Westlich Auction is closing

[luigi bertolotti]

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I don't think Leica prices will keep pace with inflation: I recall the going price of a rim set compur B was around $US 9000 in 1985 which is quite a lot more than it is now.

David

 

That's true... the price's evolution of collectors' items has followed mixed paths in the last 10-20 years : I do not keep massive tracking of auctions prices, dealers' lists etc... but have a decent record of some prices from '90 about :

- Several items from the LTM era have, in real prices, dropped in value (Compur is an example, but 250 too, even the "Montè en Sarre", I have records of over 1200US$ for IIIF RD+ST in year 2000,...)

- Same applies to SLR classics like SL/SL2 and to "normal" SLR lenses (which indeed had to be reagarded as "user" at that times)

- LTM lenses have decently kept their value... but not increased.

- While some BM lenses (Noctilux, Summilux 75...) have indeed arisen (June 2000 : Noctlux f1 + box hood caps : 2000 US$)

 

Without, repeat, pretending to be a very trustable source, my general impression is that the M8/M9 success has sustained the value of "usable classics", whilst the traditional LTM collecting has became, in part, "out of fashion"... this of course, doesn't apply to the SUPER collectibles (Elmax/Anastigmat, M3 black and similar) which are a story of their own, mostly tied to "one shot" auctions: I'd bet that if one had tracked the mean value of "5 top prices of the year" , it would result a steady grown in the last 10 years.

[jc_braconi]

- While some BM lenses (Noctilux, Summilux 75...) have indeed arisen (June 2000 : Noctlux f1 + box hood caps : 2000 US$)

 

Without, repeat, pretending to be a very trustable source, my general impression is that the M8/M9 success has sustained the value of "usable classics", whilst the traditional LTM collecting has became, in part, "out of fashion"... this of course, .

With the succes of the M8/9 and/but with the highest prices of new lenses, the M8/9 users are seeking for good used "old" lenses.

I survey on the web for the last 10 years : prices are multiplicated by 3 for the M lenses which are 20-25 years old.

[joeswe]

But Germans are different. The German collective subconscious is dominated by the Inflation Monster. This ogre does always lurk under the bed, no matter the actual economic situation. Fear of the Inflation Monster does lie behind much of the German government's political stance in the present euro crisis, for instance. So many Germans distrust the euro and my feeling is that collector items, along with gold, are seen as a hedge against an imagined currency crash. Checked the gold price lately? The art market?

 

Interesting speculation here, but you ignore the fact that the typical buyers in these auctions are not Germans. A substantial part (think: 70-80%) of the items sold in these auctions go to collectors in the Far East. I recently talked to a person who is very familiar with the Leica auction business and he confirmed to me that without the Asian buyers the collector's market in all it's present glory would be more or less non-existant.

[luigi bertolotti]

Interesting speculation here... ... without the Asian buyers the collector's market in all it's present glory would be more or less non-existant.

 

With the specification "in all its present glory" (referred to some insanely high prices we saw in recent auctions) I can agree : but I think that the Leica collectors market will endure regardless the current money flow from "new riches" in search of some precious antiquites to put their money into : the Leitz system has such an impressive consistency spanned for almost a century, so quality-focused and widely spread around ONE camera / ONE concept, that it cannot not to fascinate people who like a certain kind of collectibles (of course, not everyone feels such a mood, or the collecting sentiment in general) : I continue to be proud of my modest series of 7 different Elmars 90... ... still looks with patience for a Summaron 3,5 I miss... ... and I'm surely not the one to think that a series of 20 (or so) fine viewfinders is more interesting to put ensemble with patience than a single (super rare, indeed) body that is auctioned at 20x their cost...

[sabears]

Interesting speculation here, but you ignore the fact that the typical buyers in these auctions are not Germans. A substantial part (think: 70-80%) of the items sold in these auctions go to collectors in the Far East. I recently talked to a person who is very familiar with the Leica auction business and he confirmed to me that without the Asian buyers the collector's market in all it's present glory would be more or less non-existant.

 

That's true BUT it's not the whole truth.

I'm inside the market, I know in person four between the highest bidder in the last auctions...all of European origin, and I know only by reputation that famous rock idol, exceptional guitarist, Leica collector...

That said, we also know for ex. the famous (Asian) businessman, the owner of a large high tech company.

 

Cheers.