Red Dot Fever Posted August 31, 2011 Share #81 Posted August 31, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) Sheesh- it is just two little globs of paint. They should not be there I fully agree and I would not accept it just like Mark. But to regard it as a major error:rolleyes: it does not make one darn difference to the quality of the lens. jaapv it is a major error, you need to think of the resale value of the lens also. If you had the choice of that lens and a flawless looking lens that both worked identical and they were the same price, which lens would you choose? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 Hi Red Dot Fever, Take a look here Leica's Quality Control Continues to Disappoint. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
k-hawinkler Posted August 31, 2011 Share #82 Posted August 31, 2011 Michael, It's an interesting reading De Bello Gallico I - Caesar's Gallic Wars Book I - De Bello Gallico Book I in Latin. We read it at school and had to memorize the beginning - as probably most students of Latin had to. K-H. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronan Posted August 31, 2011 Share #83 Posted August 31, 2011 What is your example? Sang Bought a brand new 50mm and it wasn't focusing properly. It was sent back to get adjusted. I didn't pay anything but didn't see the lens i JUST paid for 4 weeks... Durring that time i purchased a 40mm 1.4 from Voigtlaender. Works perfectly. My ex colleague bought a M8.2 used and a brand new lens (i think 35mm). M8.2 worked great (it originally had an issue the original owner had to send it back for). His lens was wobbly (after a weekend of shooting, i was there, it suddenly got wobbly, like parts weren't tighten properly or something), sent back to Leica. He saw it again after 5 weeks, the dealer said it was tighten and adjusted because of focusing issue. Bought 2 Voigtlaender lenses (the 40 1.4 and 75 1.8), never had an issue with them, cost me a small percentage of my Leica glass... Makes you wonder sometimes Edit: Before i get jumped on, i LOVE Leica lenses, they are superb. But the QC is very shoddy at times. It REALLY makes you wonder sometimes... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dutch Posted August 31, 2011 Share #84 Posted August 31, 2011 If you had the choice of that lens and a flawless looking lens that both worked identical and they were the same price, which lens would you choose? Honestly? Either one would be fine for me. Those who perceive their Leicas as- collectibles - jewelery - tools I know my place. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
marknorton Posted August 31, 2011 Author Share #85 Posted August 31, 2011 Took the lens in to Leica Mayfair this morning and they were much more on the ball than last time. The lens is going back to Solms to be fixed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted August 31, 2011 Share #86 Posted August 31, 2011 QED, post bellorum flamma... Really an interesting thread, seeing the differences in attitude people have toward the product. Thanks for the thread, Mark! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
plasticman Posted August 31, 2011 Share #87 Posted August 31, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) QED, post bellorum flamma... Really an interesting thread, seeing the differences in attitude people have toward the product. Thanks for the thread, Mark! I think the thread was full of misunderstandings and cross-purposes*. For instance, I felt the 'fault' was trivial (although I probably wouldn't tolerate it on a new lens, myself), but I was irritated by the relative inconsequence of the fault itself being used to trivialize the wider discussion of quality control (if you follow me). *So in this respect it was a typical internet debate. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
adan Posted August 31, 2011 Share #88 Posted August 31, 2011 Gray areas, people, gray areas. Was smudged paint sloppy? Sure. Was it is the same category as a gouge in the front element or a frozen focus ring? No. Should all three have been caught on final inspection? Yep. Would I have found this lens "acceptable" if I'd had a shoot that afternoon that required a 50mm f/1.4? You bet! (at least until the shoot was over.) Personally, I'd ask Leica if they would give me the "QM4" discount (obvious cosmetic defect) and refund the price difference - if they would, I'd probably take the lens "as is" and discounted rather than wait for a replacement or repair. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
marknorton Posted August 31, 2011 Author Share #89 Posted August 31, 2011 Andy, I understand your point but as I already have lots of other M lenses to work with - including the black version of this lens - and since this is specifically to be paired with a chrome M9-P body which I am still waiting for, I am happy to wait while it is being repaired. The person I spoke to estimated 4 weeks. We'll see. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 31, 2011 Share #90 Posted August 31, 2011 Andy, I understand your point but as I already have lots of other M lenses to work with - including the black version of this lens - and since this is specifically to be paired with a chrome M9-P body which I am still waiting for, I am happy to wait while it is being repaired. The person I spoke to estimated 4 weeks. We'll see. Hi Mark I have had a couple of minor issues and a lady called Lynda Silverton at Mayfair has sorted them out. She always gets back you and confirms by email. Brian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnloumiles Posted September 1, 2011 Share #91 Posted September 1, 2011 I know this was briefly touched on but wouldn't the most sensible explanation be that the paint was not fully dry before packing? Obviously still a mistake but not to the point of someone doing shoddy work. I cannot forsee the position where a lens went into the box like that without someone noticing. That said I think a new lens should be procured for the customer immediately, either for loan or replacement. I would ask for nothing less. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
