janki Posted August 14, 2011 Share #21 Posted August 14, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) The girl is fine as she is. The best portraits are usually the ones where the face gets depth using shadows and contrasts. I think Erl expresses this in a straightforward manner. I completely agree with him! Technically it is very difficult to do something with this picture, but something can be changed. Why not give the girl a little more justice? Here is a clip of just her alone. It is in such cases one might wish for a Leica S2! Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/159157-ring-flash/?do=findComment&comment=1765400'>More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted August 14, 2011 Posted August 14, 2011 Hi janki, Take a look here Ring Flash. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Guest #12 Posted August 14, 2011 Share #22 Posted August 14, 2011 That is a novel concept, using a flash designed to produce shadowless light by surrounding the lens and thus putting the light in the optical axis, on a bracket:rolleyes:The ring flash was invented that way by a Mr. Dine for dental use as a flash around the lens. try the Wikipedia article that, for once, gets it completely right. As for softbox, in what way does the SFILL differ from for instance these? ... A real ring flash is usually attached with a bracket to hold it around the lens axis, to fit different size medium format cameras. The SFILL is not a softbox, it has no backside to reflect light. it's a piece of diffusing material held in front of the flash with some rubber bands. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted August 14, 2011 Share #23 Posted August 14, 2011 Wrong. It has reflecting metal foil on the rear flaps. And what does the method of fixing a flash around the lens do for the viewfinder:confused: And what has medium format to do with a 135 rangefinder:confused: Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leicashot Posted August 14, 2011 Share #24 Posted August 14, 2011 A real ring flash is usually attached with a bracket to hold it around the lens axis, to fit different size medium format cameras. The SFILL is not a softbox, it has no backside to reflect light. it's a piece of diffusing material held in front of the flash with some rubber bands. A softbox is a box surrounding a light with sides and diffusion so that there are no light leaks. Usually the light fires straight through it, requiring no backside - therefor the SFILL is a (mini) softbox. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leicashot Posted August 14, 2011 Share #25 Posted August 14, 2011 The girl is fine as she is. The best portraits are usually the ones where the face gets depth using shadows and contrasts. I think Erl expresses this in a straightforward manner. I completely agree with him! Technically it is very difficult to do something with this picture, but something can be changed. Why not give the girl a little more justice? Here is a clip of just her alone. It is in such cases one might wish for a Leica S2! This kind of shadow though is unflattering and the OP brought this up for that reason. There are different kinds of shadows that give shape and dimension to a face. This kind of shadow does not, and in such a situation, if the OP decides it is unflattering he now has the advice to do something about it, without creating a flat image with direct flash. Photography is mainly about correcting issues in the field, not relying on post processing to complete the job. The best 'photographers' are those who work in this way, and its a way that even in this day and age, we should all be striving to adhere to. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bocaburger Posted August 14, 2011 Share #26 Posted August 14, 2011 I remember seeing a huge ring flash mounted on a bracket attached to the tripod, where the camera (a Hasselblad) could rotate within the ring. In other words, the ring was larger than the camera, not just larger than the front lens diameter. In that sort of setup the Leica viewfinder would not be blocked. However it's a studio apparatus, not something an amateur photographer would carry around to shoot with a Leica. As for the SFILL, like almost everything else sold by that company, strictly IMHO, having seen and used one, it's way overpriced for what it is. I cut a piece of tissue paper to fit inside the wide-angle diffuser and the result was as effective as the SFILL. The reflectors and larger diffuser of the SFILL don't seem to accomplish more. A softbox is a box surrounding a light with sides and diffusion so that there are no light leaks. Usually the light fires straight through it, requiring no backside - therefor the SFILL is a (mini) softbox. The SFILL is open top and bottom. The LumiQuest Mini Sofbox is closed on all 4 sides (and costs half as much). You have to mount it upside down and high on the SF20/24 however, to not block the auto sensor. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest #12 Posted August 14, 2011 Share #27 Posted August 14, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) A softbox is a box surrounding a light with sides and diffusion so that there are no light leaks. Usually the light fires straight through it, requiring no backside - therefor the SFILL is a (mini) softbox. The SFILL leaks top, bottom, and backside; it comes with a little shade for the sensor. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted August 14, 2011 Share #28 Posted August 14, 2011 Err... Yes a color correction foil, which has nothing to do with the issue. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leicashot Posted August 14, 2011 Share #29 Posted August 14, 2011 I remember seeing a huge ring flash mounted on a bracket attached to the tripod, where the camera (a Hasselblad) could rotate within the ring. In other words, the ring was larger than the camera, not just larger than the front lens diameter. In that sort of setup the Leica viewfinder would not be blocked. However it's a studio apparatus, not something an amateur photographer would carry around to shoot with a Leica. As for the SFILL, like almost everything else sold by that company, strictly IMHO, having seen and used one, it's way overpriced for what it is. I cut a piece of tissue paper to fit inside the wide-angle diffuser and the result was as effective as the SFILL. The reflectors and larger diffuser of the SFILL don't seem to accomplish more. The SFILL is open top and bottom. The LumiQuest Mini Sofbox is closed on all 4 sides (and costs half as much). You have to mount it upside down and high on the SF20/24 however, to not block the auto sensor. I see and stand corrected (never used one) though a softbox doesn't require a backside unless it's a softbox like those where the head shoots backwards into the reflected sides and is then passed through the diffusion material. Those aren't the typical softboxes but more effective for softening, which is not always so desired. