Peter H Posted July 25, 2011 Share #1 Posted July 25, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) I want to say thank you to all of you who were so helpful in digging me out of the black hole I'd created for myself. What a nice lot you are. Having gone right back to the basics, I'm now happily able to print with colours that perfectly match what I can see on my monitor. And that's using the Epson supplied profiles, which were not working for me previously. I was always able to find a match eventually, but it was by trial and error, was time-consuming and frustrating, and not reliably repeatable, and worst of all, I knew I wasn't properly in control of the process, despite getting results that everyone else loved. I think my big mistake was in simply having too many mismatches between settings because somehow I'd contrived not to understand their impact and also the need for identical matches. Anyway, this all works nicely now on standard Premium Gloss paper, printing through PS or LR. I shall next move on to C1, and then other papers. Don't be surprised if I'm back again, but I think that having finally understood the principles, I should now be able to apply them to different media and software. We'll see. But I intend to take Andy's advice and keep to the same settings and only alter the profile to match the paper as necessary. And please forgive me for repeating myself, but I honestly cannot thank you enough for your wisdom, patience and willingness to put yourselves out to be helpful. You know who you are! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted July 25, 2011 Posted July 25, 2011 Hi Peter H, Take a look here Colour Calibration Update. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Peter H Posted July 25, 2011 Author Share #2 Posted July 25, 2011 I want to say thank you to all of you who were so helpful in digging me out of the black hole I'd created for myself. What a nice lot you are. Having gone right back to the basics, I'm now happily able to print with colours that perfectly match what I can see on my monitor. And that's using the Epson supplied profiles, which were not working for me previously. I was always able to find a match eventually, but it was by trial and error, was time-consuming and frustrating, and not reliably repeatable, and worst of all, I knew I wasn't properly in control of the process, despite getting results that everyone else loved. I think my big mistake was in simply having too many mismatches between settings because somehow I'd contrived not to understand their impact and also the need for identical matches. Anyway, this all works nicely now on standard Premium Gloss paper, printing through PS or LR. I shall next move on to C1, and then other papers. Don't be surprised if I'm back again, but I think that having finally understood the principles, I should now be able to apply them to different media and software. We'll see. But I intend to take Andy's advice and keep to the same settings and only alter the profile to match the paper as necessary. And please forgive me for repeating myself, but I honestly cannot thank you enough for your wisdom, patience and willingness to put yourselves out to be helpful. You know who you are! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leica dream Posted July 28, 2011 Share #3 Posted July 28, 2011 Wow, Peter, this is a problem I have been struggling with for a long time and not solved. I have just read your original thread again for more input. However, earlier this year I went on a 12 week photography course with a local professional, and he is running a session on Colour Management in a couple of weeks so I am booked in for that. This is a truly frustrating problem which I hope to get to the bottom of on my course. I find it is usually easier to follow "face to face" so shall try to digest your thread as background before my session. I am sure it is all to do with fundamental understanding rather than parrot fashion. I use Epson Premium Glossy paper on my Epson Stylus Photo R800 printer. I'll feed back how I get on, but I do hope I am as euphoric as you at the end result. I forgot to metion that I use a Syder 3 Express for my screen, but there is no facility to check printed colour output too. Maybe I have the wrong device for absolute precision. Richard Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leica dream Posted July 28, 2011 Share #4 Posted July 28, 2011 I forgot to mention that I use a Spyder 3 Express for my screen, but there is no facility to match printed output. Perhaps I have an inadequate tool. Richard Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
delander † Posted July 28, 2011 Share #5 Posted July 28, 2011 The idea is that by using a color management system and the correct profiles for the screen and the printer/paper combo you will get a good match, screen to print. So your Spyder Express as long as it can make correct monitor profile should be fine. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
t024484 Posted July 29, 2011 Share #6 Posted July 29, 2011 I forgot to mention that I use a Spyder 3 Express for my screen, but there is no facility to match printed output. Perhaps I have an inadequate tool.Richard Fact is that fotoprinters are way more accurate than screens in respresenting colors. So when you start calibrating to get a better match between screen and printer, the most effectice step is to start with the screen. You made the right decision. Hans Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leica dream Posted July 29, 2011 Share #7 Posted July 29, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) OK, now I am being really thick. I downloaded the printer profile for my R800 from the Epson website yesterday. It then unzipped three files. Now I cannot find the files and do not know what to do next. Will the printer just pick up the profile or must I do some sort of link? Richard Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wda Posted July 29, 2011 Share #8 Posted July 29, 2011 Richard, check your list of recent Downloads; double-click to open the zipped file and then move the profile to the recommended Photoshop profile folder. (I can't remember it off-hand, but a quick search in PS Help will point you in the right direction). PS expects the profiles to be in that folder and will show as an option when setting up your printer screen. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
