posted February 23, 2007 Share #13 Â Posted February 23, 2007 havnt lock-ups been associated with auto-off ? forgive me if Im wrong then there was the issue of hitting the shutter too soon after the camera went to sleep Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
barjohn Posted February 23, 2007 Share #14 Â Posted February 23, 2007 In my case it was sitting on my desk, nothing else was touching it (well maybe ghosts). It has happened before and I didn't think about the fact that i had it set to Auto-Off in 5 minutes. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveP Posted February 23, 2007 Share #15 Â Posted February 23, 2007 Considering the variation of best practices among Leica experts and the variance from factory gospel (which varies over time) coupled with the late arrival of Leica into the electronic age, I will bet my GBP55 (US$100?) LI battery money on the battery experts. Â One oddity about the five minute auto-off (as mentioned previously in another thread) is that while the LCD goes off, its backlight stays on unless you touch the shutter release. I can leave my M8 on Standby for days without a problem but I'm sure it would last even longer if the backlight went off more promptly. Supposed to be fixed in some upcoming firmware revision. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrc Posted February 23, 2007 Share #16 Â Posted February 23, 2007 One thing that should be clarified here (I think) is that we're talking about three different things -- (1) a software bug, (2) a battery conditioning procedure, and (3) auto-off use. Â As I understand it, we're not leaving the battery on overnight to condition the battery, but to reset the software that measures battery life. Perhaps draining the battery overnight will cause it to have less long-term usability -- or it may no have effect at all on the battery, depending upon whom you believe -- but that's better than having loss of camera function. Â And (3) we're also not talking about permanently turning off the auto-off function. Just turn it off overnight to drain the battery -- to reset the software -- and then turn it back on the next day. Â JC Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted February 23, 2007 Share #17 Â Posted February 23, 2007 Thank you John and well said . It is a software bug we are trying to reset in the camera and the reason to let the camera die completely so the battery level will read correctly on the camera. This info came straight from Germany to my e-mail box on this issue, it will be fixed in 1.1 Â The manual mentions the discharging of the batteries 3 times to cycle it hem correctly , the Dmr also recommended this. Pick your poision do it it or don't i did and my DMR batteries have never failed me in 1.5 years . I do just condition them once in awhile but mostly top them off. Â The auto disable was mentioned for the first part of the reset of the camera. Normal i set mine for 10 minutes to go to sleep, mine seems to work fine like this Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveP Posted February 23, 2007 Share #18 Â Posted February 23, 2007 As I understood form the third-party sources, the battery "life" indicator was just that - an indicator. And internal to the battery itself. So the benefit of discharging the battery fully is that the indicator's "message" is reset to be more accurate (in the event it is not) but this does not mean you would have more usage (AFAIK) from that battery - simply that the little LCD readout would be more accurate. Time will tell. If you have seen the parallel thread regarding the internal construction n of the charger, you will be very, very afraid :-) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted February 23, 2007 Share #19 Â Posted February 23, 2007 Yes that is the probelm is the indicator is giving a false reading, it may say full battery but in fact the battery could be half charged and the fix is really to reset the camera because of this bug in the firmware.They only way to do that is completely make the camera go dead with draining the battery and camera to a dead state than basically rebooting it with a fresh battery. BTW this has been fixed:) Â Now the other issue about cycling your batteries is a debatable one that has been around for awhile. I agree and disagree so I do float on that issue i top them off all the time but i also run them down to the ground just shooting so in effect there recycling them there. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveP Posted February 25, 2007 Share #20 Â Posted February 25, 2007 Good reference - Getting Great Battery Life Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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