marknorton Posted September 1, 2011 Author Share #92 Posted September 1, 2011 Impossible to know; only Leica knows the time between the engraiving being filled and the part being used to assemble a lens but I would have thought it was long enough to ensure the paint is dry; it's possible this part had already been reworked and the paint had not hardened. I feel certain though it went in the box like that. The person I spoke to told me he had seen the problem only once before - on an M7 shutter dial. As for a replacement lens, he spoke to someone about the UK inventory. A 50mm Summilux? In Chrome? By any chance? Much hilarity... it's clearly as rare as the proverbial hens' teeth and hats off to Ivor at Red Dot for finding me one in the first place. It is actually a wonderful lens, the extra weight balances the camera very well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Fluff Posted September 1, 2011 Share #93 Posted September 1, 2011 Sheesh- it is just two little globs of paint. This unfortunately does not sit well with the timing of the recent release of the video "Leica Lenses: A Synonym For Quality" Leica Camera AG - Home Their whole point seems to be that meticulous care is taken in assembly - which clearly wasn't the case here. If they're going to talk the talk, they need to walk the walk. One does wonder if it's a function of it being Leica's most in-demand lens and them cranking them out as fast as they can that meaning the supposed attention to detail is actually not quite all they'd have us believe. Perhaps a truer picture is one of a very over-stretched factory, with workers doing their best but with unrealistic targets to meet. Also, I'd see it as a minor issue if it was a blob on a Canon lens - as that would simply entail a quick trip back to the shop to swap it for another. The difficulty in even getting hold of a 50 asph is what makes little slip-ups like this more annoying. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
michali Posted September 1, 2011 Share #94 Posted September 1, 2011 I am absolutely astounded at some of the comments/reactions and the odd bit of “frenzy” generated by this thread. Dare I say, I find that a few of the reactions and comments here are bordering on pathological! After all it’s two small blobs of smudged paint we’re talking about. I agree that one doesn’t expect this from Leica blah, blah, blah........all of it absolutely correct. But hang on a minute, it’s only two very small blobs of smudged paint, for f*#@s sake!!! A couple of years ago I bought a brand new 75mm Summicron, out of the box the lens hood came off in my hand as I tried to extend it. The locking ring had not been properly screwed into place. It was a question of either shipping it back to Solms or simply pushing the ring down and then twisting until it locked into place. I chose the latter course of action = problem quickly sorted out, no winging threads, no empirical conclusions on Leica’s quality control, no internet frenzy. In the time it would have taken to photograph it, post a thread and deal with comments, I had fixed it and was out there using the lens. As previously mentioned here, these objects/things are only little mechanical pieces of metal and glass assembled by humans. These humans sometimes screw up, as we all do. Does it really warrant all of this? The universe is not perfect, these things happen from time to time......deal with it and move on. I can’t believe that this thread has generated 92 comments and +2, 700 views, when I last checked! This alone says it all; IMO we’re all in a very sad, sad state of affairs here. We live in a world that is currently so screwed up at so many levels with so many millions of suffering people. This is especially true in Africa, where I live and work for a large part of the year. I’ve just returned from Africa having seen and done some amazing things and conversely having witnessed some horrific scenes of suffering. I come back to the Forum and “walk in” on this thread; I’m appalled! And yes I am trivializing Mark’s lens problem, but come on guys, let’s try and keep things in perspective.... Enough said, I’ll get off my soapbox now, but must say as I step down, that I really can’t take any of this seriously at all. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Fluff Posted September 1, 2011 Share #95 Posted September 1, 2011 I come back to the Forum and “walk in” on this thread; I’m appalled! I'm afraid if you apply your current perspective then this entire forum is pointless, as is most of everything that people in the 'civilised' society spend their lives doing. Which is not to say you're wrong....but then, you *are* hanging out in a Leica customer forum in a debate about quality control...... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnloumiles Posted September 1, 2011 Share #96 Posted September 1, 2011 I’ve just returned from Africa having seen and done some amazing things and conversely having witnessed some horrific scenes of suffering. I come back to the Forum and “walk in” on this thread; I’m appalled! And yes I am trivializing Mark’s lens problem, but come on guys, let’s try and keep things in perspective.... Enough said, I’ll get off my soapbox now, but must say as I step down, that I really can’t take any of this seriously at all. The funny thing is that your response is basically a replication in tone of what people have been going back and forth about in this thread, but its with your point of view which I gather is supposed to be right because you went to Africa? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
michali Posted September 1, 2011 Share #97 Posted September 1, 2011 The funny thing is that your response is basically a replication in tone of what people have been going back and forth about in this thread Sure, there's been a great deal of repetition of various points of view, as is always the case with these discussions. but its with your point of view which I gather is supposed to be right because you went to Africa? No not at all, it's got nothing at all to do with who's right or wrong, or because I've just come back from Africa. That's your take on it. I never said my point of view is right and that others are wrong. I've simply expressed my point of view on this... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnloumiles Posted September 1, 2011 Share #98 Posted September 1, 2011 I'm not trying to be an asshole I'm just pointing out the fact that your statement basically has the same rhetoric as the people you are railing against. Its everyone's right to express their opinion, but using some form of guilt compromise is what I found amusing. Anyway thats the last word I have to say about it, I should have just kept my mouth shut in the first place. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted September 2, 2011 Share #99 Posted September 2, 2011 What in Leica has changed since 1956 when Leica made about 125,000 lenses in one year? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted September 2, 2011 Share #100 Posted September 2, 2011 Umm....the production facility in Solms and workforce have shrunk by more than 60%? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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