delander † Posted July 29, 2011 Share #9 Posted July 29, 2011 Actually the profiles should be stored in a Windows or Mac folder so they are available to all color aware software. I'm on a mac now but if I remember in Windows you can right click on the profile file and then choose Install profile (or similar). On the mac place the profiles in Library / ColorSync / Profiles Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter H Posted August 7, 2011 Author Share #10 Posted August 7, 2011 Wow, Peter, this is a problem I have been struggling with for a long time and not solved. I have just read your original thread again for more input.However, earlier this year I went on a 12 week photography course with a local professional, and he is running a session on Colour Management in a couple of weeks so I am booked in for that. This is a truly frustrating problem which I hope to get to the bottom of on my course. I find it is usually easier to follow "face to face" so shall try to digest your thread as background before my session. I am sure it is all to do with fundamental understanding rather than parrot fashion. I use Epson Premium Glossy paper on my Epson Stylus Photo R800 printer. I'll feed back how I get on, but I do hope I am as euphoric as you at the end result. I forgot to metion that I use a Syder 3 Express for my screen, but there is no facility to check printed colour output too. Maybe I have the wrong device for absolute precision. Richard Hi Richard, sorry it took me a long while to respond. I'd be really interested to hear about how you got on on the course. Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leica dream Posted August 14, 2011 Share #11 Posted August 14, 2011 Peter, the Colour Management course was last Friday and really - I mean really, stimulating. Originally I booked just the morning session which was "Colour Management" and I thought that would answer my prayers by dealing with my screen. The afternoon session was billed as "getting the most out of your printer and different media", which I thought sounded a bit gimmicky. On the day, after being so fired up in the morning I was allowed to stay for the afternoon which was all about profiling printers very precisely for different inks and different paper surfaces from different manufacturers. The professional had a really up market "i1" monitor calibration and printer profiling tool which we used to match individual screen colours to chosen printers, inks and media. After doing the monitor calibration we used the software to produce colour patterns on the chosen medium. Two options - either a basic colour grid on a single A4, or very much more precise grid on two A4s. Then using the calibrator again we scanned those two pages of grids of colour and the software gave us a profile for what we had used. I have to say that the before and after results were stunningly dramatic. Only having a desktop I thought the session would be theory with practice on HIS equipment but did not realise that we should take our equipment with us for hands on our own - the other 6 "students" had taken their laptops and printers. I assisted and learned. For me, it was well worth £75 for such detailed and well explained instruction. I shall not lose out though, because as a previous student the Professional has said I can take my equipment to his studio and get my calibration sorted out properly. I shall do this as soon as he has some time - I shall take my Epson V700 scanner too so that I get everything matching. There are cheaper versions of the profilers at £300 ish, so whether I invest in one myself remains to be seen. If I can get my basic materials profiled for free when I have my next session, I may not need anything other than an occasional monitor calibration which I have my Spider for already. My session was as part of his Summer School events, but if you get the chance for such education my advice would be to go for it. You will not regret gaining such knowledge by understanding the WHY as well as the HOW. Richard Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter H Posted August 14, 2011 Author Share #12 Posted August 14, 2011 Thanks a lot for the write-up Richard. I'm pleased it was such a productive course. I'm suffering from a bit of calibration-fatigue at the moment,though It does sound interesting to me, and he sounds like a very helpful and useful person to know. And I know I still have a great deal to learn. How can I get some details on his courses? Does he have a website? Thanks again. Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leica dream Posted August 15, 2011 Share #13 Posted August 15, 2011 Probably no good for you, Peter, because I think you are in Scotland ----- and I am in Newark-on-Trent, Notts. Anyway, the website is GoPhotography : Photographer of Portraits, Groups, Animals, Pets, Architecture, Corporate, Events, Commercial, Photograph repairs, Photoshop training, advertising banners Nottinghamshire Richard Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leica dream Posted August 15, 2011 Share #14 Posted August 15, 2011 Peter Take a look at Spyder 3 print SR review where there is a very full description and assessment of a cheaper device and process used. Richard Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter H Posted August 15, 2011 Author Share #15 Posted August 15, 2011 Thanks for the links Richard. You're right - I'm about 500 miles from Newark, so not an easy day out for me! I'm not sure how different the Spyder is from the ColorMunki I use, but I'm going to look into it carefully, because I'd really like to be able to experiment with a range of papers, and even consider changing my printer, and have some confidence that I can be in control of things! Thanks again. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leica dream Posted August 16, 2011 Share #16 Posted August 16, 2011 I am sure that all the devices are much the same, Peter, but obviously the professionals need the very high spec versions. The likes of you and I probably let the £££££ sway our choices. Richard Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leica dream Posted August 22, 2011 Share #17 Posted August 22, 2011 Well, I lugged my desk top and bits and pieces in to my professional at the end of last week to get set up. The excellent news was that his upmarket device could not find any fault with my monitor which I had calibrated with my Spyder3. The even more excellent news was that I now have a profile for my epson printer, inks and regular paper which now produces printed results which I could not have anticipated - quite superb. The down side is that beforehand I took the trouble to clean my printer heads and do nozzel alignments which really soaked up the inks, but it was worth it for such spectacular results. Richard Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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