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leicashot Posted August 14, 2011 Share #30 Posted August 14, 2011 Err... Yes a color correction foil, which has nothing to do with the issue. Color correction has a lot to do with the issue, because to use any light in an environment it is best to match the added light to the ambient light for a more natural look. Throwing daylight at tungsten isn't a good mix. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest #12 Posted August 14, 2011 Share #31 Posted August 14, 2011 ...And what does the method of fixing a flash around the lens do for the viewfinder:confused: And what has medium format to do with a 135 rangefinder:confused: The step-down ring is blocking the focusing patch; you will have to buy a bracket and figure some way to attach a small ring flash, or buy a real ring flash which comes with a bracket anyway. ...The ring flash was invented that way by a Mr. Dine for dental use as a flash around the lens.try the Wikipedia article that, for once, gets it completely right. ... This is rubbish; it's lifted from ad copy from the co. that sells "Dine" flashes. The ringflash was not invented by Dine, or for dentistry, or in 1952. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest #12 Posted August 14, 2011 Share #32 Posted August 14, 2011 Err... Yes a color correction foil, which has nothing to do with the issue. Not that...it comes with a black rubber shade you glue on above the sensor. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted August 14, 2011 Share #33 Posted August 14, 2011 Which you can throw in the bin for the M8/9 as they do not use the sensor, but MTTL Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stanjan0 Posted August 14, 2011 Share #34 Posted August 14, 2011 Guys guys, please already I thank you all for your comments, I thank Jaap for his retouched image of my Granddaughter and if I'm in that situation again I will try a bounce flash in a few ways. Again thank you all for contributing to solving my problem. :) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted August 14, 2011 Share #35 Posted August 14, 2011 This is a perfectly simple thread. The question was: " is there a ringflash that is suitable for the M9?" My answer was:" No, as a ringflash will, by definition, block the viewfinder" End of story, and all other irrelevant details have failed to turn up one ringflash that does not block the viewfinder, so my answer stands. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest #12 Posted August 15, 2011 Share #36 Posted August 15, 2011 This is a perfectly simple thread. The question was: " is there a ringflash that is suitable for the M9?" My answer was:" No, as a ringflash will, by definition, block the viewfinder" End of story, and all other irrelevant details have failed to turn up one ringflash that does not block the viewfinder, so my answer stands. well I guess you'll just have to use your softbox Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
erl Posted August 15, 2011 Share #37 Posted August 15, 2011 As a boy, I remember beating the bush to drive out rabbits for the dogs to catch. Always, there were more rabbits than anticipated. I don't know why I am suddenly thinking of that childhood experience? The OP has a variety of suggestions to answer his direct question. Some responses, mine included, offered 'alternative' solutions. Reading between the lines ( a favourite vice of mine), I suspect the environment and situation that existed (eating in a restaurant?) is not totally conductive to carting around exotic flash gear. The objective in hand is to get 'good candid' pics of people eg. grandaughter. I would recommend as an alternative procedure, to use a longer lens and/or change the viewing angle to possibly improve the lighting direction. This would cut to the subject and eliminate extraneous background. OK, I am totally altering the scenario, I know. My point is that improvement in the image is desired, you need to work at it, not tinker around the edges with a bit of flash and then go on eating. Yes, I am a pain to eat out with. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stanjan0 Posted August 15, 2011 Share #38 Posted August 15, 2011 Erl, very shortly my wife and I are taking a 70 day cruise and one of the ports we stop in is where your from. I would be delighted to eat Kangaroo with you and capture your image eating 'roo with me and my wife. I'll PM you with the details soon. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bocaburger Posted August 15, 2011 Share #39 Posted August 15, 2011 Which you can throw in the bin for the M8/9 as they do not use the sensor, but MTTL I use auto sensor mode with the M9 (and before on the M8, M7 and M6TTL) because I find it gives more reliable exposures and doesn't have the lag time of MTTL pre-flash. This is rubbish; it's lifted from ad copy from the co. that sells "Dine" flashes. The ringflash was not invented by Dine, or for dentistry, or in 1952. Lester Dine's company (owned now by his grandson) is 20 minutes from me. Lester did invent the ring flash. There were other macro flashes before then (Nikon had one in the sixties) but they were comprised of four straight tubes mounted around the lens. Dine's was the first to use a circular flash tube. 1952 was just when he started his company, and he didn't do it specifically for dentistry (which at the time was mostly still drill-fill-pull), he invented it for medical photography in general, but eventually found his greatest market in dentists and dermatologists. Read their corporate ad copy for comprehension and you will see. Lester A. Dine Inc. is the original inventor of the Ring Flash and has served the clinical photography market since 1952. Our company is now in its 3rd Generation of Dine family ownership. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted August 15, 2011 Share #40 Posted August 15, 2011 I use auto sensor mode with the M9 (and before on the M8, M7 and M6TTL) because I find it gives more reliable exposures and doesn't have the lag time of MTTL pre-flash. In that case you will need to stick the little piece of foam above the sensor to avoid it being confused by stray light from the SFILL. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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